2019 Hall of Fame finalists

[Joel_Stewart]

[/size]
I want to be nice but this list seems very weak. Discuss.



Susie Berning Jim Ferrier Retief Goosen Beverly Hanson Peggy Kirk Bell Catherine Lacoste Graham Marsh Sandra Palmer Corey Pavin Billy Payne Calvin Peete Dottie Pepper Jan Stephenson Hal Sutton Dennis Walters[/color]

[Pete_Pittock]

Broken down into categories:
Male Competitor (4)
Retief Goosen, South Africa
 Graham Marsh, Australia
 Corey Pavin, United States
 Hal Sutton, United States

Female Competitor (5)
 Susie Maxwell Berning, United States
 Beverly Hanson, United States
 Sandra Palmer, United States
 Dottie Pepper, United States
 Jan Stephenson, Australia

Lifetime Achievement (3)
 Peggy Kirk Bell, United States
 Billy Payne, United States
 Dennis Walters, United States

Veterans (3)
 Jim Ferrier, Australia 32 wins worldwide, including 18 on PGA Tour. Majors: 1947 PGA

 Catherine Lacoste, France
 Calvin Peete, United States 14 wins worldwide, 12 on PGA Tour, one Vardon trophy, driving accuracy leader 10 straight years
  (that would have helped in the Ryder Cup)

[Ronald Montesano]

It is weak, if one uses all-time greatness as a measuring stick.


Who is not in the HOF, that is an obvious oversight? (sort of like Larry Nelson and Sandy Lyle for ... you know ...RC Captain.)

[Matt_Cohn]

The women's list is fairly strong. Not all-time greats, but 15+ wins and multiple majors is significant. The men's list isn't great. Maybe Retief? I'm not sure wha the standard is these days, but Pavin's 15 wins and one major don't quite do it for me.

[Pat Burke]

Personally, Dennis Walters is the only one I’d consider voting for if I had a vote

[JLahrman]

The women's list is fairly strong. Not all-time greats, but 15+ wins and multiple majors is significant. The men's list isn't great. Maybe Retief? I'm not sure wha the standard is these days, but Pavin's 15 wins and one major don't quite do it for me.

You mean like Fred Couples' 15 PGA Tour wins and one major?


Although to be fair, Couples has won far more on the Champions Tour. As well as about 17 Skins Game titles.

[Sven Nilsen]

Who is not in the HOF, that is an obvious oversight?

Tom Bendelow

[Garland Bayley]

It seems to me that Calvin Peete is the most deserving as a groundbreaker.

Jan Stephenson to a certain extent put LPGA on map.

Can't overlook Goosen's 2 open championships.

[John Blain]

The women's list is fairly strong. Not all-time greats, but 15+ wins and multiple majors is significant. The men's list isn't great. Maybe Retief? I'm not sure wha the standard is these days, but Pavin's 15 wins and one major don't quite do it for me.

You mean like Fred Couples' 15 PGA Tour wins and one major?


Although to be fair, Couples has won far more on the Champions Tour. As well as about 17 Skins Game titles.

Please tell me you're kidding about Couples' Skins Game titles with regards to the HOF. Seriously? Couples' credentials were marginal at best and he significantly lowered the bar.

[Mike_Clayton]

Matt,


Given it's the WORLD Golf Hall of Fame does Pavin get any credit for winning the South African PGA, the German Open, New Zealand Open x 2, twice in Japan and the World Match Play at Wentworth?
I think he should.

[JLahrman]

The women's list is fairly strong. Not all-time greats, but 15+ wins and multiple majors is significant. The men's list isn't great. Maybe Retief? I'm not sure wha the standard is these days, but Pavin's 15 wins and one major don't quite do it for me.

You mean like Fred Couples' 15 PGA Tour wins and one major?


Although to be fair, Couples has won far more on the Champions Tour. As well as about 17 Skins Game titles.

Please tell me you're kidding about Couples' Skins Game titles with regards to the HOF. Seriously? Couples' credentials were marginal at best and he significantly lowered the bar.

Of course I'm joking. When I looked up their career stats, I noticed despite having the same number of PGA Tour wins and majors, Couples has 62 professional wins while Pavin has only 28 so maybe Couples could claim to have a stronger resume. Then I noticed that although Couples has 13 Champions Tour wins to Pavin's 1, the bulk of the difference is a bunch of silly season events.

But it's not like he voted himself into the Hall of Fame either; the voters lowered the bar, not him.

[David McIntosh]

I thought the men’s minimum criteria was 15 tour wins and two majors or Players Championships, which Pavin doesn’t meet.

Fred does meet the qualification due to his ‘Couple’ of TPC wins along with his Masters victory so it could be argued that he had the stronger career of the two. Similar to Davis Love III who also won one major and two TPCs but had 21 PGA Tour wins and was inducted last year.

[Pete_Pittock]

It seems to me that Calvin Peete is the most deserving as a groundbreaker.

Jan Stephenson to a certain extent put LPGA on map.

Can't overlook Goosen's 2 open championships.

Charlie Sifford was the groundbreaker.

[JLahrman]

I thought the men’s minimum criteria was 15 tour wins and two majors or Players Championships, which Pavin doesn’t meet.

Fred does meet the qualification due to his ‘Couple’ of TPC wins along with his Masters victory so it could be argued that he had the stronger career of the two. Similar to Davis Love III who also won one major and two TPCs but had 21 PGA Tour wins and was inducted last year.

If you took bets from the average golf fan on who had more PGA Tour wins, Couples or Love, you could probably make yourself some pocket change.

[Mike_Young]

Ask yourself about HOF's in any sport or profession and it often gets tot he point where they run out of suitable candidates and start to figure how to bring in inductees that will bring in the most ticket sales for banquets or advertising etc. Many HOF's have closed.   At the risk of Jeff B thinking I'm an angry odl white dude this is much like associations.  The HOF's often just try to figure how to survive...

[Kalen Braley]

David,


Its an OR, not an AND.


"A player must have a cumulative total of 15 or more official victories on any of the original members of the International Federation of PGA Tours (PGA TOUR, European Tour, Japan Golf Tour, Sunshine Tour, Asian Tour and PGA of Australasia) OR at least two victories among the following events: The Masters, THE PLAYERS Championship, the U.S. Open, The Open Championship and the PGA Championship."

[David McIntosh]

David,


Its an OR, not an AND.


"A player must have a cumulative total of 15 or more official victories on any of the original members of the International Federation of PGA Tours (PGA TOUR, European Tour, Japan Golf Tour, Sunshine Tour, Asian Tour and PGA of Australasia) OR at least two victories among the following events: The Masters, THE PLAYERS Championship, the U.S. Open, The Open Championship and the PGA Championship."

Thanks Kalen, I stand corrected and Pavin clearly does qualify!

It’s interesting to see the list of other guys who have won more than 15 times but have less than 2 majors/TPCs (such as Dustin Johnson, Furyk, Wadkins, Kite, Weiskopf) vs those with 2+ majors/Players but less than 15 wins (such as Zach Johnson, Bubba Watson, Payne Stewart, Lee Janzen, Daly, Elkington to name some of the more recent players and omitting guys very early into their careers like Koepka, Spieth etc) - all of whom meet the criteria for the HoF.

[Kalen Braley]

Interesting David.  Here's how I would put them if they got hit by a truck tommorow:


In:
Bubba - 2 Majors, 14 wins
Payne - 3 Majors, 12 wins ** Edit: He's already in**
Koepka - 3 Majors, 8 wins - (If you win 3 majors, you gotta be in..)
Spieth - 3 Majors, 13 wins


Bubble:
Zach Johnson - 2 Majors, 12 wins
Janzen - 2 Majors, 8 wins
Daly - 2 majors, 9 wins


Out:
Elkington - 1 Major, 12 wins

[Mark Pritchett]

It is called the Hall of "Fame" not the Hall of "Accomplishments".

[Kalen Braley]

It is called the Hall of "Fame" not the Hall of "Accomplishments".

Bryson DeChambeau has plenty of fame for being a douche-canoe.  Should he get in for that?


Of course it should be accomplishment based, even if the name is a misnomer....

[Rich Goodale]

Any golf of "Fame" that does not acknowledge John Daley is a golf of "Shame."  IMVHO.