[Tim Leahy]

Tiger did NOT kneel for the National Anthem! USA! USA! USA wins 21 to 7 in a REAL football score.

[Rich Goodale]

I predict that the EuroYobbos will continue to take golf "fandom" to greater and greater classless depths, starting with the opening match this morning.


Oh look, Patrick Reid has hit his second shot into the water.  Massive cheers from the "fans."  Sickening.....

[Mark Pearce]

Rich,


You know, do you, that Reed was positively encouraging the boos last night in the opening ceremony.  He's enjoying it and encouraging it.  Other Americans aren't and aren't getting the same response.

[Niall C]

You’ve got to hand it to Thomas Bjorn, when he sent me an email a couple of weeks ago asking me to question Henrik and Sergio’s places in the team, he knew that as the two of them were keen readers of GCA that they would read this thread, take on board the comments and rise to the challenge. An astonishing bit of captaincy when you think about it.

Niall (ever so slightly tongue in cheek)

[George Pazin]

When I posted earlier I thought that Phil would sit two matches. I was looking at both two-balls. The state of a specific player's game is more critical in a two-ball match than a four ball match. If a player is "off" in a two-ball the match is likely to be lost (unless the opposition obliges with equal poor play), whereas in a four ball, the player's partner can carry the side with superb play.
IMO playing Mickelson in two-ball matches would lead to a 2-0 European lead.

Scary accurate on this one, Pete!

[Jeff Schley]

You’ve got to hand it to Thomas Bjorn, when he sent me an email a couple of weeks ago asking me to question Henrik and Sergio’s places in the team, he knew that as the two of them were keen readers of GCA that they would read this thread, take on board the comments and rise to the challenge. An astonishing bit of captaincy when you think about it.

Niall (ever so slightly tongue in cheek)

Niall stop helping the Euros or we will never win again!

[Adam Lawrence]

You’ve got to hand it to Thomas Bjorn, when he sent me an email a couple of weeks ago asking me to question Henrik and Sergio’s places in the team, he knew that as the two of them were keen readers of GCA that they would read this thread, take on board the comments and rise to the challenge. An astonishing bit of captaincy when you think about it.

Niall (ever so slightly tongue in cheek)

Niall stop helping the Euros or we will never win again!

Jeff, you should be aware that Niall is Scottish

[George Pazin]

I'm just curious here: did anyone happen to see Finau putting for birdie late in the round - I think 16, maybe 15 or 17 - and the crowd started booing pretty loudly. They then booed again after he buried it. Was anyone watching and saw something happen? Tony is so mild mannered, I can't imagine he elicited the boos.

[Kalen Braley]

I'm just curious here: did anyone happen to see Finau putting for birdie late in the round - I think 16, maybe 15 or 17 - and the crowd started booing pretty loudly. They then booed again after he buried it. Was anyone watching and saw something happen? Tony is so mild mannered, I can't imagine he elicited the boos.

George,


Clearly you must be mistaken.  Only the American fans engage in this type of boorish behavoir! 


P.S.  I've yet to see any of it, but look forward to seeing the highlights later.

[BCrosby]

George -


Finau's approach shot was miss-hit, bounded off the top of a pylon to about eight feet from the pin.

So I assume they were booing because after his crazy good luck, Finau did not have the decency to miss his short putt. 

[size=78%]  [/size]

[Mark Pearce]

George -


Finau's approach shot was miss-hit, bounded off the top of a pylon to about eight feet from the pin.

So I assume they were booing because after his crazy good luck, Finau did not have the decency to miss his short putt. 

[size=78%]  [/size]

Possibly the single luckiest thing I have ever seen.  He chunked his approach.  If it's an inch right, it's in the water.  An inch left, it's in the crap 20 yards short of the green.  It lands dead on the wooden bulwark and bounces to 8 feet.  Bonkers.  And that really wasn't booing.  Some here (my good friend Rich Goodale amongst them) are trying to find misfeasance where it doesn't exist.  We did get a mashed potato shout, though, so things aren't all that great.

[Sean_A]

I was shocked Phil played 4somes.  He doesn't drive the ball well enough for that format on that course. 

Tiger is at it again...a lifeless performance in which he displayed zero joy. 

Finau was very lucky, but at least he took advantage of the luck.  Why Rosie went for the flag on 18 is a mystery.  Tough shot to pull off in a self imposed do or die situation. 

Poulter got a point yesterday, but he looked very average. 

The course...it is what it is...and I think it does very well for what it was designed to do.  That double island green (15 & 18?)...wouldn't it be cool if the 15th green extended to between the rear mounds?

The cheers for bad shots have been going on for several Ryder Cups now.  The Ryder Cup is a different animal which can't be put back into the cage.  The goal really should be to not tolerate that crap for the real events.

I would hate to play this course, but I have to admit this week is another aspect of bifurcation which should exist.  There is no point in giving these guys room to swing away unless it can be guanteed the course will be f&f and windy on at least a few days of a tourny.  Plus, we get the extra advantage of there being courses for the pros and courses for everybody else...which is perfect if we hope to preserve classic courses.  It really comes down to a choice of a birdie fest or hack out fest.  There is little gound between the two extremes where the pros are concerned because few courses can really challenge these guys without classic US Open setups.  And if a course is that good, do we really want to risk it being mucked up to host pros? Courses for markets is important and it is as critical to distinguish the low capper market from the pros just as it high cappers to low cappers.

Ciao

[Rich Goodale]

It's not the boos, Mark et. al., it's the Hurrahs and Hoorays when the USA hits a bad shot.  For an example, Ricky Fowler's tee shot on #1 a few minutes ago which he hit long into the water.  Massive cheers.  Not very classy, IMHO.


Rich

[Ally Mcintosh]

Have to agree with Rich, even if quite a lot of it is pantomime cheering / booing.


Sean, as for bifurcation, I was thinking the same thing but would it really help us? If the pro’s stopped playing the classic courses, then we’d stop building them eventually. Because in this ultra-commercial world, everyone wants to copy what the pro’s do. Other than a few thousand GCA nerds who would try and keep the flame alight, another 40 years and every new course would look like Le Golf National

[Sean_A]

Have to agree with Rich, even if quite a lot of it is pantomime cheering / booing.


Sean, as for bifurcation, I was thinking the same thing but would it really help us? If the pro’s stopped playing the classic courses, then we’d stop building them eventually. Because in this ultra-commercial world, everyone wants to copy what the pro’s do. Other than a few thousand GCA nerds who would try and keep the flame alight, another 40 years and every new course would look like Le Golf National

There have been plenty Le Golf's and Celtic Manors built, but the current mini trend is for wide, short or small footprint golf....much more akin to classic golf than what was being built in the in 70s-90.  I see there is already a backlash kicking up, but I don't think those backlashers have a clue that what they ask for and what they get will be worlds apart.  The instinct will always be to build narrow to save on maintenance and water.  So clever archies will need to figure out ways to fight that because we already have far more than enough courses for the pros.  I hope archie cleverness will lead to shorter courses and overall smaller footprint properties....maybe even weird number of holes courses.  Basically, more of a focus on higher cappers.  I think if done well, many lower cap folks will see how good and challenging these courses can be.

I know doak gets some stick for building flashy golf which relies on sand to make it work, but none of the top tier archies have been as daring as Doak.  So long as this current crop remain employed and train the next generation, I think golf design hasn't looked better in 85 years. 

Ciao

[Tim Leahy]

It's not the boos, Mark et. al., it's the Hurrahs and Hoorays when the USA hits a bad shot.  For an example, Ricky Fowler's tee shot on #1 a few minutes ago which he hit long into the water.  Massive cheers.  Not very classy, IMHO.


Rich

Hopefully American golf fans remember this for the next Rider Cup in tbe USA. Payback is a bitch.

[Ally Mcintosh]

I get that part Sean.


What I’m saying is that public perception drives the developers drives the architects.


If we don’t see pro’s playing the kind of courses we like, within a generation we might not see them being built.

[Niall C]

George -


Finau's approach shot was miss-hit, bounded off the top of a pylon to about eight feet from the pin.

So I assume they were booing because after his crazy good luck, Finau did not have the decency to miss his short putt. 

[size=78%]  [/size]

Possibly the single luckiest thing I have ever seen.  He chunked his approach.  If it's an inch right, it's in the water.  An inch left, it's in the crap 20 yards short of the green.  It lands dead on the wooden bulwark and bounces to 8 feet.  Bonkers.  And that really wasn't booing.  Some here (my good friend Rich Goodale amongst them) are trying to find misfeasance where it doesn't exist.  We did get a mashed potato shout, though, so things aren't all that great.

Mark

I'm going to disagree. He hit a good shot bang on line. He possibly was half a club short from perfect. Yes he could have bounced off into the water but equally if his ball had landed 6 inches to the left he would have been fine.

With regards to the booing, I only saw the highlights and it sounded like booing to me although it could well have been good natured. Whatever, they at least had the decency to be quiet when he was putting.

Niall

[Niall C]

It's not the boos, Mark et. al., it's the Hurrahs and Hoorays when the USA hits a bad shot.  For an example, Ricky Fowler's tee shot on #1 a few minutes ago which he hit long into the water.  Massive cheers.  Not very classy, IMHO.


Rich

Hopefully American golf fans remember this for the next Rider Cup in tbe USA. Payback is a bitch.

Tim

No need to remember. This type of behaviour is already ingrained in both sets of fans. As Sean say, RC is a different event altogether and there is no going back now. However I hope the players remember where it all comes from the next time they are playing a regular event and some numpty shouts at the top of their backswing.

Niall

[Niall C]

I was shocked Phil played 4somes.  He doesn't drive the ball well enough for that format on that course. 

Tiger is at it again...a lifeless performance in which he displayed zero joy. 

Finau was very lucky, but at least he took advantage of the luck.  Why Rosie went for the flag on 18 is a mystery.  Tough shot to pull off in a self imposed do or die situation. 

Poulter got a point yesterday, but he looked very average. 

The course...it is what it is...and I think it does very well for what it was designed to do.  That double island green (15 & 18?)...wouldn't it be cool if the 15th green extended to between the rear mounds?

The cheers for bad shots have been going on for several Ryder Cups now.  The Ryder Cup is a different animal which can't be put back into the cage.  The goal really should be to not tolerate that crap for the real events.

I would hate to play this course, but I have to admit this week is another aspect of bifurcation which should exist.  There is no point in giving these guys room to swing away unless it can be guanteed the course will be f&f and windy on at least a few days of a tourny.  Plus, we get the extra advantage of there being courses for the pros and courses for everybody else...which is perfect if we hope to preserve classic courses.  It really comes down to a choice of a birdie fest or hack out fest.  There is little gound between the two extremes where the pros are concerned because few courses can really challenge these guys without classic US Open setups.  And if a course is that good, do we really want to risk it being mucked up to host pros? Courses for markets is important and it is as critical to distinguish the low capper market from the pros just as it high cappers to low cappers.

Ciao

Sean

A near faultless bit of observation. The only point on which we diverge (ironically) is on bifurcation. As a traditionalist, I just hate the idea of different sets of rules and courses for amateurs and pros. I'm quite happy that courses like this one exist, and that they have the kind of set up it has, its a big world after all and all the better for variety, but why restrict particular courses to certain qualities of player ?

Niall

[JJShanley]

It's not the boos, Mark et. al., it's the Hurrahs and Hoorays when the USA hits a bad shot.  For an example, Ricky Fowler's tee shot on #1 a few minutes ago which he hit long into the water.  Massive cheers.  Not very classy, IMHO.


Rich

Hopefully American golf fans remember this for the next Rider Cup in tbe USA. Payback is a bitch.

Hope next time y'all perform better than Team USA's current impersonation of Ann Arbor Community College when it had the privilege of visiting South Bend in 2014 and 2018.

[George Pazin]

George -


Finau's approach shot was miss-hit, bounded off the top of a pylon to about eight feet from the pin.

So I assume they were booing because after his crazy good luck, Finau did not have the decency to miss his short putt. 

[size=78%]  [/size]

Possibly the single luckiest thing I have ever seen.  He chunked his approach.  If it's an inch right, it's in the water.  An inch left, it's in the crap 20 yards short of the green.  It lands dead on the wooden bulwark and bounces to 8 feet.  Bonkers.  And that really wasn't booing.  Some here (my good friend Rich Goodale amongst them) are trying to find misfeasance where it doesn't exist.  We did get a mashed potato shout, though, so things aren't all that great.

Mark

I'm going to disagree. He hit a good shot bang on line. He possibly was half a club short from perfect. Yes he could have bounced off into the water but equally if his ball had landed 6 inches to the left he would have been fine.

With regards to the booing, I only saw the highlights and it sounded like booing to me although it could well have been good natured. Whatever, they at least had the decency to be quiet when he was putting.

Niall

I'm going to have to agree with Niall. I did see the shot, but I've never seen anyone booed like that, and that was booing. I thought perhaps some bozo in the crowd was doing something to elicit the boos and that maybe I missed that, or that I missed something else. They were quiet while he putted, but resumed the boos after he buried it.


I have heard plenty of yells from voices that didn't exactly sound French....


Rory was berating and gesturing rather angrily at the crowd after the last hole, so obviously there's someone there he doesn't care for and I'm guessing they weren't Euro fans. But I kinda like seeing him fiery like that. The Rory v Reed singles match at Hazeltine was electrifying, to me anyway.


I usually just root for close RCs. I hate the blowouts, they aren't interesting to me.

[Thomas Dai]

Bubba’s choice of footwear! Yikes! Reminds me of Ben’s last day shirts and Hal’s hat.
Atb

[Mark Pearce]

It's not the boos, Mark et. al., it's the Hurrahs and Hoorays when the USA hits a bad shot.  For an example, Ricky Fowler's tee shot on #1 a few minutes ago which he hit long into the water.  Massive cheers.  Not very classy, IMHO.


Rich

Hopefully American golf fans remember this for the next Rider Cup in tbe USA. Payback is a bitch.

That's a joke, right?  As Sean says, that crap has been going on for years in the RC.  At least no-one has been calling out during shots, giving personal insults (so far as we have heard) or even moved a player's ball.  Since we hear that the US TV coverage is dreadful, go and find a video of Hazeltine and remind yourself how the US crowd reacts to a bad European shot.  To suggest this cheering of bad shots is new or unique to European crowds is almost comically absurd.

[George Pazin]

It's not the boos, Mark et. al., it's the Hurrahs and Hoorays when the USA hits a bad shot.  For an example, Ricky Fowler's tee shot on #1 a few minutes ago which he hit long into the water.  Massive cheers.  Not very classy, IMHO.


Rich

Hopefully American golf fans remember this for the next Rider Cup in tbe USA. Payback is a bitch.

That's a joke, right?  As Sean says, that crap has been going on for years in the RC.  At least no-one has been calling out during shots, giving personal insults (so far as we have heard) or even moved a player's ball.  Since we hear that the US TV coverage is dreadful, go and find a video of Hazeltine and remind yourself how the US crowd reacts to a bad European shot.  To suggest this cheering of bad shots is new or unique to European crowds is almost comically absurd.

No almost about it, it is absolutely comically absurd.


Aside from that, I find the overall predictions of everyone, both on here and in the media and elsewhere, to be humorous. Seems like every RC, the US comes in as a heavy favorite on paper, and every RC the Euros flat out paste them (that's US slang for gives 'em a whooping, which is US slang for God only knows whatever English expression means wins convincingly and resoundingly)....and then two years later, the prognostications repeat.


Just bizarre.

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