[Thomas Dai]

Would you still play golf if during an 18-hole round you -


- on 4 holes needed a Driver and another full shot to reach the green
- on 4 holes needed a Driver, 3-4 fairway metals and another shot to reach the green
- on 10 holes needed a Driver, 2-3 fairway metals and another shot to reach the green


?
Just curious.
atb

[jeffwarne]

Would you still play golf if during an 18-hole round you -


- on 4 holes needed a Driver and another full shot to reach the green
- on 4 holes needed a Driver, 3-4 fairway metals and another shot to reach the green
- on 10 holes needed a Driver, 2-3 fairway metals and another shot to reach the green


?
Just curious.
atb

I will throw out the caveat that it would need to be a course that was navigable to play in such a manner-but frankly I'm sure it would be for me as I have little time for courses with unneeded forced carries and unnavigable front of green entrances (Bethpage Black comes to mind as a course I have zero desire to play again)
I played my first two years exactly the way Thomas describes and developed a burning passion at that time.
I know many women who play that way and scoff every time we build or propose a new tees.
I know my son enjoyed the game far more when he rarely hit it out of play driving it 150 yards and that he enjoys it less hitting it long and wrong now.


In a world where we are always getting prices raises and cutbacks in quantity, ain't it great to get more bang for your buck?
An often overlooked plus of golf like that is that you get to navigate the course, rather than battling to keep the ball ON the course


What has more strategy?
Cross country golf(imagine fairways and corridors twice as wide due to how far/short you hit it) or driver wedge golf?


I pity the player who wouldn't play if they wouldn't play the game because they couldn't hit it a preconceived ego related distance.


A also realize certain tee placement concessions need to be made to made the game practical and enjoyable


I'll add one more unpopular thought:
Back when there were 2-3 sets of tees, courses were roughly conditioned, there were no bottled water stations every tee, and equipment made solid contact unlikely yet enviable, grunpy old men yelled at slow kids, golf was NOT cool, and anything else you want to throw out about the bad old days.....


golf and golfers weren't in a panic about all the changes and programs needed to "grow the game"

[A.G._Crockett]

It's a good question.  About 10 years ago, I  started to play a solo round Kinderlou Forest in Valdosta, GA from the back tees, which are almost 7800 yards; I last four holes.  I couldn't get the ball to the fairway, I couldn't get the ball to the corner of the dogleg, and when faced with a choice between a driver and a three wood on the first par 3, I realized I was in over my head.

But I think the answer to the question is less about how many shots I'd have to hit, and more about whether or not I'd HAVE a shot.  If you can't get the ball to the fairway, or if you can't get the ball around a corner, and so forth, then the game just wouldn't be much fun.  But if I HAVE a shot, and especially if the people I'm playing with are playing more or less the same way, that would still be ok, I think.


I think you are probably talking about courses (or tees) that are too long, and a corollary issue would be, of course, whether or not the people you are playing with are in the same situation.  But the issue becomes real for aging golfers, especially, I think, those who were at one time able to hit the ball far enough but can't anymore.  In that regard, it's sort of a milder version of the question of whether one would choose execution over living out life in prison.  Philosophically, people often say they'd prefer to die, but the reality is that few inmates actually faced with the choice don't fight for their lives.  Likely, I'd choose to fight for my golf "life" and keep hitting more and more shots; I'm already sort of doing that anyway.

[Ian Mackenzie]

Very subjective, but interesting.
Appeals to me, but it also depends on way too many variables for me to comment in my normal, cynical manner.


However, it does remind me of a classic Moe Norman anecdote.


"On one of the course records, Moe needed a par on the last hole to set the record. He had never played the course and asked the professional accompanying him what club should be used. The professional answered that is was usually a driver and a 9 iron. So, Moe hit the 9 iron off the tee and then he hit his driver off the deck within 10 feet and sank the putt for a birdie."

see...it's VERY subjective...

[A.G._Crockett]

Very subjective, but interesting.
Appeals to me, but it also depends on way too many variables for me to comment in my normal, cynical manner.


However, it does remind me of a classic Moe Norman anecdote.


"On one of the course records, Moe needed a par on the last hole to set the record. He had never played the course and asked the professional accompanying him what club should be used. The professional answered that is was usually a driver and a 9 iron. So, Moe hit the 9 iron off the tee and then he hit his driver off the deck within 10 feet and sank the putt for a birdie."

see...it's VERY subjective...

Ian,

Great story about Moe Norman.  I'll paraphrase a similar one about Trevino at a practice round for the (British) Open with a local caddy on his bag.  The caddy kept telling Trevino which club to hit, and Trevino kept telling the caddy to just give him the yardage. 


Finally, the caddy once again said, "It's a 6 iron.", to which Trevino asked the yardage.  Trevino then put 6 balls on the ground, and proceeded to hit all six onto the green with everything from a punch cut three wood to a hooded, bladed pitching wedge.  He then turned to the caddy and said, "Just tell me the yardage, ok?"

[Michael Goldstein]

Hi Thomas,


I wouldn't play golf like that.


BUT, I'm teaching my better half to play and this is what she encounters as a beginner. 
Golf is a really hard game for people to learn from scratch.  Many of us forget that.   

[Brock Lynch]

Would you still play golf if during an 18-hole round you -


- on 4 holes needed a Driver and another full shot to reach the green
- on 4 holes needed a Driver, 3-4 fairway metals and another shot to reach the green
- on 10 holes needed a Driver, 2-3 fairway metals and another shot to reach the green


?
Just curious.
atb

This is not that far from what my wife experiences every round on our home course. At about 5,000 yds every par 4 is Driver followed by a 3-wood and then some third shot that is within reach of the green. She enjoys playing golf. So, in the spirit of keeping a unified household, I will say yes! I would still play golf under those circumstances.


Cheers

[Duncan Cheslett]

Would you still play golf if during an 18-hole round you -


- on 4 holes needed a Driver and another full shot to reach the green
- on 4 holes needed a Driver, 3-4 fairway metals and another shot to reach the green
- on 10 holes needed a Driver, 2-3 fairway metals and another shot to reach the green


?
Just curious.
atb

Welcome to Ladies' golf! 

[Thomas Dai]

Yip, it is indeed ladies golf......and is it any wonder that only about 15% of golfers are ladies?



Now let's take Mr Young Buck, 300 yds off the tee with a Driver (and correspondingly less with each of his other clubs).


- 4 holes with a Driver (300) and say a short iron (150) = 450 yds per hole
- 4 holes with a Driver, 3-fairway metals (250) and say a mid-iron (200) = 1,250 yds per hole
- 10 holes with a Driver, 2-fairway metals and say a short iron = 850 yds per hole


Total yardage 15,650 yds!!


Fancy playing a 15,560 yd course Mr Young Buck? What will your gross score be? How long will it take you? How many forced carries and inappropriate angles will you lose balls in? And then there's rough so thick and bunkers so deep that your wrists and body generally aren't strong enough to allow you to play a shot from them!


Welcome, Mr Young Buck, to the world of golf for the majority of ladies, many older gentlemen and most very young juniors!


Time to hide behind the sofa!


atb

[jeffwarne]

The young Buck
- 4 holes with a Driver (300) and say a short iron (150) = 450 yds per hole
- 4 holes with a Driver, 3-fairway metals (250) and say a mid-iron (200) = 1,250 yds per hole
- 10 holes with a Driver, 2-fairway metals and say a short iron = 850 yds per hole


Total yardage 15,650 yds!!


Fancy playing a 15,560 yd course Mr Young Buck? What will your gross score be? How long will it take you? How many forced carries and inappropriate angles will you lose balls in? And then there's rough so thick and bunkers so deep that your wrists and body generally aren't strong enough to allow you to play a shot from them!


Welcome, Mr Young Buck, to the world of golf for the majority of ladies, many older gentlemen and most very young juniors!

Very true insights about the additional perils or low clubhead speed players (thick rough and deep bunkers, as well as the difficulty of stopping a ball with height and spin)
That said, a low clubhead speed player playing the mythical one tee 6800 yard course could go months without missing a fairway laterally, and that's where the comparison falls flat. On a 15600 yard course the fairways would need to be 100 to 120 yards wide, the greens and holes  larger  to  create the same scale
The unsustainable change in scale of golf is exactly my pet peeve with modern equipment and it's effect on new and renovated courses

[Ed Brzezowski]

personally I would be inclined to walk up to a reasonable distance, drop a ball, and play away.

[Pete_Pittock]

Six or seven years ago I figured out there were 28 wood shots (150+) per round on our south course and 25 on the notth course, both from the white tees. I moved up to a set of combo tees. Ready to move all the way forward once my shoulder heals.

[Adrian_Stiff]

great post, I have just realised why I dont play golf

[Peter Pallotta]

great post, I have just realised why I dont play golf

     Yes, indeed.

Of course, as the famous poet wrote decades ago while downing his 5th scotch after an 8 & 7 drubbing in the club championship at Sandwich:

If you can keep your ball somewhere in play while the scratch-man bombs away, and curses the windy day 
If you can get up and down from all around, but make allowances for your bogeys too
If you can accept never waiting and always being first away
Or hitting 4 wood seconds to the young man's wedge
And watch in peace as the bad bounce finds a sod-faced pit

If you can witness your round in the open-comp go straight to hell
And yet stoop low and build it up again with worn-out tools
If you can make up strokes on the 3s and then hold on tight for all the rest
And still risk it all on one mad pitch-and-putt
And lose the hole, and start again with your routine

If you can ask your caddy for a "2" as smartly as you ask him for a "9"
And yet treat those two impostors just the same
Yours is the home club, and everything in it
And - which is more - you'll always be a golfer, friend!

[Steve Lang]

   sure would still play... not sure how much I'd want to pay for it though, is it the only game around???

[Garland Bayley]

Yip, it is indeed ladies golf......and is it any wonder that only about 15% of golfers are ladies?



Now let's take Mr Young Buck, 300 yds off the tee with a Driver (and correspondingly less with each of his other clubs).


- 4 holes with a Driver (300) and say a short iron (150) = 450 yds per hole
- 4 holes with a Driver, 3-fairway metals (250) and say a mid-iron (200) = 1,250 yds per hole
- 10 holes with a Driver, 2-fairway metals and say a short iron = 850 yds per hole


Total yardage 15,650 yds!!


Fancy playing a 15,560 yd course Mr Young Buck? What will your gross score be? How long will it take you? How many forced carries and inappropriate angles will you lose balls in? And then there's rough so thick and bunkers so deep that your wrists and body generally aren't strong enough to allow you to play a shot from them!


Welcome, Mr Young Buck, to the world of golf for the majority of ladies, many older gentlemen and most very young juniors!


Time to hide behind the sofa!


atb

I play with "codgers" at my club. Several of them play very similar to this. And, they play every weekday like that. With handicaps like 34, they make their randomly chosen team competitive. One with a lower handicap can take three shots to advance past my drive has shot 86 at age 85 from the standard white tees while not being able to reach 250 yards in two shots.

I believe I would have no problem playing like that when I get older. When I played the US Open preview at Chambers Bay at (as I recall) 7670 yards, I just considered the course to have several more par 5s and a par 6.

[George Pazin]

I’ve shared this story so many times, people are likely sick of it. But again:


I played a round of golf with a gentleman of maybe 65, back when I was 31. He played most of the par 4s with 3 wood followed by 3 wood. I played most with 4 irons followed by 6-7-8 irons. He shot about 75, I shot 92. He was accurate, I was not. He could chip and putt, I could chip and putt-putt.


We both enjoyed the round, as far as I could tell.


Many people are seemingly obsessed with what clubs they hit. I can’t say I ever really notice, other than in thinking back.


I look for interesting shots. I’d rather hit 7 irons to all 4 par 3s, as long as they’re different, ie high low running etc, then worry about hitting a wood, a long iron, a mid iron and a short iron.


But maybe I’m weird like that.

[Steve Lang]

   George, you're not weird, but tell me, do you wrap a newspaper or t-shirt around your head?


s



ps Hi from Ms. Sheila!  Been a while since the Land of Enchantment sojourn!

[George Pazin]

  George, you're not weird, but tell me, do you wrap a newspaper or t-shirt around your head?


s



ps Hi from Ms. Sheila!  Been a while since the Land of Enchantment sojourn!

Not generally. Please tell Ms. Sheila I said hello as well. l O E was such fun, feels like yesterday......

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