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Jeff Schley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Courses with the most water hazards
« on: April 13, 2018, 04:34:38 AM »
Of the courses I have played, the Ocean Course at Kiawah stands out for sure.  Over half the holes I can remember the caddie warning us of water off the tee. Not all the water is visible, but in marshy areas with reeds/grass.  So tough with any kind of wind.

Others with water hazards seemingly everywhere?
"To give anything less than your best, is to sacrifice your gifts."
- Steve Prefontaine

Thomas Dai

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #1 on: April 13, 2018, 06:07:16 AM »
Worth pointing out that it’s not just lakes and ponds etc that can be a water hazard. Ditches, some of them very small and narrow and seemingly inconsequential, often inhabit courses, sometimes at a distance from the obvious lines of play.
Atb

James Brown

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #2 on: April 13, 2018, 07:08:55 AM »
Sawgrass

V. Kmetz

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #3 on: April 13, 2018, 07:22:05 AM »
Richter Park - Danbury CT.


14 of the 18 holes have water directly in play...


3, 5, 6, 7, 8, 11, and 12 require an aerial water carry


1, 9, 10, 14, 15, 16, 17 have it bordering on one or both sides of the tee shot/2nd shot... Even #2 has it lurking for a big slice.


Only 4, 13 and 18 have no water hazard threat of any sort.


cheers  vk



"The tee shot must first be hit straight and long between a vast bunker on the left which whispers 'slice' in the player's ear, and a wilderness on the right which induces a hurried hook." -

Mark_Rowlinson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #4 on: April 13, 2018, 08:29:36 AM »
Antrobus, a funny little course between Northwich and Warrington, has water in some form on almost all the holes. It's not a good course, in fact I would say it is a downright awful course, but water it has aplenty.

Doug Hodgson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #5 on: April 13, 2018, 09:26:09 AM »
I would have to vote for Doral Blue in its current incarnation.  Not only is there water everywhere now, much much more so than before, but it is in many cases impossible to avoid.  For example, on the 10th tee the driving zone is so narrow for a non-bomber, and there is nowhere to drop, so you just keep pumping balls off the tee until you are lucky enough to hit one in play....Also fast greens sloped towards the hazards and shaved banks.  You could probably putt into the water on some holes

Joe Hancock

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #6 on: April 13, 2018, 09:26:18 AM »
Just here in West Michigan:


Wuskowhan Players Club- 21 forced carries
Watermark Country Club- 18 holes, 21 ponds
Stonewater Country Club- 18 holes 20 ponds


There are too many examples of this situation,but there’s no going back once ponds are dug.
" What the hell is the point of architecture and excellence in design if a "clever" set up trumps it all?" Peter Pallotta, June 21, 2016

"People aren't picking a side of the fairway off a tee because of a randomly internally contoured green ."  jeffwarne, February 24, 2017

John Kavanaugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #7 on: April 13, 2018, 09:54:55 AM »
I have hit my own ball into water hazards on 16 of the 18 holes at Victoria National. I have also managed to hit my ball into two separate water hazards on the same hole on 8 of the 18 holes.


It took me years to finally find the water hazard in front of the tee on #6. It's a 50 yd forced carry. I knew it was the only hazard I had not yet found and it plagued me every time I played the hole until a pop up gave me sweet release.

Conley Hurst

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #8 on: April 13, 2018, 10:00:16 AM »
PGA National Champions has water features on just about every hole except 4 and 10. I count thirteen green sites that have water within roughly 15 yards.


I played a tournament at PGA several years ago. Of course, I happened to be hitting it quite badly. Never have I felt so constantly terrified on a golf course...

JReese

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #9 on: April 13, 2018, 11:15:56 AM »
Might not have the most water coming into play on every hole, but check out this opening stretch.


"Bunkers are not places of pleasure; they are for punishment and repentance." - Old Tom Morris

Kalen Braley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #10 on: April 13, 2018, 12:16:22 PM »
Of the courses I've played, its Idaho Club by a romp.


Water in play on 16 of 18 holes....


17 Forced Carries!
« Last Edit: April 13, 2018, 03:21:13 PM by Kalen Braley »

Dan Gallaway

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #11 on: April 13, 2018, 12:25:55 PM »
Ocotillo outside of Chandler, AZ

Matthew Essig

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #12 on: April 13, 2018, 12:59:49 PM »
Not going to win the award for course with the most water hazards or holes with the most water in play, but Wilshire CC is a top courses even though its sitting in the "has water in play on so many holes" department. It has 12 holes where the creek/barranca is designed to be in play (1, 3, 4, 5, 7, 8, 11, 12, 14, 16, 17, 18), which is assuming no one would ever hit top a tee shot bad enough to put it in on 6 or a leftie would ever shank it bad enough to put one in on 10. The way its routed to incorporate the creek that much is outstanding.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2018, 01:01:44 PM by Matthew Essig »
"Good GCA should offer an interesting golfing challenge to the golfer not a difficult golfing challenge." Jon Wiggett

Doug Hodgson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #13 on: April 13, 2018, 01:50:18 PM »
I've played Falsterbo in Sweden, which has a few water holes but certainly nothing excessive.  However, there is a course just to its north called Flommens which I have not played or seen, but from the satellite photos on Google looks like absolute wall to wall water holes!

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +3/-1
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #14 on: April 13, 2018, 02:09:33 PM »

Wuskowhan Players Club- 21 forced carries



21 forced carries ?!?  Jesus, I thought Old Marsh was extreme in having water in play on 27 out of 36 shots.


Technically, the TPC at Sawgrass has water [the drainage moat / canal] on every single hole. 


Also one of the Beijing courses in my upcoming book [I think it's Beijing International but it might be a different one] has water on every hole but one, with a lot of forced carries in the mix.




Matthew Essig

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #15 on: April 13, 2018, 02:58:02 PM »
I've played Falsterbo in Sweden, which has a few water holes but certainly nothing excessive.  However, there is a course just to its north called Flommens which I have not played or seen, but from the satellite photos on Google looks like absolute wall to wall water holes!


After looking at it on Google Maps.... who in god's name thought that course was a good idea??? Definitely a Doak 0.
"Good GCA should offer an interesting golfing challenge to the golfer not a difficult golfing challenge." Jon Wiggett

Pete_Pittock

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #16 on: April 13, 2018, 03:13:30 PM »
I think Oregon champ is the aptly named Crosswater, with 15. The second course at Heron Lakes would be runner-up

Matt Frey, PGA

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #17 on: April 13, 2018, 04:06:28 PM »
I believe White Clay Creek has water hazards on 17 of the 18 holes (with 22 bridges!) and Bayside (also in Delaware) has water hazards on all 18 holes.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2018, 05:35:06 PM by Matt Frey, PGA »

Anthony_Nysse

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #18 on: April 13, 2018, 04:23:34 PM »
We have water or marsh on every hole.
Anthony J. Nysse
Director of Golf Courses & Grounds
Apogee Club
Hobe Sound, FL

MClutterbuck

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #19 on: April 13, 2018, 09:12:03 PM »
Nordelta Golf Club, 14 holes with water hazards.


Water on 2, 3, 4, 6, 7, 8, 9, 11, 12, 13, 15, 16, 17, 18, in most cases tee to green or forced carries.


Holes with no water, 1, 5, 10 have extensive waste areas, and 14 has out of bounds tee to green.


Tough course.

Ally Mcintosh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #20 on: April 14, 2018, 02:04:02 AM »
I've played Falsterbo in Sweden, which has a few water holes but certainly nothing excessive.  However, there is a course just to its north called Flommens which I have not played or seen, but from the satellite photos on Google looks like absolute wall to wall water holes!


After looking at it on Google Maps.... who in god's name thought that course was a good idea??? Definitely a Doak 0.


Definitely not a Doak 0.


Links turf laid out very naturally on a wetland area on the Falsterbo peninsula. Has a whole lot more going for it than 80% of courses.

Matthew Essig

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #21 on: April 14, 2018, 04:25:04 PM »
I've played Falsterbo in Sweden, which has a few water holes but certainly nothing excessive.  However, there is a course just to its north called Flommens which I have not played or seen, but from the satellite photos on Google looks like absolute wall to wall water holes!


After looking at it on Google Maps.... who in god's name thought that course was a good idea??? Definitely a Doak 0.


Definitely not a Doak 0.


Links turf laid out very naturally on a wetland area on the Falsterbo peninsula. Has a whole lot more going for it than 80% of courses.


Notice I didn't say 1, 2, or 3 on the Doak scale. The Castle Course has a lot more going for it than maybe 90% of courses. I can still give it a 0 if I think the water running down one or both sides of every fairway is so contrived that it's poison for the mind and I think a course shouldn't have been built in the middle of those wetlands.
"Good GCA should offer an interesting golfing challenge to the golfer not a difficult golfing challenge." Jon Wiggett

Ian Mackenzie

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #22 on: April 14, 2018, 05:58:11 PM »
I think this one may be a contender: http://www.dunesgolfsanibel.com/golf-course-information.php


Played it years ago.


The Dunes Golf and TENNIS Club on Sanibel Island in FL. Mark McCumber design.


Huge golf ball sell-through in pro shop..!..;-)

Ally Mcintosh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #23 on: April 15, 2018, 01:56:43 AM »
I've played Falsterbo in Sweden, which has a few water holes but certainly nothing excessive.  However, there is a course just to its north called Flommens which I have not played or seen, but from the satellite photos on Google looks like absolute wall to wall water holes!


After looking at it on Google Maps.... who in god's name thought that course was a good idea??? Definitely a Doak 0.


Definitely not a Doak 0.


Links turf laid out very naturally on a wetland area on the Falsterbo peninsula. Has a whole lot more going for it than 80% of courses.


Notice I didn't say 1, 2, or 3 on the Doak scale. The Castle Course has a lot more going for it than maybe 90% of courses. I can still give it a 0 if I think the water running down one or both sides of every fairway is so contrived that it's poison for the mind and I think a course shouldn't have been built in the middle of those wetlands.


You can if you want. But you’d be wrong. The course is perfectly natural, laid out 90 years ago on low lying sand bars in between the dune wetlands - quite a lovely place and not contrived in the slightest.


If it still existed, The Lido would be a much better candidate for a Doak zero if you are going to be as strict as your above statement.

James Boon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Courses with the most water hazards
« Reply #24 on: April 15, 2018, 07:21:12 AM »
Worth pointing out that it’s not just lakes and ponds etc that can be a water hazard. Ditches, some of them very small and narrow and seemingly inconsequential, often inhabit courses, sometimes at a distance from the obvious lines of play.
Atb


That reminds me of when I played the West course at Wentworth many years ago well before it was mucked about with to the extent it has been now. Every time we went into the woods searching for someones ball, there seemed to be a drainage ditch in there as well! There are also quite a few ditches crossing or just to the side of fairways and on checking my old course planner only 5, 6, 14 and 17 didnt have any ditches.


Cheers,


James
2023 Highlights: Hollinwell, Brora, Parkstone, Cavendish, Hallamshire, Sandmoor, Moortown, Elie, Crail, St Andrews (Himalayas & Eden), Chantilly, M, Hardelot Les Pins

"It celebrates the unadulterated pleasure of being in a dialogue with nature while knocking a ball round on foot." Richard Pennell