Interesting news about Dormie

[John Foley]

New owners, a group called Dormie properties featuring Ballyhack, Arbor Links & Briggs Ranch. Don't know much about the last two but Ballyhack + Dormie would be a great twosome!! New clubhouse + halfway house planned. Appears to be headed back to an all private model in a few years.


http://www.dormieoneproperties.com/


https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/pinehursts-dormie-club-under-new-ownership-joins-network-of-private-destination-golf-clubs-300560930.html

[John Kavanaugh]

Arbor Links is an hour or so out of Omaha. I had a perfectly wonderful day playing and staying at the excellent facilities. Private...that cat is out of the bag.

[Jim Franklin]

Briggs Ranch is a decent layout near San Antonio. Nice facilities.

[John Blain]

I'm disappointed that they have plans to build a new clubhouse....the current one is one of my favorite clubhouses anywhere.


I'm also not sure how they will do as a private club if that is how they are going to position themselves. I believe the folks at Forest Creek found out that maybe Pinehurst can only support one private club and that would be CCNC.


It will be interesting to see how it all plays out.

[Carl Rogers]

I admit I really enjoy the ultra simple laid back flavor of the place as it.

[Wade Whitehead]

I believe ownership will be working to capitalize on Dormie Club's strengths and not trying to reinvent the vibe there.  I would look for significant improvements in playing conditions, service, and accommodations.  The bones for a world class golf course are obviously there, and I'm excited about watching it grow into the facility it was always intended to be.

Their model is certainly working at the other clubs in the network.  I can attest to the positive changes at Ballyhack; playing surfaces are better than ever and the addition of four new cottages has brought unprecedented overnight visits to the property.

WW

[Jerry Kluger]

What's going on with Forest Creek?

[Sean_A]

I'm disappointed that they have plans to build a new clubhouse....the current one is one of my favorite clubhouses anywhere.

Si, one of the best modern houses I have seen. Cool, laid back vibe of the place would be a great shame to lose.  But honestly, something has to give because they must be losing money.

Ciao

[Tom_Doak]

Cool, laid back vibe of the place would be a great shame to lose.  But honestly, something has to give because they must be losing money.

Solution:  spend more money!

[Erik J. Barzeski]

I'm disappointed that they have plans to build a new clubhouse....the current one is one of my favorite clubhouses anywhere.

Ditto.

[JC Jones]

Nothing says a great vibe like a prepackaged sandwich in a double-wide after booking your tee-time on GolfNow....  We purists on this site can lament the spending of money all we want but its been very clear since day one Dormie Club has been a bleeder.


Great news for Dormie Club's future members to have playing rights at Ballyhack (one of the great places in golf).

[Jay Mickle]

There has been much written on here about the need for  walking paths ,  additional tee boxes,  tree removal  etc. Would be nice to see them have C&C back to put the finishing touches on the course prior to expending money on a clubhouse.

[Andy Ryall]

I'm a fan of Dormie in its current state but understand its not economically viable in its current model.   There is a limited captive audience (golfers as a percentage of consumers), which is narrowed by the expense of Pinehurst (affluent golfers) and supply within the Village, which is then narrowed further by what most on this board find attractive about Dormie (C&C, laid-back, simple), which does not necessarily appeal to the retail golfer.

Will be interesting to see how it plays out but hope at least it follows the Balllyhack model of allowing limited outside play, if it does go fully private as intended.

[Tom_Doak]

I'm a fan of Dormie in its current state but understand its not economically viable in its current model.   There is a limited captive audience (golfers as a percentage of consumers), which is narrowed by the expense of Pinehurst (affluent golfers) and supply within the Village, which is then narrowed further by what most on this board find attractive about Dormie (C&C, laid-back, simple), which does not necessarily appeal to the retail golfer.

What does appeal to the retail golfer in Pinehurst, then?  Most of the courses, apart from Tobacco Road, are laid-back and simple.


Or is it just a case of too much local competition forcing most courses to compete on price?

[Carl Rogers]

I'm a fan of Dormie in its current state but understand its not economically viable in its current model.   There is a limited captive audience (golfers as a percentage of consumers), which is narrowed by the expense of Pinehurst (affluent golfers) and supply within the Village, which is then narrowed further by what most on this board find attractive about Dormie (C&C, laid-back, simple), which does not necessarily appeal to the retail golfer.

What does appeal to the retail golfer in Pinehurst, then?  Most of the courses, apart from Tobacco Road, are laid-back and simple.


Or is it just a case of too much local competition forcing most courses to compete on price?

Maybe new management will sell "National Memberships" to out of towners?  Ballyhack has an extensive kitchen and (very good) food service.  Dormie, at present, not so.  So a big investment in that is needed if Dormie is to become a "Stay and Play".  Dormie is fairly close to Southern Pines - Aberdeen and will face stiff competition in the food and lodging market. 


As a retail golfer, I could pony up another $20 to play at Dormie.


Why can't Golf just be just Golf?

[Andy Ryall]

Tom,


I do believe oversupply is a core issue across multiple price points, as you suggest.


The laid back and simple comment was more reflective about the apres golf experience that are odds with the Pinehurst resort, which has an oversized share of discretionary $ spent in the Village.

In the case of Pinehurst, you have an expensive, upscale, resort that is the focal point of the area that draws a lot of people that are drawn to the resort experience versus a core golf experience, such as Bandon.  During September,  I observed more families/couples, especially those that were older, that I don't think could be bothered by driving 15-20 min out of town to play a compelling golf course.   


The drive from Pinehurst to West End (Dormie) reflects an area that didn't have the economic capacity to support the original massive housing development seven years ago.  I think it would be hard-pressed to find enough takers within the area to be successful in a strictly private model.  My guess is if successful, it would be cannibalizing from other area options versus flipping public/resort players to private.

[Wade Whitehead]

Nothing says a great vibe like a prepackaged sandwich in a double-wide after booking your tee-time on GolfNow....  We purists on this site can lament the spending of money all we want but its been very clear since day one Dormie Club has been a bleeder.

JC:

This is awesome.

By "vibe," I think I meant golf only, focus on the course, no intrusion from homes on the playing areas, that kind of thing.

I'll bet they'll improve every aspect of what you describe, though!

WW

[Tommy Williamsen]

I too am interested to see what happens with the Dormie Club. I played it only once, the year it opened and loved it. Ballyhack has improved since the Peeds bought it. They certainly know how to put a quality product out there. The unknown is how a national club model will fare in Pinehurst.

[jim_lewis]

Jerry:


I don't know where JP is coming from with his comment on Forest Creek. The last time I counted we have about 500 members from 29 states and 5 foreign countries. Only about 25% of the members live in Pinehurst, so I don't think the club depends on Pinehurst support though it definitely benefits from the Pinehurst address. The club was founded and owned for about 16 years by a very small group of investors. It was purchased by a much larger group of members about 4 years ago. It remains, as always, a high-end private club with two excellent golf courses.

[Ronald Montesano]

http://www.thegolfwire.com/story/329397?mc_cid=0288729598&mc_eid=39c6e74462

[Craig Disher]

Jerry:


I don't know where JP is coming from with his comment on Forest Creek. The last time I counted we have about 500 members from 29 states and 5 foreign countries. Only about 25% of the members live in Pinehurst, so I don't think the club depends on Pinehurst support though it definitely benefits from the Pinehurst address. The club was founded and owned for about 16 years by a very small group of investors. It was purchased by a much larger group of members about 4 years ago. It remains, as always, a high-end private club with two excellent golf courses.

The original plan for DC was similar - rely on national members and interested locals to support a private, walking-only golf club, something that was in short supply in the sandhills. If the new owners are inclined in that direction, we'll see if it can work.

[PCCraig]

Jerry:


I don't know where JP is coming from with his comment on Forest Creek. The last time I counted we have about 500 members from 29 states and 5 foreign countries. Only about 25% of the members live in Pinehurst, so I don't think the club depends on Pinehurst support though it definitely benefits from the Pinehurst address. The club was founded and owned for about 16 years by a very small group of investors. It was purchased by a much larger group of members about 4 years ago. It remains, as always, a high-end private club with two excellent golf courses.

Jim,


What I believe JP is coming from relates to the following article from last winter:


http://www.thepilot.com/news/forest-creek-members-discuss-potential-sale/article_d212d4d8-fddc-11e6-8db2-3f26237c188e.html


I heard that the sale didn't go through and the members decided to continue on their own. I also hear there is a significant amount of restoration work needed to both of the golf courses.


So, I think that's what JP means by "what's going on with Forest Creek."


It's an awesome place, glad to hear it's doing so well on the membership front.

[Jay Mickle]

The good news is that Bill Coore walked  the course last Monday at 8:00AM and then walked the course after lunch with the new owner.
The bad news for us locals is that even a flawed public Dormie is better than a reworked and improved private Dormie.


I look forward to following the progress as the course gets even better. With the new Gil Hanse course underway at #4,  the Pine Needles makeover, the new Thistle Dhu and the Cradle there will be much to spur travel to the area in 2018/2019.

[ChipRoyce]

So I have been interacting with someone from Dormie Club on Facebook as they posted comments re: C&C coming back to do work at the club.

The person (did not identify himself) was encouraging me to join and frankly, the annual fee (no bond / initiation) was quite reasonable. If I lived closer, I'd actually consider the club and its network as a 2nd membership.

[ChipRoyce]

So I have been interacting with Zach from Dormie Club on Facebook as they posted comments re: C&C coming back to do work at the club.

He was encouraging me to join and frankly, the annual fee (no bond / initiation) was quite reasonable. If I lived closer, I'd actually consider the club and its network as a 2nd membership.