BUDE & N CORNWALL GC: Don't Blink!

[Sean_A]

Bude and North Cornwall Golf Club?  I think it would take a highly experienced practitioner of the mental arts to diagnose the course....it has that many personalities!  The course moves seamlessly and unexpectantly from mountain top highs, to the sublime, to the silly, to the tedious and finally to the tragic. Tom Dunn is given credit for the design, but I suspect whoever is credited that much has been altered over the years.  The course is sandwiched between the town to the south and housing to the north. Fields run from the east end of the links, but they are blocked from sight just as are Crooklets Beach and Summerleaze Beach...so a visual feast Bude & NC is not.  The course is blessed with fine turf, tumbling terrain and rough which is largely kept well under control.  The bunker scheme, like the holes themselves, runs the gamut of quality.  However, I would say most are indifferently placed, shallow and shabby.  In other words, in keeping with the course! 



The first five holes are marooned across Golf House Road and the opening two are very much of the dull variety.   We properly get away on the legging left 3rd.  Rough ground protects the corner and the land feeds toward OOB right.  There is an obvious gap left of the centreline bunker, although, being a 300ish yard hole there isn't a pressing need to attack these defenses. 


The raised green can be a difficult target even with wedge in hand.


We now have a long walk to the short 4th.  The forked Crooklets Road is probably the reason for this, but it does seem like a lovely par 3 can be slotted into this area.  Luckily, this is a good par 3.  On the day we had a northwesterly wind making this a straight downwind shot. 


The aforementioned Crooklets Road.


The uphill 5th is another fine hole featuring an interesting tiered green and well placed bunkers.  One can use the slope of the land to work around the bunkers, but it can be difficult to judge the run-out. 


We now play over more adventurous land for 6 & 7, but I must say the greens surprised me as much as anything.  On the 6th the golfer is faced with the classic dilemma of hitting the drive further or laying back to high a point for a better view of the green.  Again, judging that lay-up can be very challenging in keen conditions. The hole number sign is conveniently placed on a good line. 


The plateau green looks an ample target....


...think again.  Somebody is having a laugh, but wait until the 7th!


Fairway...what fairway?




The green is out of this world. 


There are a handful of greens which run away from play.


To add to the silliness, a slightly strong approach will find a deep chasm.  This is such a preposterous hole that it must be admired.


More to follow.

Ciao

[Emil Weber]

Thanks Sean,
missed B&NC when I was in the area in 2011, but had always wanted to see some more details of course, it looks very nice.
To get an impression; how long is 7? Perhaps drivable downwind or is that little piece of fairway actually the landing zone for a decent drive? The approach certainly looks like fun with that pin position... great stuff.
Cheers

[Thomas Dai]

Thanks for what you've posted so far Sean. Looking forward to the rest. An example of a course with maybe too much quirk and unorthodoxy?
Atb


Edit - old photo later added

[Garland Bayley]

Thanks Sean,
missed B&NC when I was in the area in 2011, but had always wanted to see some more details of course, it looks very nice.
To get an impression; how long is 7? Perhaps drivable downwind or is that little piece of fairway actually the landing zone for a decent drive? The approach certainly looks like fun with that pin position... great stuff.
Cheers

Since the green is so much higher than the tee and fairway and OB just to the right, I wouldn't think it would be considered driveable, even if in range of your drive. My recollection is that the little piece of fairway is about 200 yards from the tee, leaving about 100 yards straight uphill for the approach. The green is quite deep, allowing for the ball on approach to stop on the green.

[Garland Bayley]

Thanks for what you've posted so far Sean. Looking forward to the rest. An example of a course with maybe too much quirk and unorthodoxy?
Atb

Are three blind approaches too much quirk and unorthodoxy? Not for me. I was please how each green matched the demands of the blind approaches. Besides having a distinct target like a flagstick is over valued for most of the golfing population. My home course has one hole with a blind approach. Guess which hole I have eagled with a long approach.

[Sean_A]

Thanks Sean,
missed B&NC when I was in the area in 2011, but had always wanted to see some more details of course, it looks very nice.
To get an impression; how long is 7? Perhaps drivable downwind or is that little piece of fairway actually the landing zone for a decent drive? The approach certainly looks like fun with that pin position... great stuff.
Cheers

Emil

Yes, Garland is right, that sliver is the fairway and from there it is the best angle of approach.  Safer left tee shots means hitting across the narrow green...not good.  7 is a tough hole to drive, but to be honest, the lay-up is so difficult that you may as well bash the drive up there and see what gives.  This a crazy, but loveable hole.  I was stunned after reaching the top and seeing the green.

ATB

I wasn't fussed about the quirk, just the lack of man-made input to make the quirk more meaningful.  The 7th is probably the most obvious case.  I don't see why the green can't be larger to better accomodate the blind uphill shot. 

BUDE & N CORNWALL TOUR CONT

The purple patch comes to an abrupt end with a very difficult par 3.  Just right of the green is a blind hazard.  The hole probably works better from a shorter distance than its listed 170 yards...it would be grand to see the hazard!


The 9th may even be worse!  A short par 5 with a blind tee shot.  The next plays through (or over) a tree funnel to  a raised green.  Anything short of the green will kick right...toward trouble.  To top it off, the best angle is from the left rough!  This is not a hole I have much time for.


Even worse...the 10th is simply dull.  So we move on to the 11th with its blind drive over two bunkers.  Once again, the hand of man is disappointing because as on the 7th, the fairway is non-existent.  It seems a shame to use this great piece of the property in such an off-hand manner as for a blind drive. The hole finishes well enough, but is somewhat of a letdown.


We come back to grand golf with #12.  This medium length two-shotter is an All-England candidate even if the two main options of approach are extremely difficult to pull off.  The drive looks simple enough, but the fairway runs out and trying to play toward the #12 marker is frought with the danger of rough. 


Now then, one can try to fly the near dune across the green or bounce one with the slopes into the length of the green.  Either way, the ball will likely turn left.


Using the slope seems like it should pay off easy dividends, but there is a harsh coffin-like hollow on the corner! This is unusually cruel architecture, but at least one can get to his ball and conjur a recovery.


Did I mention the green runs away from play? So far as I am concerned, this hole makes the green fee worthwhile.


More to follow.

Ciao

[Garland Bayley]

... So we move on to the 11th with its blind drive over two bunkers.  Once again, the hand of man is disappointing because as on the 7th, the fairway is non-existent.  ...

Not sure what you mean by the 11th having a fairway that is non-existent. I found it to be quite generous.



Perhaps you hit it longer than me, in which case you would need to turn the ball left to keep from running out of fairway where it doglegs left. If you can then turn the approach right, you might be able to get home in two with a chance for eagle.

Certainly course knowledge would be a good thing to have when playing Bude.

[Sean_A]

Garland

You were lucky.  Only the high bit of area over the hill is now fairway.  It might not be as wide as the 7th!  I don't know why though, but anyway, I thought something much better could have been built over that unbelievable bit of the property....the archie should be ashamed.

Ciao

[Garland Bayley]

Garland

You were lucky.  Only the high bit of area over the hill is now fairway.  It might not be as wide as the 7th!  I don't know why though, but anyway, I thought something much better could have been built over that unbelievable bit of the property....the archie should be ashamed.

Ciao

If the fairway is not mowed out, how is that the architects fault?

[Sean_A]

Garland

What I mean is terrific land is used in way which has little meaning.  All that is happening there is one blind shot banging into the spot and thats it....we hit on and its over.  We don't even get to enjoy the contours because the grass isn't cut.  It doesn't make much sense to me.  I get much of the same feeling about 7.  Great land which isn't properly taken advantage of.

BUDE & N CORNWALL TOUR CONT

The 13th can be ball breaker short hole.  On the day, I hit driver into a mediocre northwesterly wind.  Grass lines indicate right is the place to miss, though it would be helpful if the green collar were cut around the left bunker.


I think of Bude as course in four sections.  There is the flatter 1-5 on the far side of the road.  The dunesy 6, 7, 11-13 in the meat of the property.  This section is broken up by parklandy 8-10.  After 13 we play over more dunes, but with strictly back and forth holes the thrill is a bit weakened because shots look similar.  That said, 14 is probably the best of this lot.  The rear of the 13th green is the left side of the photo.


This is one of the longer 300 yard holes I know!


Much of the time the rough is kept beautifully, making fairway width a non-issue.




The small green is not without interest.




More to follow.

Ciao

[Sean_A]

BUDE & N CORNWALL TOUR CONT

The 15th plays back over the 14th green to a tumbling fairway which necks at about 240 yards out.  It may pay to lay back and have a greater chance of a flat lie.  Getting caught on one of the pinching dunes makes for a troublesome approach.


Despite the rather prosaic backdrop, the 15th green is one of the best on the property. This photo is from left of the green.


Heading back up the hill, the longish two-shot 16th is a fine hole with a blind approach.




The penultimate hole is about the same length as the 16th, but it plays downhill. 


The big hitting continues on the final hole, a par 5.  I must say, the design of this hole makes no sense to me. Big hitters can take the drive straight over the left dune.  Lesser schmucks must follow the tight fairway with nothing but trouble on the right...and three bunkers are slapped in there just for the hell of it.  There is OOB on the left, but not too tight to the line of play. The play in from the drive isn't terribly exciting...so a rather blah hole to finish.  In a nutshell, the 18th represents all that is architecturally wrong with Bude, the hand of man lets the terrain down.  That said, some of the terrain is very compelling and there is a spattering of good "plain" holes in #s 3-5 and 13 to support the high moments of 6, 7, 12 & 14.  I do think a far better course could made of this property, but for £28 much of the carping is neither here nor there.  Bude is part of the tapestry that is West Country golf, arguably the best area in GB&I to enjoy the game.  Being one hour from Padstow, Bude is an easy daytrip for those on tour.  Do yourself a favour and give Bude a go.  2017

Garland's 2014 tour.
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,59960.0.html

Ciao

[Garland Bayley]

...
The big hitting continues on the final hole, a par 5.  I must say, the design of this hole makes no sense to me. Big hitters can take the drive straight over the left dune.  Lesser schmucks must follow the tight fairway with nothing but trouble on the right...and three bunkers are slapped in there just for the hell of it.  There is OOB on the left, but not too tight to the line of play. The play in from the drive isn't terribly exciting...so a rather blah hole to finish.
...

Since the hole is uphill, you have to be a bigger hitter than me to take it over the left dune. I must be a lesser schmuck.  Besides the OB is the practice area and is too much in play on that left dune for me to try going over the dune, especially since my drives typically turn left to a degree which I have no control over. Sometimes a little, sometimes a lot. My recollection of the hole is that you have to take the drive near the bunkers on the right to have a view of the green for your approach. However, this only matters for the bunker furthest off the tee, because if you can't get it past the first two, you aren't long enough to reach the green in two.

[Sean_A]

...
The big hitting continues on the final hole, a par 5.  I must say, the design of this hole makes no sense to me. Big hitters can take the drive straight over the left dune.  Lesser schmucks must follow the tight fairway with nothing but trouble on the right...and three bunkers are slapped in there just for the hell of it.  There is OOB on the left, but not too tight to the line of play. The play in from the drive isn't terribly exciting...so a rather blah hole to finish.
...

Since the hole is uphill, you have to be a bigger hitter than me to take it over the left dune. I must be a lesser schmuck.  Besides the OB is the practice area and is too much in play on that left dune for me to try going over the dune, especially since my drives typically turn left to a degree which I have no control over. Sometimes a little, sometimes a lot. My recollection of the hole is that you have to take the drive near the bunkers on the right to have a view of the green for your approach. However, this only matters for the bunker furthest off the tee, because if you can't get it past the first two, you aren't long enough to reach the green in two.

Yes, you just confirmed my point except that it's at least 20 yards to the OOB if you drive at the sign. The crap (lost ball) on the right is about the same from the middle of the fairway. I am not long and going at the sign was the obvious play... the visuals confirm this. For big hitters it's an easy shot...basically a par 4.  I don't get architecture which rewards big hitting beyond length itself...especially when 200 and less hitters have a far more difficult drive. That's bad design in my book,but I realize the hole as it stands may pre - date mega driving. That makes it a situation where the club can do something about the obvious imbalance or accept the hole has evolved into a bit of a stinker. I am not overly fussed either way, but ya gotta call a spade a spade.


Ciao

[John Mayhugh]

  Fairway...what fairway?




The green is out of this world. 


There are a handful of greens which run away from play.


To add to the silliness, a slightly strong approach will find a deep chasm.  This is such a preposterous hole that it must be admired.

Great comment at the end.  As long as preposterous doesn't involve easily losing golf balls, count me in.

[Garland Bayley]

Great comment at the end.  As long as preposterous doesn't involve easily losing golf balls, count me in.

The rough is so light, I had no problem finding my balls. The only one I lost is the one I hooked off the property.
The day before I played at Bude, I played at Saunton, where missing the fairway meant a lost ball 80-90% of the time.
I don't know how they maintain the rough so light. There were no sheep or other mammalian grass cutters.

[Sean_A]

Great comment at the end.  As long as preposterous doesn't involve easily losing golf balls, count me in.

Tucky...the rough is generally quite well presented.  However, on the 7th it is dead easy to lose a ball in the hazard down the right.

Ciao

[David Davis]

Finally had a chance to play Bude & N Cornwall on my recent trip to Devon and Cornwall. I absolutely love Old School quirk and this corner of England is full of it. Bude really picks up at the 6th hole and while Sean you are really critical of not liking those holes and some of the characteristics I had a different feeling. Yes in some cases fairways are narrow, greens are small or not set perfectly to catch shots of players of all levels and if you don't like quirky blind shots then don't come but the course is full of craziness and cool shots that you won't get to try very often. I would say it's won the prize for the most blind drives followed by blind approaches of any course I've ever played. However, perhaps I should get out a little more...


It's pretty clear they didn't do much shaping here and just followed the natural lay of the land. It's also funny that several of the things you didn't like in your descriptions I didn't really mind but then I went out with 2 young teenagers that were members and play the course everyday. They did a great job of explaining each hole and both played pretty good golf. Most of what they said made sense....hit a 5 yard draw around that dune to the right. "insert my laugh"


For example they pointed out the blind hazard on the par 3 you didn't like. They pointed out the fact that you had to avoid the right side on the short par 5 following that one. First time I ever hit driver, 9 iron from the back tee on a par 5. Naturally I missed the pin about 1.5 meters right (with 20 meters of space on the left) and the ball was gone forever. Luckily it plays as a water hazard, so par was acceptable but disappointing.


No doubt there are some tough shots out there and perhaps even some near impossible ones for us hacks but still downright loads of fun.

[Sean_A]

David

You do me a diservice.  I like B&NC and would go back.  My tour is tailored (as they all are) more toward recommendation or not. I couldn't in good faith recommend B&NC to a general crowd as anything but a filler course on a trip or a backup choice if in the wider area.  Though I am pleased you liked the course.  I guess my biggest issue is I think a better course can be had on that property, but its so cheap that it would be churlish to complain too loudly.

BTW...I could readily see the danger right on the 9th.  Its the trees and lack of width which I disliked.  As for the 8th, I am never going to be a fan of tight blind water hazards.

Ciao

[Garland Bayley]

You can see some of the 8th green from the tee, and you know the hazard is there. I don't see the issue.

[Sean_A]

You can see some of the 8th green from the tee, and you know the hazard is there. I don't see the issue.

Maybe you are taller than me  I had no idea there was a hazard tight right of the green...with grade feeding to the water. Its not clever design...is it?  They are trying to get too much out of this section of the property.  Move the tee forward for both 8 & 9 and it makes more sense. I bet getting 6000 yards out of the back tees has more to do with it than good architecture.



Regardless of everything else, we must get back to Doak's 3    That is a very harsh judgement.  B&NC is a rock solid 5. Afterall, what does Doak know about his own scale? 

Ciao

[David Davis]

Regardless of everything else, we must get back to Doak's 3    That is a very harsh judgement.  B&NC is a rock solid 5. Afterall, what does Doak know about his own scale? 

Ciao

Sean,


Certainly not trying to do you a disservice, just seemed to like the course more than you guys seem to. Definitely, I like it a lot more than Doak did in 82' ( but I would agree with it being a solid 5.) In his defense there were several questionable ratings going on in 1982 and we (you and I) were too young to know any better. Ebony & Ivory ended the year ranked much too high https://www.musicoutfitters.com/topsongs/1982.htm according to these rankings for example. 


I think he would give it better than a 3 now as well.

[Mark_Rowlinson]

Did any of you try West Cornwall on your trips south. I played it once years ago and much enjoyed it, but then I was a better golfer in those days.

[Paul OConnor]

Mark,

This is what I wrote about West Cornwall a few weeks back, after which Garland proceeded with some spurious ad hominem attacks regarding my right to have an opinion or to disagree with his:

"On your bad advice I went and played West Cornwall last week.  Possibly the worst routed golf course I have ever encountered in my life, golf architecture malpractice if ever there was.  Anyone playing there risks a ball in the skull on half the holes, truly a frightening place."

Of the ten links courses we played in Devon and Cornwall, it was easily the least loved.  Having played it, I wished I would have skipped it and played Perranporth twice.  One of the neat features though is that there is a graveyard right on site, presumably filled with golfers who had perished during their rounds. 

[Garland Bayley]

Did any of you try West Cornwall on your trips south. I played it once years ago and much enjoyed it, but then I was a better golfer in those days.

Mark,

I believe you commented on West Cornwall on Sean's review. Paul, you might find yours to be the minority opinion if you peruse the thread. Sean basically says West Cornwall and Perranporth are equals.

http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,39193.msg819987.html#msg819987

[Paul OConnor]

Garland,

Here is a quote from you on the WC thread expressing the same sentiment as I did:

"... The only caveat I have is I felt in danger from balls coming from other holes, especially on 12, 13, 14, 16. With the wind on the day I played the 14th tee was in the prime landing zone for drives off of 16 tee. It sounds like I had an opposite wind to the one Tony had."

I'd add 4, 5, 8, and 9 to your list above of dangerous holes.

I would not put WC at the same level as Perranporth, not even close in my opinion.