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Greg Smith

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Great 14th holes?
« on: June 26, 2017, 10:50:36 PM »
The position of the hole in a round can often have an influence on how we perceive a great hole -- for example ANGC 12, which might have had a bit less impact in the flow of the round as the 3rd hole it once was.  I can think of quite a few great 12th holes.  Also, many 16th holes, 17th holes, 11th holes, etc....

In the UK I think one can identify the two best 14th holes in the world, at St Andrews and Ganton.  But I would struggle if asked to name many great 14th holes in America.  This seems weird.  A 14th hole should be occupying a key spot in the build-up of a round....  right?  Why do so many seem like connector holes?

The best ones that immediately come to my mind in the USA are the following:

14th LACC North
14th Pebble
14th NGLA
14th Baltimore CC Five Farms (East)
14th Shinnecock

Thinking of some other "great" American courses and their 14th holes -- are any of them really outstanding compared to other holes on the course?

ANGC  -- no
Cypress -- no
Oakmont -- no
WFW -- no
Pinehurst 2 -- no
Riviera -- no

Pine Valley -- it's famous, but that hole is pretty one dimensional
Merion -- could be, but there's so many stars at Merion outshining it
TCC -- perhaps
Lancaster -- a very nice Flynn hole, archetypal of the course

Is it just my imagination that the 14th as a species seems like an "orphan" hole?  I'm thinking I've just got to be missing something, or leaving out obvious examples.  Or, are there really awesome 14th holes out there that blow away those on the "headliner" type courses listed above?

If anyone thinks my observation is a "real" phenomenon -- then why?  Are architects (consciously or subconsciously) tending to create a "breather" hole prior to a tough finish, for example?

O fools!  who drudge from morn til night
And dream your way of life is wise,
Come hither!  prove a happier plight,
The golfer lives in Paradise!                      

John Somerville, The Ballade of the Links at Rye (1898)

Jon Cavalier

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #1 on: June 26, 2017, 10:57:40 PM »
Maidstone jumps immediately to mind as a great 14th hole.

The Cape at Fishers Island is also an excellent hole.


The short par-4 14th at Old Town is terrific.

The par-5 14th at Friar's Head may be the best hole on the course.


There's some good ones out there. That said, it does seem like there may be fewer "great" 14th holes than others.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2017, 11:11:13 PM by Jon Cavalier »
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Greg Smith

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #2 on: June 26, 2017, 11:07:50 PM »
Absolutely.  That's one I forgot.

I realized I've left out 14 at Muirfield Village as well -- probably because my mind's skewed away from the modern.



O fools!  who drudge from morn til night
And dream your way of life is wise,
Come hither!  prove a happier plight,
The golfer lives in Paradise!                      

John Somerville, The Ballade of the Links at Rye (1898)

BCowan

Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #3 on: June 26, 2017, 11:09:54 PM »
Inverness 14th!

Scott Szabo

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #4 on: June 26, 2017, 11:39:57 PM »
Sand Hills.  One of the best short par fives around.
"So your man hit it into a fairway bunker, hit the wrong side of the green, and couldn't hit a hybrid off a sidehill lie to take advantage of his length? We apologize for testing him so thoroughly." - Tom Doak, 6/29/10

Jason Topp

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #5 on: June 27, 2017, 12:41:22 AM »
Pasatiempo's 14th is quite good.
Crystal Downs has a lovely short par 3
The 14th at Olympia Fields North is one of the best on the course

Ally Mcintosh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #6 on: June 27, 2017, 12:49:02 AM »
Very happy to take your "two best 14th holes in the world" as TOC and Ganton, providing you up that to three best and include Portmarnock.

Thomas Dai

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Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #7 on: June 27, 2017, 02:29:19 AM »
Agree re Portmarnock and TOC. I believe there's a par-4 14th hole in the Dornoch area that is also usually rather highly regarded.
atb

Sean_A

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Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #8 on: June 27, 2017, 02:30:25 AM »
I just played two very interesting 14ths.  The Island's may be more infamous than great, but that still works for me.  Baltray's 14th is very fine...maybe the best hole on the course. 

I like Grosse Ile's 14th a lot...excellent use of a tree.  Dormie's 14th is very good.

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Kyle Harris

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Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #9 on: June 27, 2017, 08:21:22 AM »
The 14th at Streamsong Red.
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Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #10 on: June 27, 2017, 08:35:21 AM »
It's not a real phenomenon, it's pretty random, although it would not happen on the 17th or 18thvwhere most architects feel they have to save something special.


14 at Royal Dornoch is always my first choice for this.  Was surprised to see the call for Ganton as I thought I was an outlier for liking that hole so much.  (It's got it's own page in The Anatomy of a Golf Course.)


The 14th at Cherry Hills was Dan Jenkins' pick years ago and that's a pretty good one.  Also, you disrespected 14 at Augusta which is undoubtedly a better hole than any on your home course.

Terry Lavin

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Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #11 on: June 27, 2017, 08:38:07 AM »
The aforementioned 14th at Olympia North is the best in our neck of the woods. The LPGA is playing there this week, so you can see it for yourself on television. 460 yard par four with elevated tee shot played to a small platform fairway hemmed in by a meandering creek. The second shot is back up to a demonic green well protected by yawning greenside bunkers.
Nobody ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American people.  H.L. Mencken

Matthew Prince

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #12 on: June 27, 2017, 09:06:02 AM »
I'll humbly suggest my home course Quaker Ridge's 14th hole, especially after the restoration work done a few years ago that brought back Tillinghast's Great Hazard in its full glory.

Tim Fitz

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Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #13 on: June 27, 2017, 10:28:33 AM »
I agree with Jon C, the 14th at Fishers Island is pretty spectacular.

Though it is certainly a controversial hole, consider the 14th at Bandon Trails.  I understand those that dislike the hole, but it strikes me as the type of golf hole that runs hot/cold in people's minds - either it is a great 14th, or a terrible 14th.


Tim Fitz

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #14 on: June 27, 2017, 10:33:43 AM »
The aforementioned 14th at Olympia North is the best in our neck of the woods. The LPGA is playing there this week, so you can see it for yourself on television. 460 yard par four with elevated tee shot played to a small platform fairway hemmed in by a meandering creek. The second shot is back up to a demonic green well protected by yawning greenside bunkers.

Judge, the 14th at OFCC North is certainly the most beautiful hole on the course, and an undeniable great, but I have always been partial to number 3.  Looking forward to how OFCC shows for the LPGA championship this weekend.  Sorry for the threadjack.  Back to our regularly scheduled discussion of 14th holes.

Peter Pratt

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #15 on: June 27, 2017, 10:36:42 AM »
I love the 14th at Kingsley, a par 5 with options and an OB hugging the green for the risk takers.

Anthony_Nysse

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Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #16 on: June 27, 2017, 11:07:51 AM »
#14 at Long Cove Club. Awesome, dogleg left that hugs the marsh from tee to green. Would have been a great finishing hole.
Anthony J. Nysse
Director of Golf Courses & Grounds
Apogee Club
Hobe Sound, FL

John Sabino

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #17 on: June 27, 2017, 11:09:15 AM »

Great 14's I have played:


Boston Golf Club 14, plays from the top a hill down into a valley and gets progressively more narrow from tee to green. The hole is both visually stunning and gives a couple of risk/reward options. 


Whippoorwill Club 14, a par four that should be a par four and a half; pick which fairway you want to hit to approach the treacherous elevated green.


Sand Hills has a great 14th, the short par five, again with great risk/reward features and a severe green that slopes front to back.


The most distinctive 14th in my view belongs to Hirono in Japan. It is a par four that is so hard that it has its own escalator! It is only 388 yards from the back tees. From the tee you see one of the widest fairways in the world. Perhaps as wide as the combined 1st-18th at The Old Course at St. Andrews. You must hit your tee shot over a ravine to reach the tilted fairway. The fairway tilts both back to front and right to left. So while technically you only have to carry the ball 130 yards to hit the fairway, doing so leaves you with virtually no shot to the green. Only a carry of 200 yards and to the right will leave you on flat ground with a view. If you don't hit your ball 200 yards to the top of the hill, it will roll a significant distance in the wrong direction, that is, away from the green. In other words, the first 70 yards of fairway is fairway setup as a hazard.The fairway is shaped like a big 'V' and the hole doglegs to the left. The hole is aptly nicknamed "Quo-Vadis" which is Latin for "Where are you going?"  It's brilliant. The terrain is so steep to walk up they installed an escalator to allow you to walk up the hill without taxing you too much.


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Josh Tarble

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Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #18 on: June 27, 2017, 11:10:30 AM »
the 14th at Seminole is pretty awesome.  Perhaps not the best on the course but certainly great in the context of the round/match.


14 at Harbor Town is also really good.



SL_Solow

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Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #19 on: June 27, 2017, 11:24:35 AM »
Terry,


Kalen Braley

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Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #20 on: June 27, 2017, 12:07:10 PM »
I'd nominate Chambers for this list.  A beast for the average player, (even if the pros ripped it apart) with tons of strategy/choices to be made.

mike_malone

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Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #21 on: June 27, 2017, 12:26:49 PM »
Humbly offer 14 at Rolling Green as a worthwhile slightly uphill 200 yard par three   
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JJShanley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #22 on: June 27, 2017, 01:46:29 PM »
Humbly offer 14 at Rolling Green as a worthwhile slightly uphill 200 yard par three


I was about to suggest this after I checked that it was indeed the 14th.  From my single play I recall feeling that the act of walking across the bridge, which while not the only route, served to remind me I had reached "the beginning of the end."  Four great holes await you once you hole out.  The little detour over the bridge (original to the course?) did a great job of taking you out of the routing for a brief moment before you reach the green.

Marty Bonnar

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Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #23 on: June 27, 2017, 01:47:16 PM »

Leven's 14 has probably the best greensite on the golf course.




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Washed the people coal-black from the hole in the ground.

JJShanley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Great 14th holes?
« Reply #24 on: June 27, 2017, 01:51:06 PM »
My father used to play at Ratho Park, west of Edinburgh.  It has a beast of an uphill, par-4 465 yard, 14th, which I only parred once in dozens of plays.  While the final four holes were hardly beasts themselves, anyone who did make 4 felt great once they walked to 15 tee.

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