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MCirba

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Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« on: October 04, 2016, 10:09:36 AM »
A few of us are planning to visit western PA this weekend to play Wanango, which sits above the Allegheny River.   We'll also be playing Foxburg, the oldest continuously used golf course in the United States the following morning.  (much more on that later).

The trip seems a nice way to honor the memory of Arnold Palmer.

However, the architectural attribution of Wanango seems rather confusing and without a very functional USGA Seagle search available this week I'm hoping others might have more information.   The club's website seems provably incorrect in terms of the historical write-up, and I'm hoping perhaps we can clarify some things for them.

Here's what I do know for certain;

In late 1912 it was reported in local newspapers that William C. Fownes of Oakmont fame came and toured the property for a few days and "his advice will be liberally drawn upon in laying out the 9-hole golf links of the new organization which later is to be extended to 18 holes."

In May of 1913 it was reported that "The Building Committee of the Wanango Country Club has engaged Tom Bendelow, of Chicago, who is an expert golf player and landscape artist to come here and assist in laying out the new golf grounds and tennis courts."

The Donald Ross Society lists Wanango as a nine-hole design of Ross's in 1913, with some supporting information available at the Tufts Archives.   

The course was official opened in late May/early June 1914. 

In April of 1928 it was reported in local papers that "Ambitious plans are underway for the further improvement of the local golf course.   The course, laid out some years ago by the famous golf architect, Donald Ross, is one of the most interesting in this section."

At present, the Tillinghast.net site lists Wanango as a course that Tillinghast revised the first nine holes and added a new nine in 1919.   

Further clarification and/or details on any of these would be very much appreciated.   Thanks in advance for any help.


« Last Edit: October 04, 2016, 10:19:52 AM by MCirba »
"Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent" - Calvin Coolidge

https://cobbscreek.org/

Joe Bausch

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@jwbausch (for new photo albums)
The site for the Cobb's Creek project:  https://cobbscreek.org/
Nearly all Delaware Valley golf courses in photo albums: Bausch Collection

MCirba

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #2 on: October 04, 2016, 10:56:46 AM »
I just came across some evidence that very well may indicate the involvement of Donald Ross.   Certainly the friendship between Fownes and Ross may have played a part in a site visit that was reported in the local papers in January 1913, as follows;

"The character and contour appeal especially to the expert golfers, of whom there are many in the club.  Recently a professional golfer and teacher was here and accepted the invitation of prospective members to look over the grounds and give his opinion as to their adaptability.  He was so enthusiastic that his comments were almost rhapsodious.  The (word unreadable) was that he had never seen a site so materially adapted for golf purposes and he promised that the finest links in all the country could be laid out without any elaborate degree of work.    Local and visiting golfers who have looked the grounds over hold similar opinion."   

Of course, I guess this could be Bendelow, as well, as both he and Ross were often given to sales-driven hyperbole.   But something about the mention of him as a "teacher" at this juncture of their respective careers makes me feel it was likely Donald Ross.

Anyone know what the evidence for Wanango is in the Tufts Archives?
« Last Edit: October 10, 2016, 03:03:21 PM by MCirba »
"Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent" - Calvin Coolidge

https://cobbscreek.org/

MCirba

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #3 on: October 04, 2016, 11:01:19 AM »
Joe,

I should have known you'd have something up your sleeve!   Nice work on the Tillinghast article which certainly nails that part down with the revision of the first nine and the addition of the second in 1917.   ;D
"Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent" - Calvin Coolidge

https://cobbscreek.org/

Sven Nilsen

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #4 on: October 04, 2016, 11:04:47 AM »
Mike:

There's a fairly comprehensive Aug. 10, 1957 Oil City Derrick article discussing the origins of the club (and its predecessor) which I'd post but photo bucket seems to be having fits.

The article notes Bendelow laid out the first 9 holes on May 21, 1913.  It makes no mention of any of the other architects you noted, but does note that plans for the additional 9 holes were first conceived in 1917 before being put into effect in 1919.

A "20 years later" type article from May 15, 1933 Oil City Derrick notes Bendelow arrived on that date in 1913 to confer with the club regarding laying out the course.  There's a separate May 13, 1935 article from the News-Herald that notes Bendelow had been engaged to lay out the new golf grounds.

I don't have much from contemporaneous sources.  There's a 1917 American Golfer blurb that notes Bendelow "supervising an 18 hole course in Oil City," but no other evidence that he was responsible for the second nine holes.

Based on what I've read (including the article Joe linked to by Tillie), it sounds like it was Bendelow in 1913, with both Bendelow and Tillinghast being consulted in 1917 to add 9 holes.  Who actually did that work is unclear to me.

Sven



"As much as we have learned about the history of golf architecture in the last ten plus years, I'm convinced we have only scratched the surface."  A GCA Poster

"There's the golf hole; play it any way you please." Donald Ross

Sven Nilsen

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #5 on: October 04, 2016, 11:07:38 AM »
PS - Between Bendelow and Ross, only one of them taught college courses on golf architecture. 
"As much as we have learned about the history of golf architecture in the last ten plus years, I'm convinced we have only scratched the surface."  A GCA Poster

"There's the golf hole; play it any way you please." Donald Ross

Joe Bausch

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #6 on: October 04, 2016, 11:08:24 AM »
@jwbausch (for new photo albums)
The site for the Cobb's Creek project:  https://cobbscreek.org/
Nearly all Delaware Valley golf courses in photo albums: Bausch Collection

MCirba

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #7 on: October 04, 2016, 11:20:55 AM »
Thanks, Sven and Joe...that's very helpful.

Sven, was Bendelow teaching college classes on golf courses as early as 1913?   

The Tufts Archives site mentions they have something in evidence there regarding Wanango.   Any of the DRS folks out there familiar with the contents?
"Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent" - Calvin Coolidge

https://cobbscreek.org/

Richard Hetzel

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #8 on: October 04, 2016, 12:02:20 PM »
I would like to know what exactly Bendelow changed on the course. I have an idea, bit I am not sure. There are 3 holes in the woods to the Northeastern side of the property (2 par fours and a par 3) on the front 9 that don't appear to fit in with the rest of the golf course. It is possible that Tilly added these holes as well. It would be cool to discover the original routing of the course. You'll know immediately what I am speaking to when you play them. Hole number 8 is a pretty fun, short par 3. I have pics of all 18 holes at Wanago if anyone wants me to post some of them up. I have played Wanango on several occasions, and it is a fun golf course albeit in the middle of nowhere. Of course, Foxburg is great for what it lacks and is a good time.


It looks like it is for sale again also, http://www.loopnet.com/Listing/15137458/Wanango-Country-Club-314-Chestnut-Street-Reno-PA/
« Last Edit: October 04, 2016, 12:17:32 PM by Richard Hetzel »
Best Played So Far This Season:
Crystal Downs CC (MI), The Bridge (NY), Canterbury GC (OH), Lakota Links (CO), Montauk Downs (NY), Sedge Valley (WI)

Sven Nilsen

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #9 on: October 04, 2016, 06:32:52 PM »
Here's the 1957 article I mentioned above.

Oil City Derrick, Aug. 10, 1957

"As much as we have learned about the history of golf architecture in the last ten plus years, I'm convinced we have only scratched the surface."  A GCA Poster

"There's the golf hole; play it any way you please." Donald Ross

Sven Nilsen

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #10 on: October 04, 2016, 07:21:40 PM »
Sven, was Bendelow teaching college classes on golf courses as early as 1913?   


Bendelow was teaching college courses as early as 1913.  When in 1913 that started I'm not sure.


He was also a golf instructor, having taught at Carnegie Hall amongst other places.
"As much as we have learned about the history of golf architecture in the last ten plus years, I'm convinced we have only scratched the surface."  A GCA Poster

"There's the golf hole; play it any way you please." Donald Ross

Sven Nilsen

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #11 on: October 04, 2016, 07:28:29 PM »
I would like to know what exactly Bendelow changed on the course.


Is this coming from the assumption that the course was originally laid out by Ross?


I'm with Mike that I'd like to see some sort of evidence backing up this claim.  Everything else points to the original 9 holes having been done by Bendelow.
"As much as we have learned about the history of golf architecture in the last ten plus years, I'm convinced we have only scratched the surface."  A GCA Poster

"There's the golf hole; play it any way you please." Donald Ross

Richard Hetzel

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #12 on: October 05, 2016, 06:25:54 AM »
I would like to know what exactly Bendelow changed on the course.


Is this coming from the assumption that the course was originally laid out by Ross?


I'm with Mike that I'd like to see some sort of evidence backing up this claim.  Everything else points to the original 9 holes having been done by Bendelow.


I am going with the assumption that Ross laid out the first 9, Bendelow the 2nd nine (not sure if that impacted the first 9 or not) and then Tilly maybe re-worked the course.


Has anyone contacted the course to see if they have proof of this????
Best Played So Far This Season:
Crystal Downs CC (MI), The Bridge (NY), Canterbury GC (OH), Lakota Links (CO), Montauk Downs (NY), Sedge Valley (WI)

MCirba

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #13 on: October 05, 2016, 08:18:22 AM »
Richard,

The article at the link Joe Bausch shared above makes pretty clear that Tillinghast planned the second nine and made revisions to the first in creating 18 holes in 1917 that were built in 1919. 

Other articles place Bendelow at course inception in 1913.

Any Donald Ross Society members here who know and can report on what the Tufts Archives say about his role at Wanango?
"Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent" - Calvin Coolidge

https://cobbscreek.org/

Richard Hetzel

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #14 on: October 05, 2016, 11:08:55 AM »
Ahhh, did not have my glasses on to see that Tilly wrote that article. Nice work. So, how does the club have "Ross" factored in???? Another course, that
Best Played So Far This Season:
Crystal Downs CC (MI), The Bridge (NY), Canterbury GC (OH), Lakota Links (CO), Montauk Downs (NY), Sedge Valley (WI)

Richard Hetzel

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #15 on: October 05, 2016, 11:15:09 AM »
PS - Between Bendelow and Ross, only one of them taught college courses on golf architecture.


What about "teacher" as in "teaching the game of golf" not so much golf course design or architecture? Was Ross known for teaching anyone how to play? Did Bendelow offer golf instruction to new players? With golf still fairly new in the USA at this time one would think that they made their money in any way they could.
Best Played So Far This Season:
Crystal Downs CC (MI), The Bridge (NY), Canterbury GC (OH), Lakota Links (CO), Montauk Downs (NY), Sedge Valley (WI)

MCirba

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #16 on: October 05, 2016, 11:56:29 AM »
Here's the Fownes article from the Pittsburgh Post Gazette in late 1912 which seems to suggest at least a rough plan or routing may have been created as par is known.

"Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent" - Calvin Coolidge

https://cobbscreek.org/

MCirba

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #17 on: October 05, 2016, 01:00:02 PM »
I was mistaken with the 1928 quote above regarding Donald Ross.   The course referred to in that article was not Wanango but instead Conewango Valley.

This doesn't completely preclude Ross but only remaining evidence is whatever is at the Tufts Archives.
"Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent" - Calvin Coolidge

https://cobbscreek.org/

Sven Nilsen

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #18 on: October 05, 2016, 01:27:20 PM »
Here are the other articles I noted above:

American Golfer April 1917 -



Oil City Derrick May 15, 1933 -



News-Herald May 13, 1935 -

"As much as we have learned about the history of golf architecture in the last ten plus years, I'm convinced we have only scratched the surface."  A GCA Poster

"There's the golf hole; play it any way you please." Donald Ross

MCirba

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #19 on: October 05, 2016, 02:08:20 PM »
Thanks Sven...all very interesting.

To your knowledge, did Bendelow ever build courses that others designed?  I'm not aware of any.
"Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent" - Calvin Coolidge

https://cobbscreek.org/

Sven Nilsen

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #20 on: October 05, 2016, 02:10:15 PM »
Thanks Sven...all very interesting.

To your knowledge, did Bendelow ever build courses that others designed?  I'm not aware of any.


None that I know of.
"As much as we have learned about the history of golf architecture in the last ten plus years, I'm convinced we have only scratched the surface."  A GCA Poster

"There's the golf hole; play it any way you please." Donald Ross

MCirba

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #21 on: October 05, 2016, 02:46:53 PM »
Sven,

I think it's very possible/likely that the 1917 article is referring to a course in nearby Grove City that was also designed by Bendelow and opened that year.  http://www.grovecitycountryclub.com/golf-information/
"Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent" - Calvin Coolidge

https://cobbscreek.org/

Sven Nilsen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #22 on: October 05, 2016, 02:48:51 PM »
Sven,

I think it's very possible/likely that the 1917 article is referring to a course in nearby Grove City that was also designed by Bendelow and opened that year.  http://www.grovecitycountryclub.com/golf-information/

Could be.
"As much as we have learned about the history of golf architecture in the last ten plus years, I'm convinced we have only scratched the surface."  A GCA Poster

"There's the golf hole; play it any way you please." Donald Ross

MCirba

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #23 on: October 05, 2016, 03:13:16 PM »
A friend has reached out to the Tufts Archives to see what specific information they have regarding Wanango.   I'm hopeful that we'll find out more soon.

Thank you all for your assistance to date.
"Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent" - Calvin Coolidge

https://cobbscreek.org/

Richard Hetzel

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Re: Wanango Design Attribution Assistance?
« Reply #24 on: October 06, 2016, 08:11:23 PM »
I thought I would post a few pics of the course in question...

















































Best Played So Far This Season:
Crystal Downs CC (MI), The Bridge (NY), Canterbury GC (OH), Lakota Links (CO), Montauk Downs (NY), Sedge Valley (WI)

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