Slightly OT... Rory, Jordan, and Peter Kostis on the Olympics with a Hanse cameo

[Jonathan Mallard]

Looks like Rory and Jordan had plenty to say about the issue:


http://www.wsj.com/articles/the-olympics-could-use-a-mulligan-on-golf-1468366791


http://www.bbc.com/sport/golf/36777645


And Peter Kostis backed them up... Kinda.

I'm with @McIlroyRory on this one. Without ample cheap water and good paying jobs, golf will not grow regardless of the Olympic tournament.

I think Peter sort of fails to miss the real point, but that's ok. Golf will, and in my opinion, should loose a battle over water rights when it comes to people and farmers, those pesky California almond lobbyers not withstanding...


And Gil Hanse did make a cameo in the WSJ article:

[/color]Hanse, who spent 380 days living in Rio while overseeing the course construction between 2013 and early 2015, said the developer that owned the site was slow to bring in the necessary equipment and staffing. That delayed construction by eight to nine months, which in turn delayed the Olympic test event until March. Only a handful of local golfers attended.[/size]
[/color]“We were just sitting there waiting to build but weren’t given the resources to do it,” Hanse said.[/size]
[/color][/size]

[Keith Phillips]

Mcilroy, Spieth, etc. are wusses on this...Day and Johnson I understand a tad more given their young, growing family situations.  Spieth says he hopes to play in four or five Olympics by the time his career is done...I say NFW.  Rory 'didn't get into golf to try and grow the game'...Arnold needn't worry about his legacy being surpassed by that young man.  Danny Willett has it right, and the participation of tennis players, gymnasts, Michael Phelps (10x the star of these fools) just shows the young guns are all about the money on tour...very sad.

[Tom_Doak]

Mcilroy, Spieth, etc. are wusses on this...Day and Johnson I understand a tad more given their young, growing family situations.  Spieth says he hopes to play in four or five Olympics by the time his career is done...I say NFW.  Rory 'didn't get into golf to try and grow the game'...Arnold needn't worry about his legacy being surpassed by that young man.  Danny Willett has it right, and the participation of tennis players, gymnasts, Michael Phelps (10x the star of these fools) just shows the young guns are all about the money on tour...very sad.

Keith:


Perhaps you would feel differently if you'd had some personal interaction with the IGF and/or the IOC.


It is up to the players to decide if it is meaningful for them.  It's not just about the money ... if it were all about the money, NONE OF THEM would be going.

[BCowan]

Rory killed it.  Great job for him not BSing and going along with the 3 by 5 crowd.  I only wish that Rees Jones designed the course so all you that are for it would sing another tune.  It's the pro's and people in communities that GROW the game and they do it WITHOUT TV cameras or acknowledgment!  Ball and stick! 

[Ben Sims]

Among a slew of ridiculous decisions over the years by the IOC, bringing golf back into the Olympics ranks right up there.

[Mike_Young]

Among a slew of ridiculous decisions over the years by the IOC, bringing golf back into the Olympics ranks right up there.

Now Ben....think about this...you've seen the USGA up close lately and then you have BP from ANGC and the R&A along with the IOC....could they have a decision that was not ridiculous?

[Keith Phillips]

Djokovic, Federer, Murray...Nadal if he's healthy...tennis is the best analogy and those athletes treasure the opportunity to represent their countries.  Spieth is a child so I guess I may forgive him if he's suitably apologetic down the road, but I've watched months' worth of commercials of him extolling the virtues of the Olympics and representing his country...the idea that he's looking forward to Tokyo sickens me...#3 in the world and he bails...'no Tokyo for you!'


Tom, I doubt any of these men were influenced by their relationships with the IOC or similar organizations...give me a break...and it's obviously not about the money...as there isn't any in the Olympics...sheesh.  These guys will live to regret their decision and here's wishing Matt Kucher straps the gold around his neck so Jordan will have to live with that for years to come.

[Tom_Doak]

Keith:


I just don't understand why the players are put in the position of having to defend themselves.


Who volunteered that they would all come and play, without getting any guarantees from the players, without rearranging the Tour schedules to accommodate them, and without giving them any incentives to play?


Who's going to lose face if the players don't show?


Who gets treated better at The Olympics -- the athletes, or all the officials from the various international federations?  [Hint:  which group doesn't have to pee in a cup?]


For that matter, the press also gets to attend all-expenses-paid.  Why won't the players all play for them?

[Peter Pallotta]

I'm biased, on several fronts:

1. I have no time for the dysfunctional and scandal-plagued IOC, or for its silver-spooned and highly self-serving members. 
2. I've always thought that the Summer Olympics should focus on 4 things only, i.e. a) who can run the farthest, b) who can run the fastest, c) who can lift the heaviest weight, and d) who can swim the best. That's the Olympics the old-school way, the Philippides way.
(And, btw, if you were in the middle of a lake and the boat capsized, who in the hell would choose to butterfly their way to shore and safety? What kind of made-up IOC-driven nonsense is that stroke?)
3. Athletes involved in Olympic sports should be proud of their accomplishments, and I'm quite happy for them -- as people -- when they follow their dreams and succeed; but I've never felt even the slightest duty to "support our athletes" or to "root them on to Olympic Gold".  Theirs -- like mine, and like most of ours -- is a selfish pursuit and self-serving profession; most all of us are just trying to make a living at something we like, and not adding very much to the common good whatsoever.  We can be happy for each-other for doing well and building a life, but we aren't obliged to stand on the sidelines and cheer, are we? (Except for stock-brokers and investment bakers -- I cheer when one of them makes his first million....)       
4. If for at least a couple of decades synchronized swimming and beach volleyball were in the Olympics while golf was not, it is clear that the IOC brings absolutely no moral weight to bear on the issue, and any IOC attempts to foist the responsibility for "growing the game" onto golfers like Rory strike me as disingenuous at best and unethical at worst.   

In short, good on Rory for speaking his truth so plainly and clearly, even though he knew some would immediately criticize him for that truth (one that I think every single athlete in every single sport from the beginning of time would probably agree with.)   

Peter

[Keith Phillips]

A few things: 1. the tour's schedule WAS changed to accommodate the Olympics, though obviously it's a very busy year with the Ryder Cup as well (lucky Jordan and Rory getting to bail themselves out by playing for their nation's there...); 2. yes the IOC is a scandal-ridden group but my guess is neither Jordan nor Rory have ever met anyone from the IOC...this is hardly a 'protest the IOC' movement; and 3. ultimately these guys will have to live with their decisions, and who knows there may be mass illness or other events occur in Rio and the decisions will be vindicated...but I doubt it and my guess is these Olympics will be a massive success, as they typically are, with national heroes being honored...and Jordan, Rory and others will be sitting in the deca-million dollar mansions with their feet up and when they look in their mirrors before they go to bed they'll ask themselves...'what would Arnold have done?'...or Jack...etc.

[Peter Pallotta]

Keith - you've noted that a couple of times now, and, while I too have great respect for the way Jack and Arnie played the game, do you really think that a 22 year old Arnold Palmer coming out of Wake Forest or the young Jack coming out of Ohio State played golf and became professionals and joined the tour so as to "grow the game"?  And when they were travelling around the world (as Rory does today and most top players do) under the guidance of their agent Mark McCormack for Mark McCormack-created marketing opportunities under the Big Three banner, was growing the game the driver of their actions? A genuine question: do you believe that the thought of growing the game actually ever occurred to them as young men, or that it occurred to them before they were in their 40s? (Later, and in retrospect, and in line with the then-common narrative, yes, they could be proud that they had in fact done that.....but I don't believe they planned it).
Peter

[Keith Phillips]

That's a great question, Peter, and ultimately hypothetical...we will never know the answer.  Having said that my guess is McCormack might have advised his Big 3 and others to seize the opportunity to win an Olympic gold medal for their countries...hard to imagine Arnold or Jack having even larger reputations, but who knows!  Speaking of the Big 3, I find it hard to believe Gary Player would have shied away in similar circumstances.  I'm off to bed, and will fall asleep to the Olympic legends of my youth like Mark Spitz, Edwin Moses, Nadia Comenica...and yes Michael Jordan, Andy Murray, etc.  I hope Jordan enjoys his week of R&R in Texas while the more passionate pursue their dreams.

[Tom_Doak]

A few things:
1. the tour's schedule WAS changed to accommodate the Olympics, though obviously it's a very busy year with the Ryder Cup as well (lucky Jordan and Rory getting to bail themselves out by playing for their nation's there...);
2. yes the IOC is a scandal-ridden group but my guess is neither Jordan nor Rory have ever met anyone from the IOC...this is hardly a 'protest the IOC' movement

1. The schedule wasn't changed much.  They didn't move the PGA to earlier in the year so there wouldn't be a major immediately after the Olympics.  [Note:  The PGA of America is not on the gravy train with the other governing bodies as part of the IGF.]  They didn't move the Fed Ex Cup back, or shorten it, or give points for the Olympic competition so that the players from other countries could justify missing two weeks of tournaments with points that counted.


2.  You are not understanding me.  The IOC doesn't give a crap about any of this.  It's the IGF and Mr. Dawson who will have egg on their faces.  That's why Dawson is holding press conferences scolding the players and forcing them to defend themselves.  Also, remember how quickly both McIlroy and Spieth tweeted out their disgust with the USGA ruling at Oakmont? Perhaps they don't like that organizations outside the Tour have so much to say about what they should do.


3.  Jack and Arnie have their own deca-million dollar mansions now, and it's a lot easier for them to sit with their feet up and tell the young lads what to do, than it would have been for them to compete in Tokyo 1964 for free.  Or how about Mexico City in '68?  I didn't hear them clamoring for golf to be included in the Olympics when they were young.  Also, they didn't go to The Open to help "grow the game," they went for the glory, and maybe listened to Mark McCormack about expanding their brands.


For that matter, it is easy for YOU to tell all these guys what to do.  Why do you think you should tell them what to do?  They're not telling you what to do.

[Charlie_Bell]

I admire Rory's honesty, and I'm sorry the media may pummel him for it.


For what it's worth, on the golf-centric websites I've read, the trend has been supportive of him in a ratio of 2 or 3 to 1, maybe more.  It's a tempest in a teapot, and even the media are more interested in generating clicks than in being objective.

[Jeff_Lewis]

I am so disappointed in our players and in this discussion.   There are CLEARLY serious issues with Rio as a venue, in terms of safety and health. At the same time, ONLY MALE golfers have decided those issues outweigh the upside.


The Olympics are like the UN. A bit corrupt.  A bit holier than thou. Yeah, I get it.  And I understand it's a bit inconvenient.  But traveling in your private jet down to a place in the same time zone is not going to wreck anybody's day, or week, or month. 


Rory didn't let golf down by not showing up.  But he did let it down by not respecting those who will. 

[Matthew Petersen]

A few things:
1. the tour's schedule WAS changed to accommodate the Olympics, though obviously it's a very busy year with the Ryder Cup as well (lucky Jordan and Rory getting to bail themselves out by playing for their nation's there...);
2. yes the IOC is a scandal-ridden group but my guess is neither Jordan nor Rory have ever met anyone from the IOC...this is hardly a 'protest the IOC' movement

1. The schedule wasn't changed much.  They didn't move the PGA to earlier in the year so there wouldn't be a major immediately after the Olympics.  [Note:  The PGA of America is not on the gravy train with the other governing bodies as part of the IGF.]  They didn't move the Fed Ex Cup back, or shorten it, or give points for the Olympic competition so that the players from other countries could justify missing two weeks of tournaments with points that counted.


2.  You are not understanding me.  The IOC doesn't give a crap about any of this.  It's the IGF and Mr. Dawson who will have egg on their faces.  That's why Dawson is holding press conferences scolding the players and forcing them to defend themselves.  Also, remember how quickly both McIlroy and Spieth tweeted out their disgust with the USGA ruling at Oakmont? Perhaps they don't like that organizations outside the Tour have so much to say about what they should do.


3.  Jack and Arnie have their own deca-million dollar mansions now, and it's a lot easier for them to sit with their feet up and tell the young lads what to do, than it would have been for them to compete in Tokyo 1964 for free.  Or how about Mexico City in '68?  I didn't hear them clamoring for golf to be included in the Olympics when they were young.  Also, they didn't go to The Open to help "grow the game," they went for the glory, and maybe listened to Mark McCormack about expanding their brands.


For that matter, it is easy for YOU to tell all these guys what to do.  Why do you think you should tell them what to do?  They're not telling you what to do.

I dunno, Rory tells me to buy an Omega watch almost every time I turn golf on TV.


/sarcasm

[John Sabino]

Rory is a spoiled prima donna. Doesn't want to leave his bubble. It would be a huge hardship for him to fly on his private jet to Rio. He said, "I tried to get into golf to win championships..." The Olympics isn't a championship? Oh...wait a minute...there is no prize money. Sad, that representing your country doesn't count for anything anymore. The pursuit of the almighty buck trumps all. He is a spoiled, rich kid who I will not cheer on anymore.
I'm actually fine if he doesn't want to go for whatever reason, but why trash and insult others in the process?
Remember previous Rory incidents...throwing his club in the water...faking a tooth ache to walk off the course when he wasn't playing well.
Would golfers that had class such as Bobby Jones, Ben Crenshaw and Byron Nelson behave like this? No. Rory has no class. How disrespectful is what he said to the athletes who will represent golf from Ireland and Great Britain or whatever country he agonizes to identify with.

[Mike Hendren]

Not many institutions in this world that warrant our faith.  The USGA and IOC would screw up a one car funeral, just to name a couple.

Mike

[Ben Sims]

Among a slew of ridiculous decisions over the years by the IOC, bringing golf back into the Olympics ranks right up there.

Now Ben....think about this...you've seen the USGA up close lately and then you have BP from ANGC and the R&A along with the IOC....could they have a decision that was not ridiculous?

Mike,

I was too young to really appreciate how jacked up ATL became over the Olympics. But the aftermath of how it unquestionably changed the city was a topic at extended family dinners in Marietta for years. The IOC does not hold a high position of regard for me.

I get your points about USGA, R&A, and even ANGC. Even though Augusta is pretty far ahead of the two former organizations in terms of organization and chutzpah (I mean that in a positive way).

Here's the rub though. Where the USGA messes up rulings on ball movement and obfuscates agronomic conditions with golf course quality, the IOC costs taxpayers a lot of money. They affect municipalities--even entire countries--on a macro scale with their ridiculousness.

I stand by my original statement. Putting golf in the Olympics with the intent of getting the world's best to duke it out on a team basis every four years is insanity. What was wrong with the Ryder Cup, presidents Cup and all four majors.

[Andrew Buck]

Mcilroy, Spieth, etc. are wusses on this...Day and Johnson I understand a tad more given their young, growing family situations.  Spieth says he hopes to play in four or five Olympics by the time his career is done...I say NFW.  Rory 'didn't get into golf to try and grow the game'...Arnold needn't worry about his legacy being surpassed by that young man.  Danny Willett has it right, and the participation of tennis players, gymnasts, Michael Phelps (10x the star of these fools) just shows the young guns are all about the money on tour...very sad.

I will say this, if the true reason is restricted to the Zika virus, it seems they should be eager to play in the John Deere as opposed to have a 3 week layoff prior to the playoffs. 

In addition, the major mistake was not making some sort of team competition on top of individual, along the same lines as the NCAA championships (but condensed into 4 - 5 days total). 

[John Kavanaugh]

Or maybe most customers of John Deere love America, Hell Yea!!! And he would be a distraction.

[Matt Kardash]

I just don't understand how some of you guys get your panties in a wad just because someone chooses to not play in the Olympics, or any tournament for that matter. As Tom said, no one is telling you how to live your life or pursue your career. Seriously, get a life.

Maybe next time we should all start telling Tom Doak which jobs he should take. I think he should make a poll with all his current potential job offers and we should pick which one he should do. He is a quasi-public figure, so I guess that means what we think matters.

[Keith Phillips]

i think that's a poor analogy, Matt...few of us care whether Spieth plays the John Deere or Mcilroy plays the Canadian Open...but the Olympics are bigger than all that, as one is representing one's country.  As a young boy I watched the Olympics, winter and summer, and dreamed of representing my country...alas, that wasn't in the cards.  As Jeff points out, this is really only about 'male golfers', at a time when the sport has cracked into the Olympics after decades on the outside looking in.  The tennis players are all-in, and obviously most other world-class athletes are competing.  I hope the golf event is successful and the sport establishes a strong foothold in future Games.  Having said all that, I do recognize that 2016 presents a challenging calendar for these guys...four majors plus the Olympics plus the Ryder Cup, all in a six month period with other important events to balance as well.  Still, when Jordan says about playing in Tokyo in 2020...“ I'm a huge believer in Olympic golf. I'm a huge believer in playing for your country. It's the most exciting sporting event for me to watch on TV and to have a chance to be a part of it is something I definitely look forward to trying to do....it makes me want to vomit...I'd ban him from Tokyo and make him try to earn a spot in 2024.

[JLahrman]

I stand by my original statement. Putting golf in the Olympics with the intent of getting the world's best to duke it out on a team basis every four years is insanity. What was wrong with the Ryder Cup, presidents Cup and all four majors.

I agree. I thought Olympic golf was a mistake from the day it was announced and nothing that's happened since then has done anything to remotely change my mind.

I appreciate Rory speaking his mind; whether or not it is his responsibility to grow the game is an open question, but even if it is, it's debatable whether Olympic golf is a good way to do it. The more players quit hiding behind the Zika threat and just say that Olympic golf is not a priority to them, the better. Hopefully it will incent golf to be voted back out next year.

Plus, hosting Olympic golf just puts another burden on host cities. The costs and the leftover arenas are increasingly becoming a concern. The IOC could barely get any cities to bid on the 2022 Winter Games. So now having a golf course is going to be a requirement for the Summer Games? What would Athens have done in 2004?

[PCCraig]

The IOC is a hot mess. And a well documented one at that.


Obviously it's up to the individual athletes if they want to play or not. That being said, I am surprised at how little the stars of the PGA Tour care about potentially winning an Olympic Gold Medal. Michael Jordan won an NCAA National Championship and 6 NBA Championships...but he values his two Olympic Gold Medals greatly enough to have them prominently noted when he was elected into the Hall of Fame.


I guess the Olympics have fallen in stature significantly from 1992 when the first Dream Team was assembled.