Who deserves the blame?

[David Kelly]

I wonder how many weather delays they had for the first 140 years of this championship. Something tells me, not many.

[Jon Wiggett]

I am all for lower stimp speeds but those thinking that they could have played in that wind are kidding themselves. 8.3 down wind can be 20+.

[Will Lozier]

What's awful about it?  The weather got nasty and conditions became unplayable, but there are all sorts of good storylines, including:
1. It's Dustin's major to lose again. Will it be the putter, the driver or the ten-cent head that provokes this incipient tragedy.
2. Will Spieth eat haggis out of the Claret Jug if he wins?
3. Who will be the unforgettable story that we will quickly forget: Dunne, Willett or Niebrugge?
4. Will Faldo get one-tenth of the love received by Watson?
5. Will the BBC interview Adam Clayman and Melvyn Hunter Morrow after the Open to let them air their complaint that modern architecture and modern technology, including green mowers and Stimpmeters, have sullied the greatest championship of all?
If only Fox were on the job!

Ditto...


1. $.10 head
2. yes
3. could be more than just three
4. think he already got almost the same love
5. I hope

[Andrew Simpson]

4.  Will Faldo get one-tenth of the love received by Watson?

Pardon the edit.
In England perhaps, in Scotland, not even a hundredth!

[Bill_McBride]

According to the broadcast, 8.3 on the stimp for some of the most exposed greens on TOC.  So they slow them down more then the players complain about their pace.

As I said in another thread, based on when they were doing that stimp test inside the line of plastic containers to shelter from the wind, there's no way it was anything like 8.3. The R&A is making that up to cover their asses.

They've known all week what the forecast called for, and deliberately chose a setup they knew couldn't handle the wind. Totally 100% the R&A's fault.

Doug, are you saying the R&A would do that on purpose?  Why would they do that?

[Mike_Trenham]

I think the culture of overreacting is the cause.  I think it's great they had Tom finish last night in the dark.  It provided for a memorable moment.  And maybe they jumped the gun on starting today but who cares.  Get over yourselves.

Word

Blame GLOBAL WARMING weather conditions just change quickly now.  If you don't believe it ask a property insurance underwriter.

[Pete_Pittock]

We had the same type of dilemma at an Oregon Senior Championship a few years ago at Astoria, Oregon, with the greens stimping around 8.  On first day qualifying, the Committee gathered around the 2nd green as continuing play was tenuous in the high wind. As the balls were only oscillating the round continued. Twenty minutes later, balls placed in the same spot oscillated for about 1 second, before rolling off the green. Play was suspended, and the round was later cancelled.
     I will never second-guess a Committee's decision on whether, and when,  a course is unplayable.




 

[Sean_A]

I will never second-guess a Committee's decision on whether, and when,  a course is unplayable.
I agree.  People are forgetting the the Comm is hoping to finish on Sunday and will do what it can to accomplish that.  Saying the forecast predicted this or that is fools gold....calls have to be made on the spot.  We can trust the Comm is trying to do the right thing...but then many around the world seem to know more.
Ciao

[Doug Siebert]

According to the broadcast, 8.3 on the stimp for some of the most exposed greens on TOC.  So they slow them down more then the players complain about their pace.

As I said in another thread, based on when they were doing that stimp test inside the line of plastic containers to shelter from the wind, there's no way it was anything like 8.3. The R&A is making that up to cover their asses.

They've known all week what the forecast called for, and deliberately chose a setup they knew couldn't handle the wind. Totally 100% the R&A's fault.

Doug, are you saying the R&A would do that on purpose?  Why would they do that?

They wanted faster greens so they took a chance with the wind. They knew what the wind was, and I'm sure TOC greenskeepers would know exactly how fast the greens can be allowed to get before they have problems. The R&A chose to ignore them, if they even bothered to ask.

[Patrick_Mucci]

... for this awful Open?
 
Jason,
 
Don't give up your day job !

[David_Tepper]

"They wanted faster greens so they took a chance with the wind. They knew what the wind was, and I'm sure TOC greenskeepers would know exactly how fast the greens can be allowed to get before they have problems. The R&A chose to ignore them, if they even bothered to ask."

Doug S. -

Do you have any basis in fact for what you have stated in your last sentence or even the next to last one?

DT

[Terry Lavin]

This is like the PGA at Valhalla. But in a GOOD way!  Tons of birdies. A lot of contenders.  Maybe the greens were too fast yesterday, maybe the wind was too strong yesterday, but since DJ took the day off, the third round was dizzy good fun.

[Pete_Pittock]

"They wanted faster greens so they took a chance with the wind. They knew what the wind was, and I'm sure TOC greenskeepers would know exactly how fast the greens can be allowed to get before they have problems. The R&A chose to ignore them, if they even bothered to ask."

Doug S. -

Do you have any basis in fact for what you have stated in your last sentence or even the next to last one?

DT

despite the fact that the 11th green was maintained at 8.6, while the rest of the greens were above 10?

[Grant Saunders]

Just introducing some of those pesky "facts" into the discussion........

http://www.blog.asianturfgrass.com/2015/07/how-windy-was-it-in-st-andrews-yesterday.html

If you're in the turf industry and not following Micah's Blog, please check it out. It really is a great read.

[John Kavanaugh]

I just stopped by a golf course, where else can you get a sixer to go on a Sunday night, and everyone is pumped about watching golf tomorrow. This is going to be great and should become a tradition in the future for the Open. Any serious golfer plays Sunday mornings and doesn't get diddly done on Monday mornings. Perrrrfect!!!

[David_Tepper]

Grant Saunders -

Nothing ruins a discussion here faster than the facts!

DT

[Doug Siebert]

"They wanted faster greens so they took a chance with the wind. They knew what the wind was, and I'm sure TOC greenskeepers would know exactly how fast the greens can be allowed to get before they have problems. The R&A chose to ignore them, if they even bothered to ask."

Doug S. -

Do you have any basis in fact for what you have stated in your last sentence or even the next to last one?

DT

I was basing it on the winds being what was forecast for most of the week, so it didn't come as a surprise. Grant's link indicates that maybe the winds were stronger than forecast, or certainly stronger than TOC typically experiences in July, so maybe the wind did catch them off guard after all. Maybe they thought the forecast wouldn't hold since those winds would be extraordinary for July.

[Bill Brightly]

Do they roll the greens at TOC?

This might be stating the obvious, but I haven't seen anyone else make this comment, so I will:

I think the R & A correctly tried to keep the greens as fast as possible (which just happens to increase green speeds) to reduce the effectiveness of the "bomb and gougers."

[Ryan Coles]

Do they roll the greens at TOC?

This might be stating the obvious, but I haven't seen anyone else make this comment, so I will:

I think the R & A correctly tried to keep the greens as fast as possible (which just happens to increase green speeds) to reduce the effectiveness of the "bomb and gougers."

Bill

You watched it. The greens weren't remotely fast. The slowest the guys will
Putt on this year. Gullane and RCD included.

[Keith Phillips]

Ditto to what David Tepper said - thanks, Grant, for providing that data - very interesting!

[Bill Brightly]

Do they roll the greens at TOC?

This might be stating the obvious, but I haven't seen anyone else make this comment, so I will:

I think the R & A correctly tried to keep the greens as fast as possible (which just happens to increase green speeds) to reduce the effectiveness of the "bomb and gougers."

Bill

You watched it. The greens weren't remotely fast. The slowest the guys will
Putt on this year. Gullane and RCD included.

My point is that they probably wanted the greens to be as FIRM as possible, which is different than the pace of putting.

[Jason Walker]

... for this awful Open?

Nice attempt at being provocative.  Wrong on 1000 levels. 

The 'green speeders' have been proven wrong as have the 'never touch the Old Coursers'.  Let the golf play out--more times than not it wins.

[Jud_T]

... for this awful Open?

have been proven wrong as have the 'never touch the Old Coursers'.

How's that exactly?

[Gib_Papazian]

We had it on this morning (PST) in our office - and even people who don't know a Rescue club from a used tampon were absolutely mesmerized to the last putt.

All you smarty-pants, know-it-all armchair "Isn't Peter Dawson a fucking wanker" need to shut up and admit the TRUE World Championship of Golf at the Auld Grey Toon is the most wonderful thing imaginable in the game we love so much - and the R&A did a great job.

Yeah, maybe play needed to be called earlier on Saturday, but the shoe-pukes by the USGA are so numerous, THE Library of Congress card catalog is not large to enumerate them.

If you are stupid enough to argue the history and finishes at St. Andrews have not provided the most breathless, tearful, wonderful theater imaginable, then you do not belong on this site - and have been inoculated by some kind of autoimmune virus, rendering you impervious to history being made before your color-blind eyes.

That stated, I was sure Shrek or Leishman (with momentum on his side) was going to carry the day. I was also sure Paul Lawrie was going to sneak up and win . . . . . . . just like I somehow believed by ex-wife was going to love me forever. That is why I'm a shit-poor gambler. 

 

[Gib_Papazian]

We had it on this morning (PST) ar our office - and even people who don't know a Rescue club from a used tampon were absolutely mesmerized to the last putt.

All you smarty-pants, know-it-all armchair "Isn't Peter Dawson a fucking wanker" droids need to shut up and admit the TRUE World Championship of Golf at the Auld Grey Toon is the most wonderful thing imaginable in the game we love so much and they did a great job.

Yeah. maybe play needed to be called earlier on Saturday, but the shoe-pukes by the USGA are so numerous, the Library of Congress card catalog is not large enumerate them.

If you are stupid enough to argue the history and finishes at St. Andrews have not provided the most breathless, tearful, wonderful theater imaginable, then you do not belong on this site - and have been inoculated by some kind of autoimmune virus, rendering you impervious to history being made before your color-blind eyes.

That stated, I was sure Shrek or Leishman (with momentum on his side) was going to carry the day. I was also sure Paul Lawrie was going to sneak up and win . . . . . . . just like I somehow believed by ex-wife was going to love me forever. That is why I'm a shit-poor gambler.