Richard and others Familiar with Chambers Bay - Any surprises in strategy?

[Jason Topp]

I think we have beaten the topics of the condition of the course and the logistics of the event to death, but we have not addressed the manner in which the contestants attacked the course. 
In my view the course amply demonstrates the interesting decisions slope presents as a hazard.  For example, the pin position on the first hole tempted players to attack the pin but the penalty for not pulling it off was severe with the ball rolling well left. 
I am in the process of watching the final round and referring to Richard's comprehensive write up of each hole.  Richard's descriptions add greatly to the experience by highlighting the risks inherent in slope which are not always obvious from an overhead television view.

• Hole 1: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,60368.0.html
• Hole 2: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,60398.0.html
• Hole 3: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,60398.0.html
• Hole 4: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,60569.0.html
• Hole 5: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,60634.0.html
• Hole 6: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,60681.0.html
• Hole 7: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,60731.0.html
• Hole 8: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,60771.0.html
• Hole 9: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,60802.0.html
• Hole 10: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,60844.0.html
• Hole 11: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,60875.0.html
• Hole 12: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,60927.0.html
• Hole 13: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,60952.0.html
• Hole 14: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,60993.0.html
• Hole 15: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,61026.0.html
• Hole 16: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,61061.0.html
• Hole 17: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,61107.0.html
• Hole 18: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,61151.0.html

[Ben Attwood]

Great topic. I know Richard posted some thoughts in each hole commentary as the tournament progressed but it would be cool to get them in one thread.

For me, I thought the way the 9th played on Sunday was cool. The ones that getting it closest were hitting the ball up the left bank and then watching it come back to the hole. However Dustin played a great draw that came in from the right, almost around the bunker, and ended up behind the hole.

The 18th tee shot also showcased the strategy required off the tee. At the end a couple of guys stepped up and blasted away with their driver. Given the pressure you could sympathise with them playing their stock draw (Grace as an example). But with this shape the ball bounded through the fairway into the bunker, taking out going for the green in two. With the mark of champion, Speith stepped up (who had hit a couple of pull/hooks early in the round as well as blocking his previous tee shot) and saw that it required a fade to stay in the fairway. What a beautiful shot shap he produced, cutting in off the bunker and hitting the fairway. Really cool to have shot tracer on this tee. All that being said Dustin just launched a straight one over all the trouble on the right and left himself a 5 iron in. Some players can't be legislated for.

[Brent Carlson]

Jason,


The main thing that stuck out to me was that the top players learned the course as the week went on.  What they may have considered random bounces at the beginning, are actually strategic features that can be used (by intelligent players) to give oneself a competitive advantage.  That is one of the reasons why the cream rose to the top IMO.  There are very few flukey bounces at Chambers, and there are various ways to get at certain pins.  That is what makes the course so fun to play over time.

[Ben Attwood]

I agree Brent, I should think there are a few with some regrets that they didn't get their course management quite right. Has there ever been such a dramatic turn around in scoring than that of Louis Oosthuizen? Surely related to learning the course rather than form.

Brent could you give some examples?

[Wade Whitehead]

Does anyone here think the USGA believed so many players would be driving the green on 16 on Saturday?

The hole was playing almost 380, I think.

There was no strategy on that hole.  Swing hard, end up by the green, and try to get up and down.

WW

[Howard Riefs]

Does anyone here think the USGA believed so many players would be driving the green on 16 on Saturday?

The hole was playing almost 380, I think.

There was no strategy on that hole.  Swing hard, end up by the green, and try to get up and down.

WW

On Sunday, 16 played at 337 yards according to this Golfweek article.


Nonetheless, I was surprised that Davis set up the course with two driveable par 4s like that.

[Will MacEwen]

Does anyone here think the USGA believed so many players would be driving the green on 16 on Saturday?

The hole was playing almost 380, I think.

There was no strategy on that hole.  Swing hard, end up by the green, and try to get up and down.

WW

On Sunday, 16 played at 337 yards according to this Golfweek article.


Nonetheless, I was surprised that Davis set up the course with two driveable par 4s like that.

Did anyone lay up on either one?  Short par 4s are more interesting when there is a decision to be made.

[Pat Burke]

It seemed that day 1, the setup was pretty conservative.  Approach shots were holding,
and they didn't push the hole locations too much. 


On Sunday, I thought it was a surprising US Open setup.  Short, with a lot of width is
going to give those guys a lot of looks.  It produced excitement though.

[Steve_Lovett]

I was surprised by how far the players were driving the ball in comparison with my experience in playing the course. The length of today's tour professionals is incredible - and the line of play on several holes was unimaginable to me, especially from some of the tees they were playing from.

[Sven Nilsen]

On the 16th, Richard absolutely nailed how being in the bunker was not a problem.  Whether the hole was playing long (like on Friday) or short (Sunday), the preferred side to miss was on the right (unless you Graced it over the fence).


I watched Shane Lowery play out of the bunker to a pin set middle left on Friday.  He had the best angle of the three in his group for taking the bump on the front left of the green out of play, and was able to nestle one up fairly close.  We watched a number of other guys try to manage those contours from the left side of the fairway, either getting turned hard right towards the greenside bunker or running through to the back of the green.

[Bill Brightly]

I'll tell you one thing: you could have replaced 3 or 4 of the commentators with Richard Choi and it would have been a better broadcast!

[Brent Carlson]

I agree Brent, I should think there are a few with some regrets that they didn't get their course management quite right. Has there ever been such a dramatic turn around in scoring than that of Louis Oosthuizen? Surely related to learning the course rather than form.

Brent could you give some examples?

Ben,


When you try and score at Chambers, you start at the greens and work backwards.  Pin positions dictate everything, especially with the pros looking to go low on Sunday.  I watched Rory with particular attention - and he was so close to winning the tourney, but just a smidge off in his strategy of ball placement on the green.  He realistically could have won the tournament.  On 15 he went straight after the Sunday pin.   With that position you cannot be short of the flag, or you will roll off.  3 putts later he made a bogey.  Oosthuizen went just over the flag which is a good position to attempt a birdie - and he made it.

A couple examples - hole 5 is all about placing your tee ball based on pin position.  With a right pin it's very hard to get close from the far left side of the fairway.  It's better to go at the pin from the same side.  I saw many adapt the same idea.  On #8 - you can use the slopes to your advantage, especially with a back pin.  Many players figured that out and made birdies.  I also noticed that on #10 players intentionally kept their tee balls left.  Even when in the bunker you can look straight down the barrel at the pin.  Rory made a great shot from the left bunker.  DJ and Day (if my memory serves me) were down the right side and got into trouble.  You cannot do that.  Whether planned or not Spieth's drive just short of the bunker on 18 was genius.  That leaves him and an uphill shot (270ish) to the green.  He would have a hard time on the right side of the fairway with the ball below his feet.  Grace made the fatal error of driving 10 yards to far, making the green unreachable.  DJ just blew it past the trouble with superhuman strength. 

I truly believe if the USGA comes back the whining will be reduced by magnitudes.  The term lucky bounce will be replaced by strategic shot.  Yes there are some random slopes but most can be utilized by the discerning golfer to reduce his score.

[jeffwarne]

Do sideboard/backboards make a player err too much on the favored side and end up farther away than if they'd have simply played for the pin(allowing for break of course)?
Example:Grace on 18 with his eagle putt having 2 looks but neither really that close

[Garland Bayley]

Does anyone here think the USGA believed so many players would be driving the green on 16 on Saturday?

The hole was playing almost 380, I think.

There was no strategy on that hole.  Swing hard, end up by the green, and try to get up and down.

WW

That was the biggest surprise for me.


But, of course, my drives on that hole usually slice off somewhere near the second fairway.