News:

Welcome to the Golf Club Atlas Discussion Group!

Each user is approved by the Golf Club Atlas editorial staff. For any new inquiries, please contact us.


Bill Brightly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Mountain Ridge restored 7th Hole
« on: June 01, 2015, 03:05:59 PM »
Prior to this year, #7 was perhaps the only weak hole on the course. With a "saddle" green, a high left side and a high right side, the only pinnable hole location was in the dead center. Ron Prichard led a masterful restoration which has greatly improved the hole.

The green has probably doubled in surface area, with a huge new back left section. As you can tell, the new grass is still growing in and the superintendent is leaving it a little longer, but it will be an awesome green with so many cool hole locations.

Before, from the tee:

 

After, from the tee





Before, from the left of the green




After, from the left. The pin is almost in the same spot on these set of photos. Look how much putting surface has been added!



Before, from the back of the green





After, from the front of the green. I hope this shows how much deeper the green goes now.


« Last Edit: June 01, 2015, 03:48:25 PM by Bill Brightly »

Patrick_Mucci

Re: Mountain Ridge restored 7th Hole
« Reply #1 on: June 01, 2015, 03:51:21 PM »
Bill,

Thanks for posting.

I think the restoration to the original field drawing, ala Aronomink, has produced an exponentially better hole.

I think the hole plays best from 140-160 as the incline adds about 20 yards

Bill Brightly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Mountain Ridge restored 7th Hole
« Reply #2 on: June 01, 2015, 04:26:24 PM »
The new back left pins will add at least ten yards to the hole, and make for an exciting shot over the left bunker. There also in an infinite variety of angles that can be created by moving the tees and pin positions around. Some days you can use the lower right tee box and give a good angle to the back left, other days you can keep the tees left and almost force the players to take on the bunker. Very cool.

Keith Phillips

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Mountain Ridge restored 7th Hole
« Reply #3 on: June 01, 2015, 05:47:49 PM »
I'm curious whether the green was actually 'restored' or just improved?  If this is a restoration, I'm curious why, when and by whom was the green was reconfigured to its pre-Prichard shape.  Mountain Ridge is an an outstanding golf course, and I agree 7 was possibly its weakest link.  This will be sacrilege to at least one green-inked member of this forum, but I actually think the par 3s as a set are the (relatively) weakest aspect of the course.  On the other hand I love many of the longer holes, in particular 1, 2, 6, 8, 10, 11, 12, 17 and 18.

Patrick_Mucci

Re: Mountain Ridge restored 7th Hole
« Reply #4 on: June 01, 2015, 07:42:44 PM »
Keith,

# 7 green wasn't built as designed, as were the other 17.

Both the Master Plan and Field Drawing for # 17 reflect the current green.

There are a number of theories regarding the disconnect between the versions.
One, that Tillinghast, the architect of the prior course at MRCC (Essex Green Shopping Center) was retained circa 1930, and he altered # 7 and possibly the 3rd green.

I happen to agree about the par 3's, although # 4 is a spectacular par 3.

One of the shortcomings I perceive is that all four essentially play in the same direction.

I'd also like to see more variety in the distances they play.

I'd like to see # 16 at the 120-140 range, # 7 in the 140-160 range and # 14 in the 160-180 range, with # 4 at 190-240.

That being said, # 7's green came out exceptionally well, including the surrounding defenses.

Jeff_Mingay

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Mountain Ridge restored 7th Hole
« Reply #5 on: June 01, 2015, 08:06:03 PM »
I was at Mountain Ridge a week ago. The work on the 7th and 18th holes is excellent, along with all of the previous work done under the guidance and supervision of Ron Prichard over many years.

In my view, Mountain Ridge has some of the most artful Donald Ross-designed greens. There are a number of exceptional greens there, world-class. And, superintendent Cliff Moore (with guidance and encouragement from Ron Prichard, of course) does an excellent job with pushing those putting surfaces out to the very edges of the fill pads. It's really a stunning look that takes a course like Mountain Ridge to the next level in my opinion.

The Clifford Wendehack-designed clubhouse ain't too shabby either :)
jeffmingay.com

Patrick_Mucci

Re: Mountain Ridge restored 7th Hole
« Reply #6 on: June 01, 2015, 08:17:51 PM »
Jeff,

Glad you enjoyed your visit.

MRCC is really a hidden gem.

I think the club has been fortunate in that very little of the original architecture has been altered since the early years.

Some bunkers have been removed and trees planted, but most of those trees have been removed and some of the bunkers restored.

Brad Klein also found the greens most interesting.

Keith Phillips

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Mountain Ridge restored 7th Hole
« Reply #7 on: June 01, 2015, 08:24:44 PM »
Very interesting about #7 green, Pat.  I agree #4 is a fabulous hole - the first time I played it we were into a 3-club wind and all had to hit driver...needless to say none of us parred the hole that day.  It is a very challenging hole, long with a devilish elevated green - I am usually satisfied to walk away with bogey.  I'm looking forward to seeing the new greens at 7 and 18, and agree with Jeff that the greens at Mountain Ridge are excellent...I particularly like the way that they have been extended to the edge of the original green pads.

Bill Brightly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Mountain Ridge restored 7th Hole
« Reply #8 on: June 01, 2015, 08:40:09 PM »
In my view, Mountain Ridge has some of the most artful Donald Ross-designed greens. There are a number of exceptional greens there, world-class. And, superintendent Cliff Moore (with guidance and encouragement from Ron Prichard, of course) does an excellent job with pushing those putting surfaces out to the very edges of the fill pads. It's really a stunning look that takes a course like Mountain Ridge to the next level in my opinion.


You are right, Jeff. And as Pat suggests, if you shortened a hole like #16 (the par 3 over the water ) to 120-130, you could place pins close to all four corners, challenging players to attack those pins with short irons. That would bring in the mounds and add SO much more interest. 

Patrick_Mucci

Re: Mountain Ridge restored 7th Hole
« Reply #9 on: June 01, 2015, 08:55:57 PM »
Keith, Bill & Jeff,

In addition to all par 3's playing in the same direction, three of the four play uphill.

# 4's putting surface is spectacular.

# 7 isn't far behind.

# 14 is a mild punchbowl

# 16 is also an interesting green where hole locations suffer as the yardage gets longer.

Keith Phillips

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Mountain Ridge restored 7th Hole
« Reply #10 on: June 01, 2015, 09:08:26 PM »
In fairness, Pat, I think of #4 as playing 'eastward' while the others play to the north.

BTW I think 4-6 is a phenomenal stretch of golf - three good holes with amazing greens.  #8 is actually my favorite hole at Mountain Ridge, and I also love the approach into #10.

Jeff_Mingay

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Mountain Ridge restored 7th Hole
« Reply #11 on: June 01, 2015, 09:35:22 PM »
Pat,

Great point about the par 3s; somewhat contrary to Ross' work many other places relative to ensuring the short holes play toward varying points on the compass.

The 4th green blew me away. I love the look of those three little rolls in the back right corner from the tee. I could say so much about many of the greens there ... when I got to the fourth after seeing the first and second (not that the third is bad), I was certain that I was going to see the best collection of greens in the world. It didn't quite get there, but the collection of greens at Mountain Ridge is an absolute must-see for students of golf architecture.
jeffmingay.com

Patrick_Mucci

Re: Mountain Ridge restored 7th Hole
« Reply #12 on: June 01, 2015, 09:42:41 PM »
In fairness, Pat, I think of #4 as playing 'eastward' while the others play to the north.

Northeast might be more accurate


BTW I think 4-6 is a phenomenal stretch of golf - three good holes with amazing greens. 
 #8 is actually my favorite hole at Mountain Ridge, and I also love the approach into #10.


# 8 green is certainly interesting.
Originally # 8 was a par 5.
I think you can detect that in the fairway bunker pattern.

I love # 6 from tee to green and the green.

I also love # 12 which was recently restored when the intervening trees were removed and the fairway returned to it's original configuration.


Patrick_Mucci

Re: Mountain Ridge restored 7th Hole
« Reply #13 on: June 01, 2015, 09:57:51 PM »
Jeff,

I find the mix of slope and contour to be unique with Ross.

What I found especially unique is the use of spines, horizontal and vertical.

# 4 green has two sets from each flank and one from the back of the green, effectively creating six perimeter tiers or section in addition to the central body of the green.

I think those spines allow for a high degree of flexibility in terms of hole length.

# 6 green also has a good number of spines, at the flanks and at the back of the green.

These spines create "bowls" which put a premium on approach shots as well as on approach putting.
# 9 has the spine/bowl configuration on the right side of the green, making that hole location very challenging even though it's a short approach shot.

# 12 also has some spines.

# 11 may be the most unique green with that right side mid-section swale protecting back and back right hole locations.

The only relatively flat greens on the course are #'s 3 and 10.

Let me know any time you want to visit.

Patrick_Mucci

Re: Mountain Ridge restored 7th Hole
« Reply #14 on: June 01, 2015, 10:00:16 PM »
The new/restored 7th green has those spines at the flank and back of the green

Patrick_Mucci

Re: Mountain Ridge restored 7th Hole
« Reply #15 on: June 02, 2015, 11:34:37 PM »
Bill,

In reviewing your photos, I think one of the neat, if not controversial aspects of the restoration is the reintroduction of the top shot bunker.

Ross had a number of these on the original golf course.

Some had been removed over time.

What's interesting about the restoration of the top-shot bunker on # 7 is Charles Blair Macdonald's comment about the 1906 discovery of his "Eden" hole at NGLA, where he sings the praises of his hole versus the original, since his hole would not yield to a poor shot, a grounder.

A similar impediment now awaits the golfer who blades/skulls their tee shot.
They likewise, will not be rewarded.

Keith Phillips

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Mountain Ridge restored 7th Hole
« Reply #16 on: June 02, 2015, 11:45:05 PM »
I struggle with the 'topshot bunker' concept.  I appreciate where they have been reintroduced at MRCC but do question the cost-benefit analysis more broadly...these bunkers are often very attractive, but alas they only impact the high handicap golfer...begging the question 'what is the point of the hazard'?

Bill Brightly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Mountain Ridge restored 7th Hole
« Reply #17 on: June 03, 2015, 06:04:32 AM »
I think I agree with Keith, The "topshot bunker" seems to harken back to a time when equipment was far different. Presumably, Macdonald was aware that golfers were playing the Eden hole at TOC with a putter or a very low running shot. (Was this the case?) On an uphill par 3, it is hard to envision many golfers at MR choosing to run their ball that far up the slope.

I imagine that restored feature at 7th at MR will be controversial,  especially among the women. Despite that, I think the hole looks SO much better from the tee now.

We played the higher left tee last week. If the lower right tee boxes are in use, does that bunker create a blind shot?