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Josh Stevens

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Green Grass
« on: March 17, 2015, 01:29:05 AM »
Just been indulging in some Google earth golf course rankings again - much to the annoyance of some.

Noted the stark colour difference between ANGC and its neighbour the Augusta Country Club. I am guessing its a winter shot as ACC is pretty much dead, but ANGC remains almost virulently green.  What is it planted with and how does that then behave in the awful summers they presumably have there?

Also noted how close the 12th green and 13th tee are to the boundary - do they have any issues with wayward balls coming over the fence from ACC?  The tee especially seems perfectly positioned for one of my ugly cuts

Adam Lawrence

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Re: Green Grass
« Reply #1 on: March 17, 2015, 04:36:57 AM »
1. ACC will not be dead. Presumably the grass there is some kind of bermuda. It will go dormant in the winter and clearly they don't overseed or paint.

2. ANGC overseeds ryegrass every autumn. They close for the summer after the Masters, which is about the time the heat round there gets to a point that the rye can't cope.

Hence you are seeing cool season grass on one course and warm season on the other.
Adam Lawrence

Editor, Golf Course Architecture
www.golfcoursearchitecture.net

Principal, Oxford Golf Consulting
www.oxfordgolfconsulting.com

Author, 'More Enduring Than Brass: a biography of Harry Colt' (forthcoming).

Short words are best, and the old words, when short, are the best of all.

Josh Stevens

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Green Grass
« Reply #2 on: March 17, 2015, 05:04:09 AM »
OK that makes sense.  Although surprised it gets that cold down there.  Notwithstanding the ice storm of a few years back.

Are you serious?  Do some clubs paint?

Philip Hensley

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Re: Green Grass
« Reply #3 on: March 17, 2015, 06:06:42 AM »
Played #2 in January and Fairways were painted. Same at Tobacco Road.

Adam Lawrence

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Re: Green Grass
« Reply #4 on: March 17, 2015, 06:21:45 AM »
Paint is a good solution in many circumstances. It gives the green people like, without the environmental downsides of overseed.
Adam Lawrence

Editor, Golf Course Architecture
www.golfcoursearchitecture.net

Principal, Oxford Golf Consulting
www.oxfordgolfconsulting.com

Author, 'More Enduring Than Brass: a biography of Harry Colt' (forthcoming).

Short words are best, and the old words, when short, are the best of all.

Adam Lawrence

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Green Grass
« Reply #5 on: March 17, 2015, 06:22:31 AM »
Paint is a good solution in many circumstances. It gives the green people like, without the environmental downsides of overseed.

They've been painting Pinehurst No. 2 since the restoration a few years back.

Adam Lawrence

Editor, Golf Course Architecture
www.golfcoursearchitecture.net

Principal, Oxford Golf Consulting
www.oxfordgolfconsulting.com

Author, 'More Enduring Than Brass: a biography of Harry Colt' (forthcoming).

Short words are best, and the old words, when short, are the best of all.

Adam Lawrence

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Green Grass
« Reply #6 on: March 17, 2015, 06:23:05 AM »
oops, clicked quote instead of modify... ah well....
Adam Lawrence

Editor, Golf Course Architecture
www.golfcoursearchitecture.net

Principal, Oxford Golf Consulting
www.oxfordgolfconsulting.com

Author, 'More Enduring Than Brass: a biography of Harry Colt' (forthcoming).

Short words are best, and the old words, when short, are the best of all.

Philip Hensley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Green Grass
« Reply #7 on: March 17, 2015, 08:22:23 AM »
What are the environmental downsides of overseeding?

Andrew Hardy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Green Grass
« Reply #8 on: March 17, 2015, 08:53:01 AM »
What are the environmental downsides of overseeding?

Water. Lots needed to establish and keep it alive.

MClutterbuck

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Green Grass
« Reply #9 on: March 17, 2015, 11:26:26 AM »
This depends on the latitude, but...You are watering at a time of year the rest of the plants probably dont need it. You create good conditions for fungus and other problems. You need to use pesticides and other chemicals that you would not use if not. You need to fertilize more, with all the associated environmental problems. You have bad transitions, sometimes requiring chemicals to kill of the Rye. You end up having bad grass coverage in the best times of year to play. You need to fertilize more after transition to allow the warm weather grass to have good coverage. If you seed correctly, you probably have to truck in additional sand. Additional gas used to cut grass all winter. Plus overseeding makes it more difficult to fight certain contaminations, like Poa Annua. At my latitude, all that trouble to avoid 2-3 months of dormant bermuda is not too smart or environmentally sound.

Andrew Bernstein

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Green Grass
« Reply #10 on: March 17, 2015, 11:34:16 AM »
Paint is a good solution in many circumstances. It gives the green people like, without the environmental downsides of overseed.


What are the downsides to painting? Is it an expensive process? What are the environmental costs, if any?

Benjamin Litman

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Re: Green Grass
« Reply #11 on: March 17, 2015, 11:44:02 AM »
Paint is a good solution in many circumstances. It gives the green people like, without the environmental downsides of overseed.


What are the downsides to painting? Is it an expensive process? What are the environmental costs, if any?

One downside (at least to me): It looks awful and awfully fake (unless, of course, it's done wall-to-wall). But I'm guessing most clubs are like May River and paint greens (here, the 18th) only:

"One will perform in large part according to the circumstances."
-Director of Recruitment at Agahozo-Shalom Youth Village in Rwanda on why it selects orphaned children without regard to past academic performance. Refreshing situationism in a country where strict dispositionism might be expected.

Philip Hensley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Green Grass
« Reply #12 on: March 17, 2015, 12:00:19 PM »
Paint is a good solution in many circumstances. It gives the green people like, without the environmental downsides of overseed.


What are the downsides to painting? Is it an expensive process? What are the environmental costs, if any?

Same topic, what is the the point or upside to painting, other than making it look kind of green? Is there a maintenance reason?

MClutterbuck

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Green Grass
« Reply #13 on: March 17, 2015, 12:02:04 PM »
I have heard from agronomists that the paint maintains a better temperature for growth early in the spring. I dont know if this is the case.

Benjamin Litman

  • Karma: +0/-0
"One will perform in large part according to the circumstances."
-Director of Recruitment at Agahozo-Shalom Youth Village in Rwanda on why it selects orphaned children without regard to past academic performance. Refreshing situationism in a country where strict dispositionism might be expected.

Mark Pritchett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Green Grass
« Reply #15 on: March 17, 2015, 12:21:17 PM »
This season ACC did overseed their bermuda fairways with rye.  This is the first time the club as overseeded in a few years.  The greens are bent grass and the tee boxes are zoysia.  As I recall some of the tee boxes were lightly tinted. 

Though ANGC #12-13 are adjacent to ACC I am not aware of any "wayward balls" from ACC going over the fence, not even mine!


Keith OHalloran

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Re: Green Grass
« Reply #16 on: March 17, 2015, 09:57:02 PM »
Mark,
Are you saying your balls are never wayward?

John Percival

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Green Grass
« Reply #17 on: March 18, 2015, 01:10:14 AM »
Visited ANGC about 15 yrs ago, practice round for Masters.
Spoke to one of the grounds crew.
He said they 'tent' the greens during downtime.
Meaning they put a canopy over the greens to keep off the scorching sun, yet it still allows air circulation.
Don't know if they still do.
Forgot to ask, but assume they also use fans.

mike_beene

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Green Grass
« Reply #18 on: March 20, 2015, 12:12:47 AM »
Years ago a wayward ball flew across the 12th green from ACC. During an early round ,I think,Also, I think ANGC bought the back tee land on 13 from ACC when it was lengthened from 475 yards.

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