Links courses that have undergone massive tree/brush removal and...

[David Davis]

drastically improved or changed maintenance practices, increased playing corridors, brought back natural sand areas etc.

I'm looking for a list of links courses that have been worked on and restored or brought back to life in the last 10-20 years.

Preferably courses that had been totally overgrown due to neglect and had been following incorrect maintenance practices not excluding overwatering, poor bunker maintenance etc.

Any help would be great if you know of them. Off hand I can give examples of several courses in the US that have done similar things just in the last few years. Think Shinnecock, NGLA and Maidstone. I'm looking for links courses in the UK an Ireland specifically.

If you know who was responsible for the drastic change/improvement by all means mention this.

[Adam Lawrence]

David - I think you are going to struggle on this one. No British or Irish links has ever become as severely treed as Noordwijk is... and Shinnecock, Maidstone and National, for all their virtues, are not links.

[Rich Goodale]

David - I think you are going to struggle on this one. No British or Irish links has ever become as severely treed as Noordwijk is... and Shinnecock, Maidstone and National, for all their virtues, are not links.

Not that much of a struggle, David and Adam.  Monifieth had a huge tree problem and removed mucho arboles over the past 2-3 years, and this improved the course tremendously.  Neighbouring Panmure also did serious tree removal over the past few decades (or so I was told recently by people in the know when I played the course for the first time).  A year or two ago, Dornoch cut down its only 3 trees (out of play, between the 10th green and 11th Championship tee).  I'm sure there have been others.

Rich

[Sean_A]

DD

Burnham has carried out extensive removal of buckthorn in the last 20 years.  For instance, down the right of #4 used to be almost a certain lost ball, now its just rough. Behind the 16th green there was a large area of buckthorn cleared and then more once the club decided to extend the green.  There are other places as well.

Ciao

[David Davis]

David - I think you are going to struggle on this one. No British or Irish links has ever become as severely treed as Noordwijk is... and Shinnecock, Maidstone and National, for all their virtues, are not links.

Adam, you killjoy you!

At least let the masses respond before you rain on my parade!  

I know they are not true links although not far off and maybe an argument could be made there. Link between the sea and the fertile ground. Sand based soil, yes on these accounts, the first arguably the second for sure.

They also fit the mold of being neglected at some point in terms of maintenance.

I didn't say they had to have all of these things and I'm trying to exclude The Netherlands here. I'm looking for UK and Ireland examples. Surely you have some without going into levels of comparisons of extremes?

[Michael Goldstein]

David,

Paraparaumu probably fits here. Leo can explain more but there used to be a lot of trees and now they've all gone.

I can't speak to the history of many UK or Irish courses.

MG

[David_Tepper]

In addition to the recent removal of the only few trees on the course, Royal Dornoch did remove a fair amount (not a "massive" amount) gorse on the course 7-8 years ago. Some of the gorse was removed from the edges of the playing corridors, such as on holes 16 & 17. The rest of the gorse removed was from areas that were not really in play or where only a very, very poorly hit shot would land, such as a topped shot off the 12th tee.   

[Paul Gray]

Hayling. Although I'm afraid to say that the playing corridors have not been widened as a consequence, quite the opposite in fact.

[Tony_Muldoon]

As ever the correct GCA answer is TOC!

Not only have they carried on with the century old tradition of clearing out the Gorse - this time on 7 but they've narrowed the fairways and 'improved' the greens on .....


I need to go lie in a quiet room.

[David Davis]

David,

Paraparaumu probably fits here. Leo can explain more but there used to be a lot of trees and now they've all gone.

I can't speak to the history of many UK or Irish courses.

MG

Michael, thanks, any photos of the before after on this? That would really helpful.

[Robin_Hiseman]

Both Carnoustie and more especially Royal Birkdale have taken out thousands of trees in recent years.

[Mark_Rowlinson]

Conwy has removed a lot of gorse over the years to help visitors get round in under 6 hours! I can remember the buckthorn being taken out at Royal Birkdale.

[David Davis]

What about other issues other than trees?

Firming up the ground even further, changes in irrigation practices, changing grass sort on greens and surrounds and reshaping to do so?

Thanks

[Niall C]

David

Robin beat me to it by mentioning Carnoustie. The green keeper John Philps reputedly waged a one man war on trees by chopping down a couple every time there was a storm and then blaming the loss of the trees on the high winds. These days it seems to be official policy. Not sure if they took advice from Martin Ebert on that.

Martin certainly convinced Royal Troon to clear out a bunch of gorse on the 10th so that they could reinstate the MacKenzie bunker. Other than that I don't think that there was much more to do there apart from maybe the 11th.

Glasgow Gailes also have recently done a tremendous job in clearing away all the gorse in front of the par 3's so that you're not just faced with a wall of gorse in front of the tee. They have also taken away pockets of trees that surrounded the 3rd, 4th (I think) and 5th greens. A great start but still quite a bit more to do. Martin Hawtree has been advising.

A few years back Silloth undertook a comprehensive clear out of gorse however it didn't take long for the gorse to come back. I suspect that most links periodically have a good clear out or they would become over run. That's what happens when you clear off the sheep  .

Niall  

[Adam Lawrence]

What about other issues other than trees?

Firming up the ground even further, changes in irrigation practices, changing grass sort on greens and surrounds and reshaping to do so?

Thanks

Deal is a fantastic example of a links that had spent several years being managed poorly and has got right back on track.

[Wayne_Kozun]

As ever the correct GCA answer is TOC!

That's what I was going to say but I was thinking of about 130 years ago when it was done by OTM.  Where Melvyn when you need him?

[Thomas Dai]

Cruden Bay removed/reduced an area of gorse around the 11th/12th/13th holes a few decades ago. Too many rabbits living there was the justification I was given at the time.
atb

[Mark Chaplin]

Deal has a bush on the 13th and Sheehy wants to remove it, despite it being at least 100 years old!!

[Pete_Pittock]

Gearhart, in Oregon. They lost half in a massive windstorm about seven years ago. I heard tell that they have eliminated most trees, but haven't confirmed.

[Garland Bayley]

Gearhart, in Oregon. They lost half in a massive windstorm about seven years ago. I heard tell that they have eliminated most trees, but haven't confirmed.

Astoria also lost about half of their trees. Unfortunately they have indicated they plan to replant. It began totally treeless from the photos I have seen.

Of course Bandon courses wouldn't exist without gorse removal.

[Paul Gray]

Gearhart, in Oregon. They lost half in a massive windstorm about seven years ago. I heard tell that they have eliminated most trees, but haven't confirmed.

Astoria also lost about half of their trees. Unfortunately they have indicated they plan to replant. It began totally treeless from the photos I have seen.

Of course Bandon courses wouldn't exist without gorse removal.

Are either of those courses true links?

[David Davis]

Gearhart, in Oregon. They lost half in a massive windstorm about seven years ago. I heard tell that they have eliminated most trees, but haven't confirmed.

Astoria also lost about half of their trees. Unfortunately they have indicated they plan to replant. It began totally treeless from the photos I have seen.

Of course Bandon courses wouldn't exist without gorse removal.

Are either of those courses true links?

Paul, as I'm sure the other gents will confirm, yes, they both are. I've only played Astoria but have seen Gearhart. Astoria is better of the two but they definitely qualify as true links courses. Both located in the dunes on sandy soil which is certainly the link between the ocean and the fertile ground on that stretch of coast between Astoria and Seaside.

[Ally Mcintosh]

David,

A couple of others:

At Portmarnock Links Hotel, head greenkeeper Fintan Brennan has successfully overseen the widening out of some playing corridors by clearing some scrub and extending short grass run-offs.

This has been done even more dramatically at Portmarnock Golf Club where Gary Johnstone has made a huge impact on the links. A lot of the non-indigenous Swedish Pines planted in the 50's have been cleared and short grass run-offs have been given large extensions. Gorse has been cleared in certain areas of encroachment as well, such as around 9 green and in front of 11 tees. And where formal, ornamental planting had taken place (the clumps to the right of 18 fairway)... The best individual example of how a hole can be improved is at the famous, par-3 15th along the coast. Here, a solitary palm tree was removed from behind the green and the buckthorn on the dune ridge by the green was removed as well as the ugly, boundary fence that ran the length of the hole. Beach / sea views down the strand have now been opened up from the tee and the hole looks natural and more fearsome (whilst playing slightly less tight).... Don't have before and afters to hand unfortunately...

[David Davis]

Ally, thanks, great info there.

Thanks as well to everyone who's helping out on this thread. Much appreciated and the information will (hopefully) be put to good use hopefully in benefit of many of you who decide to travel to the lowlands in the future.

[Garland Bayley]

Gearhart, in Oregon. They lost half in a massive windstorm about seven years ago. I heard tell that they have eliminated most trees, but haven't confirmed.

Astoria also lost about half of their trees. Unfortunately they have indicated they plan to replant. It began totally treeless from the photos I have seen.

Of course Bandon courses wouldn't exist without gorse removal.

Are either of those courses true links?

It all depends on your definition. They didn't make Peper's book, probably because of grasses.