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Richard_Mandell

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Define Character
« on: August 08, 2014, 02:37:06 PM »
I recently had a few comments thrown my way saying that the character of some holes I renovated was lost. When pressed further, they referenced what they deemed flatter putting surfaces.  They said no other features on the course contributed to less character. Character comes in many forms in golf course design and wild greens are certainly full of character, but are they the only features on a golf course that provide character?

I think bunkering and the topography also contribute character and was surprised that putting contours were this person's main focus when describing a loss of character.  This comes from comments about a course where the original putting surfaces were not that dynamic to begin with.

My question is, what contributes most to a golf course's character?

George Pazin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Define Character
« Reply #1 on: August 08, 2014, 02:48:23 PM »
My question is, what contributes most to a golf course's character?

To me, it is the general overall topography. I generally think of courses as hilly, or bumpy, or mountainous, or desert, or water-strewn, etc.

Closely tied to that is maintenance practices - minimal, lush, etc.

I can see someone saying a flattened green has less character, much as I can see someone feeling that removing fairway contours lessens the character of the land. Obviously I'm not commenting on what you did, as I don't know the work in question.
Big drivers and hot balls are the product of golf course design that rewards the hit one far then hit one high strategy.  Shinny showed everyone how to take care of this whole technology dilemma. - Pat Brockwell, 6/24/04

Mac Plumart

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Define Character
« Reply #2 on: August 08, 2014, 02:54:01 PM »
Richard,

I'm not sure I can articulate the concept well. But I can use an example.

Royal County Down
16th hole
It seemed out of character with the rest of the course. I liked the hole, but I felt like I was transported to a different course for one hole and then back again.

Also, Inverness has(had) a few holes like that.
Sportsman/Adventure loving golfer.

Peter Pallotta

Re: Define Character
« Reply #3 on: August 08, 2014, 03:19:44 PM »
Richard -

for me, no one element can define character. In fact, an almost certain way to ensure that a course has no character is to focus on/highlight one element in particular, thereby throwing off the sense/feel/look of unity and wholeness that is so appealing.

My home course is an early 70s public built on a farmer's field. Everything about it is gentle, modest, and golfer-friendly: the 6500 yard total length, the only slightly undulating terrain, the forgiving greens, the wide fairways, the lack of water and fairway bunkers, and the healthy but simply maintained turf; and the site itself (as with many farmer's fields in the area) is surrounded by a single row trees - originally there as a wind shield/breaker to protect the crops.

And because all of these elements work together and are mutually supportive, the course has a character all of its own -- an open, friendly, and humble character that welcomes golfers young and old, beginners or veterans, to enjoy the game.  Now, that type of character may not get high rankings or win awards, but it is character nonetheless, and of a kind that serves the community very well.

In fact, the only element out of character for this particular course are the new trees they planted a few years ago between golf holes and/or to cut off potential shortcuts -- and they are out of character precisely because, in trying to be a tougher test and make the course look/feel less like a farmer's field, these new trees fly in the face of what the course actually is.

It's not that man who wears bell-bottoms and a fedora and a leather jacket and sneakers who has/demonstrates character; he demonstrates instead that he's an insecure and attention-hungry slave to fashion.  It's the construction worker un-self consciously getting off the bus in his workboots and stained pants who seems to have character; and it's the woman on a hot day with no makeup on and her hair pulled back in a bandana wearing a loose and colouful summer dress that flutters in the wind and a pair of sandals who seems comfortable with herself and at ease -- the true marks of character

Peter

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Define Character
« Reply #4 on: August 08, 2014, 03:32:36 PM »
My question is, what contributes most to a golf course's character?

To me, it is the general overall topography. ...

I would point out that green topography where around half the strokes are taken is especially important. Clearly, if you play a muni with flat greens, you will not come away thinking the course has a lot of character.
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Lester George

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Define Character
« Reply #5 on: August 08, 2014, 03:37:10 PM »
My question is, what contributes most to a golf course's character?

The passion, skill, exuberance, understanding, restraint and manipulation of the Architect.    

Lester

Tim Passalacqua

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Define Character
« Reply #6 on: August 08, 2014, 03:53:51 PM »
I would have to say the uniqueness of the topography and routing.  I always think of Olympic and the way the course is routed beautifully along the hillside.  It is so unique and you could never replicate any of those holes.  Combined with those sloping greens....that is character to me.  Unique and one of a kind.

Richard_Mandell

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Define Character
« Reply #7 on: August 08, 2014, 04:01:00 PM »
George,

I do agree that flatter putting surfaces can result in less character.  I'm certainly wan't taking offense to the person's comment, it was mostly just a bit interesting that the character of the hole was lost just based upon the softer contours.  Of course, that may not have been the person's intention, it just came across as such.  What it did for me was just bring up an interesting discussion.

Personally, I agree with you that the topography is what most contributes to character.  As I am typing this, I guess one could say that topography of a green is a min-version of that and just as a flat piece of property lacks character, I can see that connection to flat greens lacking character.  Hopefully the rest of the hole has enough character that balances softer green contours.

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Define Character
« Reply #8 on: August 08, 2014, 04:08:52 PM »
A very important element of character is variety.  I like a course where I can't remember any two holes alike. A good mixture of short, long, half pars, some flattish greens, others with steep slopes and back stops, that to me is full of character.

Any time you have to play away from the hole to get close, that's character!

Richard_Mandell

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Define Character
« Reply #9 on: August 08, 2014, 04:18:23 PM »
Peter,

I like your description of your golf course and its character and I think you are right on about the additional trees being out of character and why.  You lost me a bit with the fedora etc.  So on that note, what does character mean?  Does it mean authenticity when you consider the people description?

You utilize the phrase "a character all its own".  Can character also be considered a style also?  Or is character considered "interest within the context of its surroundings"?  I like that definition so far.

Peter Pallotta

Re: Define Character
« Reply #10 on: August 08, 2014, 04:30:42 PM »
Richard - what I meant to suggest is that for me 'character' reflects a whole and unified quality, where the individual elements all support eachother seemlessly and effortlessly, and are based in practical realities and good sense.

(My home course has a modest, open, and friendly character because it has too -- it was built for little money, and now relies on attracting a wide range of daily fee golfers for its profitability).

The man with the fedora has willy nilly and for no good reason grabbed various elements that were/are popular and in fashion and put them all together under the (misguided) assumption that the more popular elements you have the better the whole will be. I'm suggesting that it is the exact opposite. 

Peter

Ben Baldwin

Re: Define Character
« Reply #11 on: August 08, 2014, 04:32:49 PM »
In my mind, "Character" in a golf hole(s) (and in a golf course as a whole) has two items that are a "must" for me to use the word Character to describe a course.

Each hole must feel different than the last hole, but all 18 holes must feel like they all belong on the same property.


Richard_Mandell

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Define Character
« Reply #12 on: August 08, 2014, 04:34:32 PM »
Peter,

I know you were inferring the opposite with the Fedora man.  I like the parallel and think it opens up the idea of authenticity a bit regarding the other characters you describe.

Mike_Young

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Define Character
« Reply #13 on: August 08, 2014, 06:26:06 PM »
Rich,

John Wooden once said it this way: "“Be more concerned with your character than your reputation, because your character is what you really are, while your reputation is merely what others think you are.”   This is so true with golf courses also.  So many of the small town golf courses around NC, SC and GA have special character but don't have the reputations of so many of the bigger well regarded, highly sought after places.  To me it seems so much of what we call character is the flow and blend that is felt in these places.  Greens could be flat or single plane or whatever and it would not matter.  IMHO not many development courses have character and that is because of the flow from greens to next tees etc and yet many have reputation.  JMO
"just standing on a corner in Winslow Arizona"

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Define Character
« Reply #14 on: August 09, 2014, 04:39:20 AM »
Mike Y, I couldn't agree more.  Sometimes, it is merely a sense of grandeur which can make one course top 100 and the other chopped liver.  Their character can be very similar, but the setting and details can mark the difference.  This is one reason why I think topography is just one element of character.  For instance, I look at Huntercombe on quite a flat site with a few holes to the exception and with quite flat fairways, yet I wouldn't describe the character of the course as flat because the man-made elements are so important in creating the character of the course.  I guess what I am saying is every course is different and on one element will do full justice in describing the character of a course.

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Jason Topp

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Define Character
« Reply #15 on: August 09, 2014, 07:03:12 AM »
George,

I do agree that flatter putting surfaces can result in less character.  I'm certainly wan't taking offense to the person's comment, it was mostly just a bit interesting that the character of the hole was lost just based upon the softer contours.  Of course, that may not have been the person's intention, it just came across as such.  What it did for me was just bring up an interesting discussion.

Personally, I agree with you that the topography is what most contributes to character.  As I am typing this, I guess one could say that topography of a green is a min-version of that and just as a flat piece of property lacks character, I can see that connection to flat greens lacking character.  Hopefully the rest of the hole has enough character that balances softer green contours.

Richard - i would think most people would use the term to equate to "characteristic."  Maybe. something about the original feel of the hole has changedd such as a piece of the challenge that the person liked.  If it is the course I assume it is, I have not played it yet.

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