Gil Hanse and Paul George

[Jason Thurman]

Is Gil Hanse the Paul George of golf course architecture? Is he the Matt Ryan of golf course architecture?

I say yes. Discuss.

[Mark Bourgeois]

No. Your analogies are not analogous. Players are not the architects of their teams in any sense of that word.

[BHoover]

Who is Paul George? Was he one of Old Tom's apprentices?

[Jason Thurman]

Who is Paul George? Was he one of Old Tom's apprentices?

No, but if he continues regressing at this rate he may be willing to consider such a career change in a few years.

I'm mostly kidding. I love Paul George. But it does seem like we might have dramatically overrated him after he showed flashes of greatness in last season's Playoffs and early this year, sorta like how we might have dramatically overrated Hanse after he showed flashes of greatness early in his design career. I even sent a certain Indianapolis-based GCAer a text earlier this year that said "Lebron James pretends to be Paul George when he shoots in his driveway." That must be one of the stupidest statements I've ever written.

[BHoover]

Who is Paul George? Was he one of Old Tom's apprentices?

No, but if he continues regressing at this rate he may be willing to consider such a career change in a few years.

I'm mostly kidding. I love Paul George. But it does seem like we might have dramatically overrated him after he showed flashes of greatness in last season's Playoffs and early this year, sorta like how we might have dramatically overrated Hanse after he showed flashes of greatness early in his design career. I even sent a certain Indianapolis-based GCAer a text earlier this year that said "Lebron James pretends to be Paul George when he shoots in his driveway." That must be one of the stupidest statements I've ever written.

My last NBA game was also the last game that LeBron played for the Cavaliers. The NBA is now dead to me.

To make this golf-related, I will say, no.

[Howard Riefs]

It's getting scary that in only reading the thread subject, I can identify the author instantly.

(Beyond those of the fragment variety...)

[Jason Thurman]

To be fair, there are only 15 NBA fans left on the planet. So if you see a baller's name in the title, you pretty much should know it was me.

But consider the parallels:

* Rustic Canyon for Hanse = George's 2013 Playoffs - Not amazing or anything, but really really good, loaded with subtlety that many don't appreciate, and a cause to believe in great things to come
* They're both likely to be involved in the 2016 Olympics
* They both play great defense - George is the best in the league at stopping wings from putting up great scores, while Trump Doral is stopping pros from putting up great scores.
* George is at his best as a great defender on a great defensive team, while Hanse does great restorations and renovations on courses built by great architects.
* Both get a ton of credit for something they haven't done yet - George for stopping Lebron and the Heat in the Playoffs, and Hanse for the Old School course at The Prairie Club.
* Both have monosyllabic first and last names.

They both seem like they've been given a ton of credit for their great potential, despite the fact that neither may ever reach their ceiling.

[JC Jones]

Thurms,

I get what you're saying and can see your analogy.  Just realize that we will now have to endure several people posting on this thread simply to tell everyone they dont like the NBA. 

[Keith OHalloran]

I don't like the NBA.

[Mark Bourgeois]

It's rigged, not just in the sense of referees on the take or making league-suggested calls, but in the larger sense of the league being structured so that everybody knows at the beginning of the season only a handful of teams have a legitimate shot at the title and those teams are known. The whole season is not much more than a minor seeding exercise.

And then there are the horrible contracts. Possibly the only redeeming thing ever to come from those fiascos is this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWR3BtHNjFs

[Bill_McBride]

What is the NBA?

Is it almost time for the Big Dance?

[Nigel Islam]

No Evan Turner is Yoko Ono

[JC Jones]

Right on cue, besides Keith, who probably doesn't like it but posted just for me, we've got 2 posts about not liking the NBA.

Start a conversation on hockey, football, baseball, cricket, soccer....etc. and all is cool.  Start a conversation on basketball and people just HAVE to to tell you they dont like it.  Or, my personal favorite, "I like college basketball but not the NBA."

[Nigel Islam]

Right now as a Hoosier/Pacer fan I don't like either. Ugh

[Connor Dougherty]

I love college basketball and can't stand the NBA 

Was 6 rows up in the student section for Oregon Arizona today. Incredible atmosphere. Physical game. Everything I love about basketball.

[Philip Caccamise]

I love college basketball and can't stand the NBA 

Was 6 rows up in the student section for Oregon Arizona today. Incredible atmosphere. Physical game. Everything I love about basketball.

I do too. The one team sport I have a lot of passion for. I don't hate the NBA, just don't have time for it (and my team, the Knicks, is pretty much horrible.)

Big win for your Ducks. They are going in the right direction heading into the Tournament.

[Sam Morrow]

I don't like the NBA.

That's racist.

[Bill Brightly]

I'm a Knicks fan, I don't like the NBA anymore.

[Nigel Islam]

I'm a Knicks fan, I don't like the NBA anymore.

Well if the Knicks ever get good again, Phil Jackson can pull a Pat Riley and coach them.

[Mike Sweeney]

I'm a Knicks fan, I don't like the NBA anymore.

I took my son to an Orlando Magic game in Orlando over the holidays just so we could see an NBA game. The $12 8 hot dogs at Streamsong look cheap in comparison to NBA food, and then you triple the ticket prices in NYC/Brooklyn, if you are crazy enough to pay, to watch unbelievable athletes play at 3/4 speed to save their bodies for the playoffs.

I will watch parts of the finals and semi-finals, when the NBA peaks.

All that said, I will probably catch one game this week of the Atlantic 10 tournament in Brooklyn to see the new arena and have a night out with some college basketball junkies....

Gil Hanse is not from Philly, Matt Ryan is a Philly/BC guy  

[Tim Martin]

I'm a Knicks fan, I don't like the NBA anymore.

As a lifelong Knicks fan all I can say is that 1973 was an awful long time ago. Anyone wondering about the significance of that date should be reminded that was the last time they collected a championship ring. The saga with Isaiah Thomas was horrid. They were an easy team to root for back in the day but not so much any more.

[Kyle Casella]

This is a stupid thread. What about Castle Stuart or Boston Golf Club? What about the outstanding resto work at Fenway, LACC, Fishers, Essex, Winged Foot, Kittansett, MPCC etc? If you didn't like the original premise of Doral before you were never going to like the after.

[Mark Bourgeois]

I'm a Knicks fan, I don't like the NBA anymore.

As a lifelong Knicks fan all I can say is that 1973 was an awful long time ago. Anyone wondering about the significance of that date should be reminded that was the last time they collected a championship ring. The saga with Isaiah Thomas was horrid. They were an easy team to root for back in the day but not so much any more.

At last, some material for a working analogy. Willis Reed 1970 finals ≈ Tiger 2008 US Open. Well, a better one for Reed is Gibson in Game 1 1988 WS but what the hell, we're not getting anywhere comparing someone who designs and builds unique fields for play with a couple of guys who simply play (and on a standardized court that does not change no matter the venue).

[Jason Thurman]

This is a stupid thread. What about Castle Stuart or Boston Golf Club? What about the outstanding resto work at Fenway, LACC, Fishers, Essex, Winged Foot, Kittansett, MPCC etc? If you didn't like the original premise of Doral before you were never going to like the after.

Right, and Paul George played a lot of good Playoff games last season and looked amazing for a few months earlier this year. Or, for NBA haters, Matt Ryan was almost named MVP in 2012.

It's not like I'm comparing Gil Hanse to Austin Rivers or Mark Sanchez. He's obviously talented. I'm just not sure that his resume warrants his lofty status on the GCA sacred cow list. He's a borderline all-star in the early part of his career. I don't dispute that, but I also don't get why everyone wants to throw him in the Hall of Fame already.

I actually did enjoy the original Doral. I'm sure I'd still like the new one, but I'm not surprised he brought more water into play. An honest 15 handicapper will lose far more balls at Rustic Canyon than at the new Trump Doral.

[jeffwarne]

This is a stupid thread. What about Castle Stuart or Boston Golf Club? What about the outstanding resto work at Fenway, LACC, Fishers, Essex, Winged Foot, Kittansett, MPCC etc? If you didn't like the original premise of Doral before you were never going to like the after.

 An honest 15 handicapper will lose far more balls at Rustic Canyon than at the new Trump Doral.

That should get the groupthinkers going
Look forward to someone "walking" us through that