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jim_lewis

  • Karma: +0/-0
optimum fairway height
« on: August 23, 2013, 05:30:51 PM »
At my club, we normally cut our Bermuda fairways at .45". Some of our low handicap members are asking that we lower them to .375". Does anyone know a club that cuts Bermuda fairways to .375". What does your club do? How about overseeded rye?
"Crusty"  Jim
Freelance Curmudgeon

Greg Tallman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: optimum fairway height
« Reply #1 on: August 23, 2013, 05:54:46 PM »
At my club, we normally cut our Bermuda fairways at .45". Some of our low handicap members are asking that we lower them to .375". Does anyone know a club that cuts Bermuda fairways to .375". What does your club do? How about overseeded rye?

.375 or 3/8ths is a rather common height for bermuda fairways. I am sure there are many clubs that cut lower than this.

Anthony_Nysse

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: optimum fairway height
« Reply #2 on: August 23, 2013, 06:16:57 PM »
Greg is correct. .375 isn't considered "low" for bermuda. Msny older players may not like it that tight, though.
Anthony J. Nysse
Director of Golf Courses & Grounds
Apogee Club
Hobe Sound, FL

Greg Tallman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: optimum fairway height
« Reply #3 on: August 23, 2013, 06:45:20 PM »
Greg is correct. .375 isn't considered "low" for bermuda. Msny older players may not like it that tight, though.

Anthony, what are you guys at at Pine Tree?

Carl Johnson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: optimum fairway height
« Reply #4 on: August 23, 2013, 09:33:55 PM »
I do not know what our Bermuda height is, but we keep it fairly short (piedmont N.C.).  Right now I'd prefer it a little shorter than it is, but I know that lots of factors come into play on cutting height and I trust my club's superintendent to keep it as tight as reasonably possible.  By the way, I am an older (o.k., old) high handicapper and for me, the tighter the better.  Our superintendent is a member of this site, so I'll see if I can get him to chime in.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2013, 09:39:32 PM by Carl Johnson »

Don_Mahaffey

Re: optimum fairway height
« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2013, 09:38:34 PM »
optimum fairway height is when no one is asking what your height of cut is.

jeffwarne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: optimum fairway height
« Reply #6 on: August 24, 2013, 01:16:30 AM »
optimum fairway height is when no one is asking what your height of cut is.

 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) :) :) :) :)
+10
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

Anthony_Nysse

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: optimum fairway height
« Reply #7 on: August 24, 2013, 10:31:15 AM »
Greg is correct. .375 isn't considered "low" for bermuda. Msny older players may not like it that tight, though.

Anthony, what are you guys at at Pine Tree?

Depending on time of year, we mow between .375-.425. I know a few area guys that mow at .300"
Anthony J. Nysse
Director of Golf Courses & Grounds
Apogee Club
Hobe Sound, FL

Matt Wharton

  • Karma: +1/-0
Re: optimum fairway height
« Reply #8 on: August 24, 2013, 12:12:26 PM »
Hello, I am the superintendent at Carl Johnson's course (Carolina Golf Club) in Charlotte, NC and here is my two cents.  With the exceptions of Quail Hollow Club, which hosts a PGA Tour event and one public facility east of town nobody overseeds fairways.  This is primarily to preserve the health and integrity of the bermudagrass turf through the winter dormant season.  The mowing height of most bermudagrass fairways in this area is somewhere around 0.5" and I know of several clubs that will go as high as 0.625".  Several superintendents (including myself) will start the season with a lower height and then raise the height gradually throughout the season.  This practice is also to help the turf survive the winter (more leaf surface area to photosynthesize and produce carbohydrates for storage going into dormancy).  At Carolina GC I start our season with a mowing height of 0.450" and end the season at 0.550" (we are currently at 0.525").  Now I will tell you the bench setting does not necessarily translate into an exact height of cut.  The size and weight of fairway mowers have a tremendous impact as does the soil composition (we are clay).  Three years ago I was mowing at 0.475" with Toro 6500's (we now use Toro 5510's) and a well respected superintendent from out west was playing as a guest and commented how he loved the tight fairways.  He thought they were mowed at 0.350" so the actual height of the fairway turf may not be exact to the height your superintendent is mowing.  

Carl, you mentioned you wish they were tighter and I can tell you finding a mowing height that satisfies both the low and high handicapper is the challenge.  Low handicappers want to impart spin on the ball and higher handicappers want to sweep the ball.  I know our head pro commented how he noticed a difference in the fairways when the cutting height finally got above 0.5" (surprisingly he was happy)!
Matthew Wharton, CGCS, MG
Idle Hour CC
Lexington, KY

Thomas Dai

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: optimum fairway height
« Reply #9 on: August 24, 2013, 03:03:06 PM »
optimum fairway height is when no one is asking what your height of cut is.
Nice line from Don. Both amusing and pertinent.
Comments so far have been about Bermuda. However, I'd be interested to know what would be the optimum cut height if the fairways at your course were annual meadow grass?
All the best

Paul Carey

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: optimum fairway height
« Reply #10 on: August 24, 2013, 04:47:27 PM »
Bald Head Island Club in NC at the coast mows very healthy Bermuda fairways at .350.  The decision is the superintendent's to raise if conditions warrant doing so.  At that height they are great to play from.


Carl Johnson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: optimum fairway height
« Reply #11 on: August 25, 2013, 09:02:50 PM »
Hello, I am the superintendent at Carl Johnson's course (Carolina Golf Club) in Charlotte, NC and here is my two cents.  With the exceptions of Quail Hollow Club, which hosts a PGA Tour event and one public facility east of town nobody overseeds fairways.  This is primarily to preserve the health and integrity of the bermudagrass turf through the winter dormant season.  The mowing height of most bermudagrass fairways in this area is somewhere around 0.5" and I know of several clubs that will go as high as 0.625".  Several superintendents (including myself) will start the season with a lower height and then raise the height gradually throughout the season.  This practice is also to help the turf survive the winter (more leaf surface area to photosynthesize and produce carbohydrates for storage going into dormancy).  At Carolina GC I start our season with a mowing height of 0.450" and end the season at 0.550" (we are currently at 0.525").

Matt, given the references to 0.425, 0.375 and 0.300 this (0.525) surprises me.  In spite of what I said about prefering tight cuts (dirt would be fine with me), our fairways seem to cut much tighter than others in the area.

  Now I will tell you the bench setting does not necessarily translate into an exact height of cut.  The size and weight of fairway mowers have a tremendous impact as does the soil composition (we are clay).  Three years ago I was mowing at 0.475" with Toro 6500's (we now use Toro 5510's) and a well respected superintendent from out west was playing as a guest and commented how he loved the tight fairways.  He thought they were mowed at 0.350" so the actual height of the fairway turf may not be exact to the height your superintendent is mowing.

Now I think I see that settings don't necessarily translate to the same result on each course.  Seemingly obvious now that you mention it. What about types of grass?  The old common Bermuda vs. the new, finer strains.  Is cutting both on the same fairway an issue? Another factor has to do with speed.  I equate tight cuts with roll, but when the course is wet, you don't get the roll or bounce you want, and that may lead to an impression (false) that the grass is cut higher?  Does that make any sense?

Carl, you mentioned you wish they were tighter and I can tell you finding a mowing height that satisfies both the low and high handicapper is the challenge.  Low handicappers want to impart spin on the ball and higher handicappers want to sweep the ball.  I know our head pro commented how he noticed a difference in the fairways when the cutting height finally got above 0.5" (surprisingly he was happy)!

In my experience our cut is much tighter than at other area club courses - I like that.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2013, 09:04:34 PM by Carl Johnson »

Matt Wharton

  • Karma: +1/-0
Re: optimum fairway height
« Reply #12 on: August 25, 2013, 09:50:43 PM »
Grass type does play a factor as different types can have different growth habits...i.e., common grows more rapidly than the hybrid 419.  One thing I failed to mention in my previous post is the use of plant growth regulators also have an impact.  Chemically treating the turf with a pgr helps regulate growth by slowing or inhibiting cell elongation.  The grass plants "tighten" up as the internode length (space between growing points on the plant) shortens providing a finer, tighter turf.  We use pgr's on all short-cut turf throughout the growing season to provide a better quality surface and manage clippings however the product must be applied on regular intervals to maintain the effect.  Sometimes weather can interfere with applications and if the effect is allowed to wear off, the turf will experience a surge of growth.

As a caretaker of a Donald Ross course I prefer the fairways to play firm and fast thus providing lots of ball roll.  If the course conditions are not firm and fast, you can rest assure Mother Nature has provided an over abundance of rainfall...which has been the case in our region this year.  When conditions are wet the turf becomes thick and lush (fat grass blades, etc.) and when conditions are dry the turf is more lean leading to faster fairways.  The mowing heights can be the same from week to week but the different weather conditions will make the dryer fairways seem to be shorter and tighter than the wet ones.
Matthew Wharton, CGCS, MG
Idle Hour CC
Lexington, KY

Carl Johnson

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Re: optimum fairway height
« Reply #13 on: August 26, 2013, 06:55:31 PM »
At my club, we normally cut our Bermuda fairways at .45". Some of our low handicap members are asking that we lower them to .375". Does anyone know a club that cuts Bermuda fairways to .375". What does your club do? How about overseeded rye?

Jim, what do you take from the responses so far?  Anything helpful?

Matt Day

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: optimum fairway height
« Reply #14 on: August 26, 2013, 08:36:33 PM »
Perth fairway and tee heights range between 8-12 mm (0.32-0.48") for bermuda grass and kikuyu. Most would be at the lower end of the scale from October to May with a higher cut in winter from June to September.

Matt mentioned PGR's, and a lot of our courses use programmed Primo applications right through summer for control of growth and seed head suppresion. We probably have the best growing conditions (sandy soils and hot dry summers) for Kikuyu within Australia and can get them reasonably firm with decent roll in summer when cut at 8-9mm at least twice a week.

jim_lewis

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: optimum fairway height
« Reply #15 on: August 26, 2013, 09:30:09 PM »
I appreciate all of the responses and hope to get some more. It is hard to reach any conclusion since the responses vary all the way from .30 to .625. It is clear that many variables are in play including geography, soil, and member expectations. In our case, I think height may not be as important as frequency of cut. .45 is probably low enough if you cut often enough. .45 cut today is better that .375 cut two days ago.

"Crusty"  Jim
Freelance Curmudgeon

Anthony_Nysse

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: optimum fairway height
« Reply #16 on: August 27, 2013, 05:52:48 AM »
I think that it is important to point out type of grass, when it comes to Bermuda. A pure, 419 or Celebration fairway will cut tighter because it's growing uniformly.  Older courses that may have 419 with Common and/or other bermudagrass contamination may not be able to be cut as tight because the Common/contaminated areas grow more aggressively, even with growth regulators. We had this issue at Long Cove. The "off types" prevented us from going lower than a certain height. Constant scalping of fairways is not good for the turf or the player.
Anthony J. Nysse
Director of Golf Courses & Grounds
Apogee Club
Hobe Sound, FL

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