News:

This discussion group is best enjoyed using Google Chrome, Firefox or Safari.


Bob_Huntley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #25 on: June 29, 2013, 07:41:26 PM »
Having played hardly any golf at all for a couple of years, I accepted an offer to play with an old friend in a Best Ball competition on the Dunes Course at MPCC. Starting at the first tee I knew I had made a serious mistake in accepting the outing. I won't go into the humiliation I suffered on hole after hole with fresh air shots, sclaffs, shanks, and every imaginable mistake a tyro would make.

At the dinner where the results were announced we didn't even get a mention for coming in last. I asked my partner for my card, he looked at me with an incredulous expression on his face and said "Why on earth do you want it, you shot a 115." I've cleaned that up a it as his language was somewhat cruder. That's when I told him that I needed it so that in future, if a kindly offer came my way again, I would pick up the card, look at the number and politely decline.

I wasn't about to change a habit of a lifetime to salvage my self-esteem.

Bob

Pat Burke

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #26 on: June 29, 2013, 07:52:14 PM »
If he qualified, it is what it is.
If given an exemption, the exemptions should be re examined.


jeffwarne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #27 on: June 29, 2013, 08:57:01 PM »
What I really feel sorry for this guy is not that he played poorly, that happens. But he's a teaching pro. Who's going to want to take lessons from a pro who can't break 100?

He shot 72 in one of the two events he played in last year
and we wouldn't be having this discussion if he'd WD'd, an all too often occurance.
If his students improve, it matters not what he shot in a one time event.
Plenty of great players can't teach a note.
Some of the worst tips I hear come from Tour players, and I got great help from a teacher who definitely couldn't break 90 on his best day

Do you want to take lesson from a guy who spends all year playing?....... or teaching
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

BHoover

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #28 on: June 29, 2013, 09:03:03 PM »
What I really feel sorry for this guy is not that he played poorly, that happens. But he's a teaching pro. Who's going to want to take lessons from a pro who can't break 100?

He shot 72 in one of the two events he played in last year
and we wouldn't be having this discussion if he'd WD'd, an all too often occurance.
If his students improve, it matters not what he shot in a one time event.
Plenty of great players can't teach a note.
Some of the worst tips I hear come from Tour players, and I got great help from a teacher who definitely couldn't break 90 on his best day

Do you want to take lesson from a guy who spends all year playing?....... or teaching

Not saying this guy isn't a great teacher. He very well may be. But what I am saying is that I can't imagine the notoriety is going to be good for business.

As a lawyer, I wouldn't generate a ton of business by losing a case. It may not have any bearing on whether I'm a good lawyer, but losing isn't good for business.

jeffwarne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #29 on: June 29, 2013, 09:25:19 PM »
What I really feel sorry for this guy is not that he played poorly, that happens. But he's a teaching pro. Who's going to want to take lessons from a pro who can't break 100?

He shot 72 in one of the two events he played in last year
and we wouldn't be having this discussion if he'd WD'd, an all too often occurance.
If his students improve, it matters not what he shot in a one time event.
Plenty of great players can't teach a note.
Some of the worst tips I hear come from Tour players, and I got great help from a teacher who definitely couldn't break 90 on his best day

Do you want to take lesson from a guy who spends all year playing?....... or teaching

Not saying this guy isn't a great teacher. He very well may be. But what I am saying is that I can't imagine the notoriety is going to be good for business.

As a lawyer, I wouldn't generate a ton of business by losing a case. It may not have any bearing on whether I'm a good lawyer, but losing isn't good for business.

In this case "losing a case" for him would be making a student worse, not playing poorly.
He's clearly not playing for a living.


I'm guessing the publicity he gets will IMPROVE business, not just because of the way he handled it, but also because it puts his name out in front of more people.
So say 10,000 people in his area saw the interview, and 90% are ignorant enough to make a bad score influence their decision
That's still 1000 people that may be potential clients that he didn't have before.

When I taught full time 15 years ago, I shot 72 on a difficult course to qualify in early July for the MET Open .
I then, for the next 6 weeks for 10-12 hours per day, proceeded to teach horrendous golfers, absorbing every ounce of their contagious horriffic  rythym, negative attitudes, and awful mechanics  as my "preparation" for the torture chamber otherwise known as Meteteconk, about as fun to play as VN looks.

didn't go so well for me there (88 in the first round), and there were plenty of people who beat me by 10-15 shots that round who made about 1/20th of what I made teaching that year.
Taking time off to prepare for that event to be physically and mentally prepared would have cost me tens of thousands of dollars during our busiest time of the year, as well as not have endeared me very well to my boss or membership.
The fact that I bounced back the next round didn't make me a better teacher than I was the first day.
The people that can't see the difference, wouldn't really make the best clients.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2013, 10:14:11 PM by jeffwarne »
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

John_Conley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #30 on: June 29, 2013, 10:08:16 PM »
What I really feel sorry for this guy is not that he played poorly, that happens. But he's a teaching pro. Who's going to want to take lessons from a pro who can't break 100?

Brian, he's not the teaching pro that can't break 100.

He's the teaching pro that - one time - didn't.

BIG difference.

ward peyronnin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #31 on: June 29, 2013, 10:15:04 PM »
I followed Michael for seven holes on the front nine of this round as he was paired with Patrick Rogers from Avon In  who is a past Walker Cupper and invited to play this summer at the Walker Cup "tryouts"

I walked with Michaels wife Brittany and here is the human element you guys lack and I think it brings a good perspective.

He finished second in a regional Indiana tournament earlier this spring which featured an automatic exemption and the two guys ahead of him ( he tied) bailed out. He got the nod last Wed.
He had worked 32 days in a row prior to the tourney.
His practice round was rained out so his first look at the course was competative rounds.
This was a chance for him to get two days off work ( at least) and take a little breather with his wife Brittany and play a great golf course.

His swing was not that great and he clearly did not know the angles. The set up was long and pretty hard ) 200 + par threes and 584 three shotters etc and swirling winds put a lot of doubt in the mind.

This is absolutely a course where once you start to go sideways it takes an Herculean effort to get it back.
He kept up and never demonstrated undue displays of anger, over aggressive drops , or asked for questionable relief.

This golf course can be played by those who have their house in order for that day or duration but unlike a Yeaman's Hall the guys who dion't have it going are going to be miserable.
He did only what was asked of him and did so gracefully and with his head up

I commend him and the golf course for revealing what was there to reveal
"Golf is happiness. It's intoxication w/o the hangover; stimulation w/o the pills. It's price is high yet its rewards are richer. Some say its a boys pastime but it builds men. It cleanses the mind/rejuvenates the body. It is these things and many more for those of us who truly love it." M.Norman

jeffwarne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #32 on: June 29, 2013, 10:22:41 PM »
+1 Ward
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

Nigel Islam

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #33 on: June 29, 2013, 10:52:26 PM »
Ward, did they play Thursday and Friday at the full 7200+? I was out for the pro am and they seemed to have everything back as far as they could. Just curious.

I'll vouch for the rainout of the practice round, because at one time on Monday I was wondering whether we were going to have New Orleans like floods in E-ville

Andy Troeger

Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #34 on: June 29, 2013, 11:11:24 PM »
Now I'm sure there's plenty of room on one or both sides at VN (the F word , fair ::) ::) ), but it appears that a ball could be lost on any swing.
ick

Make sure not to visit Prairie Dunes then. Or any number of courses when they haven't bothered to mow down the hay off the greens for awhile. I agree that I wouldn't want to play them in competition, but I'm not any good!

Andy,
There are plenty like that, some real close to home in fact ;)
Visiting a course is one thing, stroke play is another ;)

I almost mentioned one or two that would have been much closer to home for you. I think I had caddies at about five courses in NY last year tell me last May that "you would never find this ball in July once this stuff has grown up." I generally am pretty good at finding out how much a golf course will let you miss!  :D

Ward--thanks for the post!

ward peyronnin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #35 on: June 29, 2013, 11:31:40 PM »
There are 5 to 9 teeing grounds on every hole. Hard to say what exact yardage was today but it was more than 6900 but slightly less the tips at 7240.

Greens had just started to really firm but we got a bit of rain today that might have softened them and firm greens
are what really challenges these guys. hadwin shot 64 today which is extraordinary.
"Golf is happiness. It's intoxication w/o the hangover; stimulation w/o the pills. It's price is high yet its rewards are richer. Some say its a boys pastime but it builds men. It cleanses the mind/rejuvenates the body. It is these things and many more for those of us who truly love it." M.Norman

BHoover

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #36 on: June 30, 2013, 07:13:27 AM »
What I really feel sorry for this guy is not that he played poorly, that happens. But he's a teaching pro. Who's going to want to take lessons from a pro who can't break 100?

Brian, he's not the teaching pro that can't break 100.

He's the teaching pro that - one time - didn't.

BIG difference.


But he didn't break 100 the one time that people would take notice. Look, I'm not saying he isn't a good teaching pro. But I'm afraid this isn't going to help his teaching business. I hope I'm wrong, but I bet I'm not.

John_Conley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #37 on: June 30, 2013, 10:09:48 AM »
Brian, the people that won't take a lesson from him are the folks that don't understand the difference between can't break 100 and didn't.

I have no idea if this will be good or bad for his lesson book.

This begs the obvious.  What does a guy that normally shoots 100 fire on Victoria National from 7,000 yards.  They probably can't finish.

Wade Whitehead

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #38 on: June 30, 2013, 10:57:39 AM »
Who's going to want to take lessons from a pro who can't break 100?

I don't ever recall seeing Lou Holtz tackle a 230-pound fullback.

WW

Sam Morrow

Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #39 on: June 30, 2013, 11:33:34 AM »
Who's going to want to take lessons from a pro who can't break 100?

I don't ever recall seeing Lou Holtz tackle a 230-pound fullback.

WW

Lou played linebacker in college.

Marc Huther

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #40 on: June 30, 2013, 06:54:55 PM »
I agree no one questions your character when you finish.  Great that he was thinking of his students before himself. VN (radio) not a good course to have an off day...



Dónal Ó Ceallaigh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #41 on: June 30, 2013, 07:34:36 PM »
What I really feel sorry for this guy is not that he played poorly, that happens. But he's a teaching pro. Who's going to want to take lessons from a pro who can't break 100?

Brian, he's not the teaching pro that can't break 100.

He's the teaching pro that - one time - didn't.

BIG difference.


But he didn't break 100 the one time that people would take notice. Look, I'm not saying he isn't a good teaching pro. But I'm afraid this isn't going to help his teaching business. I hope I'm wrong, but I bet I'm not.

I admire the guy for not giving up. I'd certainly take a lesson with him; in fact I'd probably seek him out, solely for his attitude. I can imagine that with his attitude, he wouldn't give up on a student and would provide endless encouragement, no matter how hopless the student is.

Last year we had our season ending 4 club competition where we played off the ladies tees. I shot at least a 98 (I didn't finish out two holes), had 40 putts for 16 holes and only manage 4 pars. I ended up with 18 points, which is easily my worst score ever. I was hopeless, yet I felt I didn't play all that badly. I just couldn't understand what was happening. Funnily enough, I didn't feel embarrased, and then again, why should I havč? I signed the card an returned it. I agree with Scott, the NR is a gutless and cowardly act; only a little less gutless than the walk-off-course act.

John_Conley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #42 on: June 30, 2013, 08:45:34 PM »
There is another thread (two?) about Freakonomics.  I listen to their podcasts.  Anyway, one of them was an episode about quitting.  The conclusion was that those who quit on something are better off for it. 

A very interesting viewpoint that flies in the face of all the "never give up" suggestions out there.

Ronald Montesano

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #43 on: July 13, 2013, 09:47:46 PM »
Hopefully Bembenick took the 103 lightly, as this twitpic clearly did: pic.twitter.com/hTq6g6L5fG
Coming in 2024
~Elmira Country Club
~Soaring Eagles
~Bonavista
~Indian Hills
~Maybe some more!!

Patrick_Mucci

Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #44 on: July 14, 2013, 12:17:26 AM »
When the wheels start coming off, especially in an important competition, it's really hard to get your game back on track, especially on a challenging course.

The key is not to give up.

And yes, sign your card.

In golf, only one person's hands are connected to the club

Ronald Montesano

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #45 on: July 14, 2013, 08:08:07 AM »
Here's a question: when the wheels come off, should one go into protective mode and hit 4 iron off the tee, to insure no worse than bogey, or should one attempt to completely balance the boat, to get back into scoring mode?
Coming in 2024
~Elmira Country Club
~Soaring Eagles
~Bonavista
~Indian Hills
~Maybe some more!!

Patrick_Mucci

Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #46 on: July 14, 2013, 08:39:11 AM »
Here's a question: when the wheels come off, should one go into protective mode and hit 4 iron off the tee, to insure no worse than bogey, or should one attempt to completely balance the boat, to get back into scoring mode?

When the wheels come off, hitting 4-iron off the tee does NOT insure worse than bogey, in fact it's just the opposite.


Ronald Montesano

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #47 on: July 14, 2013, 11:12:37 AM »
See, that's not the case for me, oh green one. I'll smash 4-iron into the fairway and work my way back from there. Have you a personal approach or, as the French say, a method, for lug-nutting the wheels back on?
Coming in 2024
~Elmira Country Club
~Soaring Eagles
~Bonavista
~Indian Hills
~Maybe some more!!

Andrew Buck

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #48 on: July 14, 2013, 11:36:58 AM »

Speaking recently with one of those club pro types who has done well in the national stage, he commented that even at the college level, where they are supposed to be "longer than Tiger and Phil" only the top 1-3 of any team of 10 are really 300 yard hitters.  For the bottom half, who may hit tee balls as low as 260 yards, they keep most NCAA tournament courses to 7250 yards or so.


Tell mike small hi. :D

Actually, given the number of courses built in the last 20 years that have lost ball/OB potential on both sides , it's still very rare to see tour guys playing these types of courses.  If they do play some holes like that, they normally allow player to hit a 3 wood and still have a mid-iron or less.
« Last Edit: July 15, 2013, 11:51:15 AM by Andrew Buck »

BHoover

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Club pro shoots 103 during Web.com Tour event
« Reply #49 on: July 14, 2013, 05:59:29 PM »
I take back everything I said about this guy a few weeks back. After playing horribly in my club championship qualifier this weekend, I'm seriously contemplating taking up another hobby.

You can play well in casual rounds, but there's something about competition, even at the club level, that just doesn't fit well for me.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2013, 06:04:31 PM by Brian Hoover »

Tags:
Tags:

An Error Has Occurred!

Call to undefined function theme_linktree()
Back