[Jim_Coleman]

    Admittedly I'm not a fan, and I lack credibility on this, but I am pretty sure I watched Tiger take another bad drop today.  As I arrived on the property  from the P&W, I was walking down the right side of 12 when a ball landed about 10 yards from me, in the 5-6 inch rough.  The ball took a little hop and disappeared.  Lo and behold, Tiger arrived looking for his ball.  He leaned over, made no attempt to investigate whether the ball had pierced the ground, and called for an official.  When one came over, he picked the ball up, looked to the official for confirmation, and took a drop.  Neither bent over to look closely to determine if the ball had plugged.  The radio announcer (they give you a receiver to listen to ESPN's play by play), immediately commented that the ball had hopped when it landed, and questioned the drop.  I am quite sure a 357 magnum wouldn't have plugged in that rough.

[Mac Plumart]

I am pretty sure I watched Tiger cheat today


If true, disappointing.  

[Mark Bourgeois]

Can somebody post the rules of this competition for the situation? Was it Appendix I, 4a or was it 4b?

[Donnie Beck]

Because once a cheat always a cheat... I lost all respect for this guy this year.. Classless!!

[Ron Csigo]

Was Brad Klein walking with this group today?  Thought I saw him on TV with this group when they teed off on #11 to start their second round.

[Donnie Beck]

I saw Brad with the group as well...

[Andy Treen]

Why do we assume he was taking relief from a plugged ball...

Did he say that to the official?

If he was identifying his golf ball he followed proper procedure.

Sometimes the rules work in the players benefit.

- Andy

[Ricardo Ramirez Calvo]

Andy,

I don't think that is entirely correct. I he was identifying the ball, he should have announced to his marker that he would lift his ball to identify it, mark it and then lift it. It is true that if his marker was not readily available, he could have used an official instead of his marker. But he then took a drop. If he was identifying his ball, he should have replaced it. Instead, he dropped it. So he was taking relief from some situation.

[Andy Treen]

Rightly so must be replaced.

[Mark Bourgeois]

Maybe a 24-2 thing like a sprinkler head?

[Mac Plumart]

Hope its not a 13-1 thing.

[Mark Bourgeois]

Or God help us a 33-7. 

[Pete_Pittock]

   Admittedly I'm not a fan, and I lack credibility on this, but I am pretty sure I watched Tiger cheat today.  As I arrived on the property  from the P&W, I was walking down the right side of 12 when a ball landed about 10 yards from me, in the 5-6 inch rough.  The ball took a little hop and disappeared.  Lo and behold, Tiger arrived looking for his ball.  He leaned over, made no attempt to investigate whether the ball had pierced the ground, and called for an official.  When one came over, he picked the ball up, looked to the official for confirmation, and took a drop.  Neither bent over to look closely to determine if the ball had plugged.  The radio announcer (they give you a receiver to listen to ESPN's play by play), immediately commented that the ball had hopped when it landed, and questioned the drop.  I am quite sure a 357 magnum wouldn't have plugged in that rough.

Did anyone mention to the official that the ball had hopped (and didn't end up in his ball plug)?
Did his ball end up where there would be oobstruction relief, such as from a sprinkler head?
Do you know why the referee granted relief?

[BHoover]

Unfortunately, I can't say I'm surprised. Tiger is definitely not Tom Watson when it comes to integrity on the course.

[Jim_Coleman]

   When I feel the need to identify my ball in the rough, I don't pick it up.  I just rotate it it as little as possible until I can identify it, thereby keeping the same lie.  Is this incorrect?

[Pete_Pittock]

   When I feel the need to identify my ball in the rough, I don't pick it up.  I just rotate it it as little as possible until I can identify it, thereby keeping the same lie.  Is this incorrect?

Yes, it is incorrect. You must let a fellow competitor know, and mark the ball's position before touching it.

[Jerry Kluger]

Exactly why do we care if Brad Klein was following this group?

[Pete_Pittock]

    Admittedly I'm not a fan, and I lack credibility on this, but I am pretty sure I watched Tiger cheat today.  As I arrived on the property  from the P&W, I was walking down the right side of 12 when a ball landed about 10 yards from me, in the 5-6 inch rough.  The ball took a little hop and disappeared.  Lo and behold, Tiger arrived looking for his ball.  He leaned over, made no attempt to investigate whether the ball had pierced the ground, and called for an official.  When one came over, he picked the ball up, looked to the official for confirmation, and took a drop.  Neither bent over to look closely to determine if the ball had plugged.  The radio announcer (they give you a receiver to listen to ESPN's play by play), immediately commented that the ball had hopped when it landed, and questioned the drop.  I am quite sure a 357 magnum wouldn't have plugged in that rough.

Usually the referee will call in on the radio, as well as provide a written report at the end of the round on anything he saw or was called to make a ruling.

[Jim_Coleman]

   I do notify a competitor, but I don't pick it up and drop it.  I rotate it in its place so as not to change the lie.  I always figured that picking it up provided me with an advantage.  I used to play with a guy who "identified" half his balls in the rough by picking them up.  Have I been cheating myself all these years?

[BHoover]

Aren't you permitted to identify your ball by notifying your playing partner and then picking it up but then replacing it exactly in the same position?

[Pete_Pittock]

   I do notify a competitor, but I don't pick it up and drop it.  I rotate it in its place so as not to change the lie.  I always figured that picking it up provided me with an advantage.  I used to play with a guy who "identified" half his balls in the rough by picking them up.  Have I been cheating myself all these years?

Jim, Decision 12-2/2 covers this and you are in error

12-2/2
Touching and Rotating Half-Buried Ball in Rough for Identification Purposes
Q. A ball is half buried in the rough. Having announced his intention in advance to his opponent, marker or fellow-competitor, the player, for the purpose of identifying the ball, touches the ball and rotates it. By so doing he identifies the ball as his ball. Is there a penalty?
A. Yes, for touching the ball other than as provided for in the Rules (Rule 18-2a). Under Rules 12-2 and 20-1, a ball may be lifted (or touched and rotated) for identification purposes after its position has been marked. If the player had marked the position of the ball before rotating it, there would have been no penalty, assuming the rotating did not result in the ball being cleaned beyond the extent necessary to identify it.
Related Decisions:
· 18-2a/33 Rotating Ball on Putting Green Without Marking Position.

[David Federman]

I generally enjoy reading the posts on this site - but the constant barrage of tiger hate is just getting to be over the top. Every single move Tiger makes (especially at the Open and most all other golf tournaments) is seen from multple camera angles and numerous witnesses on site. At the Open each group has a rules official; Tiger's group is followed by multiple TV commentators and cameras; if there was any hint of a bad drop (in light of the 15th at the Master's) or some other violation on Tiger's part, it would all over - yet on this site it is not even raised as a possibility. Tried, convicted and executed - Tiger cheated! DQ the SOB!

[Matthew Rose]

Quick - to the rule mobile!

(Imagines Mike Davis picking up a red phone with a blinking light on a secure line somewhere in the bowels of the Merion clubhouse attic).

[Jim Nugent]

David Federman, from what Jim Coleman said, the ESPN announcers WERE all over it.  They immediately questioned the drop.  On top of which, Jim gave us live, in-person testimony. 

Officials mean little: the officials at the Masters approved a clear rules violation by Tiger, and let him play on the weekend when they should have DQ'd him.  Other officials let him consider a one-ton or so boulder a "loose impediment" that took ten or more fans to move. 

Maybe there's more to it than Jim saw or understood, but I for one would like to know exactly what happened. 

[Doug Ralston]

*yawn*

Doug

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