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Bart Bradley

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Who has the inside skinny on Orchard Lake in MI?  It appears they have been doing renovation work on this Colt and Allison course (web search info). 

How about Wakonda in IA? Again, via a google search it appears that Langford designed the course.  A cursory review of the club's website doesn't seem to tout the Langford heritage much and truthfully the picture on the page titled "golf" is less than inspiring. 

But Ran's next 50 list isn't produced at random and he sometimes  ;) has some decent inside information, so let's hear it.

Bart

K. Krahenbuhl

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #1 on: April 28, 2013, 10:11:53 PM »
Wakonda will host a Champions Tour event in about a month.

Jason Topp

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #2 on: April 28, 2013, 11:30:34 PM »
Bart:

I played Wakonda many times as a kid - it has been nearly 30 years since I have played it.  It is a terrific golf course with dramatically rolling terrain and many trademark eyelash bunkers, some of which have been filled in over the years.  Large old hardwood trees cover the property.  The greens demand very accurate iron play as they are often perched on top of hills and heavily defended by bunkers.  Two of the par 3's - #2 and #9 feature alternate greens.

The start is the most memorable part of the course with a tough as nails par 4 that is narrow off the tee and slopes up to a green on a hillside.  My memory says the hole is about 435 yards.  The second is either a short pitch to a green in a valley or a mid/long iron uphill to a green on a hilltop depending on the hole they have in play that day.  The third and fourth are very difficult but beautiful longish par fours and the fifth is a par five up and over a big hill with water at the spot where a mindless second would fly.  Thirty years ago, the hole was reachable in two for professionals but a solid 3 shot hole for the rest of us. 

By contrast the finisher is unique and some might think of it as a dud compared to the rest of the course.  It is short, maybe 300-320 yards, uphill to a hog back fairway that plays more narrow than it appears from the tee. 

From a pure GCA standpoint the course would be a terrific candidate for a restoration. 

Frank Sekulic

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #3 on: April 29, 2013, 11:52:04 AM »
There are a few courses in there I have never heard of as well such as Glen Arven or St.George's but, I can say from having played the course a handful of times, he will absolutely love Rancho Santa Fe CC and it's awesome set of greens.

Mark Saltzman

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #4 on: April 29, 2013, 12:24:07 PM »
Bart,

Here is a photo tour of OLCC I did last year: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,51441.0.html

I know you don't like to look at courses you've never played, but just take a quick peek at the great land movement and you'll want to get out there.

They are also just finishing a Keith Foster restoration. 

Niall Hay

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #5 on: April 29, 2013, 12:54:38 PM »
Who has the inside skinny on Orchard Lake in MI?  It appears they have been doing renovation work on this Colt and Allison course (web search info). 

But Ran's next 50 list isn't produced at random and he sometimes  ;) has some decent inside information, so let's hear it.

Bart

Orchard Lake Country Club – Colt & Alison

Building a first class golf course was one of the earliest and most important projects undertaken at Orchard Lake. Construction of the golf course began in the spring of 1926, under the direction of Captain C.H. Alison, of the British firm of Colt and Alison, an internationally known firm of golf course architects. Captain Alison said the course was built for the average player but it could be transformed, within two or three months, into a professional championship course. The course opened for play on August 3, 1927.

http://www.orchardlakecountryclub.com/

Niall Hay

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #6 on: April 29, 2013, 12:55:19 PM »
Bart,

Here is a photo tour of OLCC I did last year: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,51441.0.html

I know you don't like to look at courses you've never played, but just take a quick peek at the great land movement and you'll want to get out there.

They are also just finishing a Keith Foster restoration. 

Mark’s Photo Tour is excellent…

Bart Bradley

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #7 on: April 29, 2013, 04:27:55 PM »
Mark:

Thanks a lot.  Should have known you did a thread ;).  Does look great...I assume that your photos pre-date the renovation?  Must be even more exciting now.

Bart

Niall Hay

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #8 on: April 29, 2013, 09:21:44 PM »
Mark:

Thanks a lot.  Should have known you did a thread ;).  Does look great...I assume that your photos pre-date the renovation?  Must be even more exciting now.

Bart

Yes, the photos pre-date the renovation. We all hope that he does a before and after. 

Dan Moore

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #9 on: April 30, 2013, 03:11:20 PM »
Wakonda is an excellent course on a terrific property that could be really special.    If the club would look at Skokie and Lawsonia to see what they could have if they restored Langford's bunkers and opened up some fairways corridors and vistas, I think they could have a top 100 course.  Yes, its potentially that good.  It will be very interesting to see how its received by the Seniors the end of May. 
"Is there any other game which produces in the human mind such enviable insanity."  Bernard Darwin

Adam Clayman

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #10 on: April 30, 2013, 04:09:47 PM »
Wakonda has less than zero recognizable L&M. Other than some evidence of original bunkering well within the tree's canopy.

The story I heard was a local lawyer loved the place so much he brought in someone to update it. What a misguided pity.

I have the original routing in an artists rendering. (L&M) A good chunk of the original is across the road and now a neighborhood of houses. Recapturing the original feel of the talented design team is highly unlikely.
"It's unbelievable how much you don't know about the game you've been playing your whole life." - Mickey Mantle

Jason Topp

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #11 on: April 30, 2013, 04:12:37 PM »
Wakonda has less than zero recognizable L&M. Other than some evidence of original bunkering well within the tree's canopy.

The story I heard was a local lawyer loved the place so much he brought in someone to update it. What a misguided pity.

I have the original routing in an artists rendering. (L&M) A good chunk of the original is across the road and now a neighborhood of houses. Recapturing the original feel of the talented design team is highly unlikely.

I'd love to see that rendering.  I am really surprised.  I think it is a terrific course as is but could use a lot of tree removal.

Adam Clayman

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #12 on: April 30, 2013, 05:33:28 PM »
Jason, I will try to get some pictures up. Too many forces at work to know whether that will be successful. i.e. new phone with unfamiliar platform.
"It's unbelievable how much you don't know about the game you've been playing your whole life." - Mickey Mantle

Niall Hay

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #13 on: April 30, 2013, 09:31:23 PM »
Who has the inside skinny on Orchard Lake in MI?  It appears they have been doing renovation work on this Colt and Allison course (web search info). 

But Ran's next 50 list isn't produced at random and he sometimes  ;) has some decent inside information, so let's hear it.

Bart

http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,55500.0.html

Jason Topp

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #14 on: April 30, 2013, 10:15:09 PM »
Jason, I will try to get some pictures up. Too many forces at work to know whether that will be successful. i.e. new phone with unfamiliar platform.

Thanks Adam

Jason Topp

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #15 on: April 30, 2013, 10:25:35 PM »
Adam:

I looked up an aerial labeled as being from the 30's up to 2008 on the Iowa DNR site and the routing and location look the same as the present course.  Are you sure your rendering was actually built?  This website is cool because you can click from decade to decade on the same spot.

http://programs.iowadnr.gov/maps/aerials/
« Last Edit: April 30, 2013, 10:32:31 PM by Jason Topp »

Adam Clayman

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #16 on: May 01, 2013, 01:05:41 PM »
Jason, I do believe that the course was built as per the rendering I have. It's dated circa 1918 and labeled "Job 98".
Plus, I spoke with someone there who I recall telling me about it.

I've taken some pics and will try to figure out how to get them posted. It's my first Android and am clueless. (hint hint)
"It's unbelievable how much you don't know about the game you've been playing your whole life." - Mickey Mantle

Jason Thurman

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #17 on: May 01, 2013, 01:31:43 PM »
Adam:

I looked up an aerial labeled as being from the 30's up to 2008 on the Iowa DNR site and the routing and location look the same as the present course.  Are you sure your rendering was actually built?  This website is cool because you can click from decade to decade on the same spot.

http://programs.iowadnr.gov/maps/aerials/


Coolest website ever. Crazy to see how some of the older courses in the Des Moines area have changed. Waveland isn't even remotely the same golf course anymore.

I never played Wakonda during my time in Des Moines, but it's on the list if I ever get back that way. I've always heard wonderful things, though I'm sad to hear that much of the Langford and Moreau original might be gone.
"There will always be haters. That’s just the way it is. Hating dudes marry hating women and have hating ass kids." - Evan Turner

Some of y'all have never been called out in bold green font and it really shows.

Dan Moore

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #18 on: May 01, 2013, 01:33:41 PM »
Wakonda had 27 holes originally.  They sold the land north of the road and eliminated 9 holes along the way.  There was some change to 1 or 2 of the remaining 18 holes as a result.  I can post the routing tonight. 
"Is there any other game which produces in the human mind such enviable insanity."  Bernard Darwin

Dan Moore

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #19 on: May 01, 2013, 06:38:57 PM »
Here is Langford and Moreau's original plan for Wakonda and a current view.  With 1-2 exceptions (par 3 2nd and par 3 9th) the routing consists of intact original holes from each of the nines.  I do not know for sure but many of the greens may still be original.  Virtually all of the original bunkering is gone.  There are many exceptional golf holes and great use of natural topography. 



"Is there any other game which produces in the human mind such enviable insanity."  Bernard Darwin

Jason Topp

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #20 on: May 01, 2013, 07:53:42 PM »
Adam Clayman provided me with these shots.  I am going to post them full sized because it is difficult to pick up the detail otherwise.  It took me a bit to orient myself but I believe North is on the left side of the picture.  The 18 holes to the right correspond pretty closely to the current course other than the par 3 (now the 2nd) is reversed in direction.

The holes to the North are strange to me.  It appears that there are only six of them.





Jason Topp

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #21 on: May 01, 2013, 08:01:56 PM »
I found the extra holes!  There are 7 to the North (one par 3 is squeezed in the middle) a Par 4 is on the South side of the road and there is an extra par 3 in the area where they now have alternate greens.  Very cool! 

It shows that extra space on an old golf course that looks like a golf hole probably was a golf hole.

Adam Clayman

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #22 on: May 01, 2013, 10:03:57 PM »
How about that shared fairway on the right side? No way is it like that now?  What is that? The current 3rd and 4th? 2nd and 3rd?
"It's unbelievable how much you don't know about the game you've been playing your whole life." - Mickey Mantle

Dan Moore

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #23 on: May 01, 2013, 10:42:25 PM »
Adam,  You are correct its not like that now.  Its the 8th and 10th holes that has the connected fairway and bunker complex.  Most if not all of the original L/M landforms for the fairway bunkers are still there even if grassed in. 

Here are a couple of shots to show why Wakonda is such an intriguing a candidate for a complete L/M restoration.   

These are of the 1st hole showing the nature of the terrain and a beautiful lost bunker.







And a view from the tee of the 10th hole showing some of the beauty of the property.



"Is there any other game which produces in the human mind such enviable insanity."  Bernard Darwin

Morgan Clawson

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Re: Two courses in Ran's next 50 that I don't know much about?
« Reply #24 on: May 01, 2013, 11:01:41 PM »
Crazy that there's no sand in that bunker on 1.

It would make that hole more intriguing from the tee ( your 1st photo?)

Looks like it's mostly a directional bunker, so they possibly took out the sand to save $.