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Joe Bausch

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Happy Birthday, Merion (commemorative booklet available)
« on: September 20, 2012, 11:03:47 AM »
Jeff Silverman penned an article for the Sept 10 issue of GolfWorld magazine entitled:

Happy Birthday, Merion.
The Historic Philadelphia-Area Course Celebrates 100 Years This Month Yet Remains As Clever And Cajoling As It Was When Hugh Wilson Designed It In 1912


You can read it online here:

http://www.golfworldmagazine.com/golfworld/20120910/?pg=47#pg47
« Last Edit: September 21, 2012, 12:35:11 PM by Joe Bausch »
@jwbausch (for new photo albums)
The site for the Cobb's Creek project:  https://cobbscreek.org/
Nearly all Delaware Valley golf courses in photo albums: Bausch Collection

Mark McKeever

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Re: Happy Birthday, Merion
« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2012, 11:06:05 AM »
Happy Birthday!!   ;D

Mark
Best MGA showers - Bayonne

"Dude, he's a total d***"

Joe Bausch

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Re: Happy Birthday, Merion
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2012, 11:19:13 AM »
For me the bold statement that should lead to discussion is the following:

Because what Hugh Wilson.... finessed beneath a patch of exhausted Pennsylvania farmland remains a prototype of what a sophisticated, modern–yes, modern–American parkland journey can be.
@jwbausch (for new photo albums)
The site for the Cobb's Creek project:  https://cobbscreek.org/
Nearly all Delaware Valley golf courses in photo albums: Bausch Collection

Dan Herrmann

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Re: Happy Birthday, Merion
« Reply #3 on: September 21, 2012, 07:45:25 AM »
Joe - wasn't he talking about Merion West?  :) :)

Kris Shreiner

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Re: Happy Birthday, Merion
« Reply #4 on: September 21, 2012, 08:06:21 AM »
Hoisting a frosty in the white stein they offer to the thirsty there at Merion is one of golf's great pleasures. Always a treat... cheers to 100 years of great golf at Philly's most beguiling track!

See ya at the Open,

Kris 8)

"I said in a talk at the Dunhill Tournament in St. Andrews a few years back that I thought any of the caddies I'd had that week would probably make a good golf course architect. We all want to ask golfers of all abilities to get more out of their games -caddies do that for a living." T.Doak

Mike Sweeney

Re: Happy Birthday, Merion
« Reply #5 on: September 21, 2012, 08:33:28 AM »
For me the bold statement that should lead to discussion is the following:

Because what Hugh Wilson.... finessed beneath a patch of exhausted Pennsylvania farmland remains a prototype of what a sophisticated, modern–yes, modern–American parkland journey can be.

1. Please name one course built after 1960 (modern) with OB on 14-15 holes depending on how you count.

2. I really don't think "parkland" when I think of Merion. Quarries and parks seem like opposites, to me.

Merion is certainly not a prototype, however it is unique.

Joe Bausch

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Re: Happy Birthday, Merion
« Reply #6 on: September 21, 2012, 11:37:22 AM »
Merion Golf Club has recently published a commemorative booklet, A Centennial Celebration of the East Course, penned by Jeff Silverman as well.  It is a true joy to read (about 50 pages with a couple of neat fold-outs of the current and original layout).

If you are interesting in purchasing a copy, please contact MGC directly and ask for the pro shop.
@jwbausch (for new photo albums)
The site for the Cobb's Creek project:  https://cobbscreek.org/
Nearly all Delaware Valley golf courses in photo albums: Bausch Collection

Sam Morrow

Re: Happy Birthday, Merion
« Reply #7 on: September 21, 2012, 06:04:07 PM »
For me the bold statement that should lead to discussion is the following:

Because what Hugh Wilson.... finessed beneath a patch of exhausted Pennsylvania farmland remains a prototype of what a sophisticated, modern–yes, modern–American parkland journey can be.

1. Please name one course built after 1960 (modern) with OB on 14-15 holes depending on how you count.

2. I really don't think "parkland" when I think of Merion. Quarries and parks seem like opposites, to me.

Merion is certainly not a prototype, however it is unique.


I've played lots of courses with OB on 14 or 15 holes. The club I grew up at had OB on 22 of the 27 holes.

Sean_A

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Re: Happy Birthday, Merion (commemorative booklet available)
« Reply #8 on: September 22, 2012, 04:59:29 AM »
Mike

Merion is as parkland as parkland gets - a truly classic example of the type.

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Sean_A

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Re: Happy Birthday, Merion
« Reply #9 on: September 22, 2012, 02:34:09 PM »
Merion Golf Club has recently published a commemorative booklet, A Centennial Celebration of the East Course, penned by Jeff Silverman as well.  It is a true joy to read (about 50 pages with a couple of neat fold-outs of the current and original layout).

If you are interesting in purchasing a copy, please contact MGC directly and ask for the pro shop.

Joe

Thanks for the heads up. I tried to order the pamphlet,  but was told it isn't published yet.

Ciao 
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Mike Sweeney

Re: Happy Birthday, Merion (commemorative booklet available)
« Reply #10 on: September 22, 2012, 04:37:34 PM »
Mike

Merion is as parkland as parkland gets - a truly classic example of the type.

Ciao

???

Merion East's site was an old Pennsylvania working crop farm that never had any classic landscape architecture applied to it and hence it never was and is not a true "parkland" style golf course. While you may argue that they grew a park on top of the golf course, you have to hit a pretty bad shot to hit a tree.

With a little help from Wiki and the archives here, I suggest the following:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landscape_architecture

The landscape architecture history of "parks" essentially came from the English landscape architecture school of planned landscape architecture set on and amongst the massive English estates of the landed gentry (and generally contiguous to and around the massive mansion houses). Those places were universally known as "parks" and hence the term "parkland." It is also interesting and noteworthy that these mansions actually predated man-made golf architecture by up to 150 to 200 years.

It the USA, The Creek, Sleepy Hollow, Overbrook (modern), and in Ireland, Adare Manor are probably the best example of former estates with "parks" that are now golf courses that I can think of.

Merion may be 100 miles from the ocean, but that does not make it a "Parkland" course, IMO.
 

BCrosby

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Re: Happy Birthday, Merion (commemorative booklet available)
« Reply #11 on: September 22, 2012, 06:07:45 PM »
On the OB question, was Ardmore Ave. always played as OB or is that a recent thing?

Bob

Sean_A

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Re: Happy Birthday, Merion (commemorative booklet available)
« Reply #12 on: September 23, 2012, 04:40:16 AM »
Mike

Merion is as parkland as parkland gets - a truly classic example of the type.

Ciao

???

Merion East's site was an old Pennsylvania working crop farm that never had any classic landscape architecture applied to it and hence it never was and is not a true "parkland" style golf course. While you may argue that they grew a park on top of the golf course, you have to hit a pretty bad shot to hit a tree.

With a little help from Wiki and the archives here, I suggest the following:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landscape_architecture

The landscape architecture history of "parks" essentially came from the English landscape architecture school of planned landscape architecture set on and amongst the massive English estates of the landed gentry (and generally contiguous to and around the massive mansion houses). Those places were universally known as "parks" and hence the term "parkland." It is also interesting and noteworthy that these mansions actually predated man-made golf architecture by up to 150 to 200 years.

It the USA, The Creek, Sleepy Hollow, Overbrook (modern), and in Ireland, Adare Manor are probably the best example of former estates with "parks" that are now golf courses that I can think of.

Merion may be 100 miles from the ocean, but that does not make it a "Parkland" course, IMO.
 


Mike

I understand the origin behind the name parkland.  However, it doesn't take long before a piece of land under intense use for a specific purpose before it is transformed.  The property has been altered to essentially become the estate of the club.  No question whatsoever, that now, Merion could only be considered a parkland course.  It looks and plays parkland so its parkland.  

If we followed the original definition of parkland there would be very, few examples of the type.  

Ciao
« Last Edit: September 23, 2012, 05:37:58 AM by Sean Arble »
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Rich Goodale

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Re: Happy Birthday, Merion (commemorative booklet available)
« Reply #13 on: September 23, 2012, 05:08:28 AM »
Mike

I fully agree with Sean, above.  A significant part of the land in the East Coast of the USA was pasture land in the 19th century, even up to the mid 20th century.  I grew up on a "Pasture Lane" and the house my parents (and the others in the development) built in 1951 was on a stark open field only recently vacated by herds of cows. Today the development is a rain forest.

You can created "parkland golf" on any arable land, regardless of its previous use.  What you cannot do is create linksland (or even heathland/downland) on arable land unless you are committed to some significant geo-engineering expenses which involves the introduction of large quantities of sand (viz. Kingsbarns and Castle Stuart).

Merion looks like parkland and plays like parkland and would quack like parkland if it were a duck.  IMHO.

Rich
Life is good.

Any afterlife is unlikely and/or dodgy.

Jean-Paul Parodi

Mike Sweeney

Re: Happy Birthday, Merion (commemorative booklet available)
« Reply #14 on: September 23, 2012, 07:00:55 AM »
You two ex-pats sound like you work for Troon Golf!!

http://www.troongolf.com/troon_facility.cml?cmd=view&id=rawls_texas_tech

"Carved out of an old cotton farm, The Rawls Course was created to test the skills of the country's best collegiate players while providing an enjoyable social venue for the university community. Renowned golf course architect Tom Doak designed the course, relying more on his imagination than the original contours of the land. Doak moved 1.3 million cubic yards of topsoil to create a challenging parkland course defined by undulating greens, wide fairways, and deep bunkers. By design, the course mimics the eroded features and canyons of the South Plains Caprock region. The fairway contours and rugged bunkers emulate the natural erosion of the land worn down by wind and water, giving the course an appealing rustic look."

We will just have to agree to disagree on this one.  ;)


Dan Herrmann

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Re: Happy Birthday, Merion (commemorative booklet available)
« Reply #15 on: September 23, 2012, 07:05:18 AM »
Mike - do you consider it parkland today?  Actually, does Philly have any parkland courses, given your thesis?

Mike Sweeney

Re: Happy Birthday, Merion (commemorative booklet available)
« Reply #16 on: September 23, 2012, 07:27:40 AM »
Mike - do you consider it parkland today?  Actually, does Philly have any parkland courses, given your thesis?

Dan,

When I was a kid, the 17th hole on The East played over a pond (they filled the quarry with water)!!  Someone decided to try and make it into a park like setting, and for obvious reasons it was reversed.

Sure I get it, a park is grown out of the ground similar to a golf course, so I understand what Rich and Sean are saying. I am not trying to pierce some links vs faux-links definition around say Maidstone debate.

I am simply saying that The East is a unique course and setting due to the quarry, the conditioning, the philosophy of the club and history of the course.

I would consider The West to be an example of a Parkland course despite the fact that it too probably started as a farm (not sure).

Sean_A

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Re: Happy Birthday, Merion (commemorative booklet available)
« Reply #17 on: September 23, 2012, 11:32:51 AM »
Okay Mike, we talk about it over a pint.  I'll buy the first round.  Since there is slim and no chance you are gonna convince me that Merion isn't a parkland course, indeed, its perhaps the finest example of the type in the world, you better bring cash to buy the 2nd round. 

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Joe Bausch

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Re: Happy Birthday, Merion
« Reply #18 on: September 23, 2012, 07:49:39 PM »
Merion Golf Club has recently published a commemorative booklet, A Centennial Celebration of the East Course, penned by Jeff Silverman as well.  It is a true joy to read (about 50 pages with a couple of neat fold-outs of the current and original layout).

If you are interesting in purchasing a copy, please contact MGC directly and ask for the pro shop.

Joe

Thanks for the heads up. I tried to order the pamphlet,  but was told it isn't published yet.

Ciao 

Sean, there must have been a misunderstanding.  Call them again as they certainly do have this 50 page booklet available.  It is right next to the register!

Note, Jeff's full scale book on Merion has not been published yet and perhaps somehow that got into the conversation and led to the confusion.
@jwbausch (for new photo albums)
The site for the Cobb's Creek project:  https://cobbscreek.org/
Nearly all Delaware Valley golf courses in photo albums: Bausch Collection

Mike Sweeney

Re: Happy Birthday, Merion (commemorative booklet available)
« Reply #19 on: September 23, 2012, 08:15:44 PM »
Okay Mike, we talk about it over a pint.  I'll buy the first round.  Since there is slim and no chance you are gonna convince me that Merion isn't a parkland course, indeed, its perhaps the finest example of the type in the world, you better bring cash to buy the 2nd round. 

Ciao

Sean,

I am originally from Philadelphia.

I will take the first round and then I will NOT try to convince you on anything. Maybe Rich can pick up the second round!

Thanks for the beer.  ;) :D ;D

PS. I could have been an awesome rater, but Brad rejected me !  :D ;D

Is Pine Valley a "parkland", "heathland", or other?

ChipOat

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Re: Happy Birthday, Merion (commemorative booklet available)
« Reply #20 on: September 24, 2012, 04:52:18 PM »
Bob Crosby,

Until 1924, holes # 10, 11 and 12 crossed Ardmore Avenue, which was definitely not OB.  However, since 1924, no holes cross Ardmore Avenue and it is OB.  1924 was a while ago, so I wouldn't call the change "recently".  Incidentally, if you hit your ball across Ardmore Avenue and back onto the golf course on the other side of the road, you are still considered to have hit your shot OB.  I've never really liked that, but since it probably happens 3X/year at most, it's no big deal.  but if it happened in a playoff for the U.S. Open or a match in the U.S. Am or a Walker Cup...............????????????

Mike Sweeney,

First, I acknowledge that Merion does have a fair number of holes in which OB is a definite factor.  I consider #'s 2,6,7,8,14,15 and 18 to be clear examples of that with #17 also a candidate.  However, while I have seen (or hit) the occasional shot hit OB on #'s 1,10,11,12 and 16, those are very big misses and/or bladed bunker shots.  I have also seen a tee ball sliced so far off #5 that, yes, Ardmore Avenue was its resting place.  I have also seen a dead right pop-up off the back tee on #4 that crossed over the back of the 7th green and.......guess what?  I did not hit either of those max-errant tee shots, but, in both instances, I was beaten by the guy who did!  Realistically, I count 7 1/2 holes where OB is in the player's head and five more where it's possible, but not really a big issue.

Also, the "pond" on #17 in your youth was an accident.  In the early 1980's, after the '81 Open, a drain pipe got clogged and, before the then-super could drain the area, frogs and other creatures began to live there and the EPA declared it a bona fide wetland.  So, the club was forced to play the area as a hazard for at least 15-20 years until, somehow, they were able to get regulatory relief and drain it.  The wood chip path from those days still remains at the bottom of the steps but the red stakes are gone.

FYI, pre WWII, that area was, in fact, flooded every Winter as a skating pond and there was a heated shack on the crest of the hill that was taken down each Spring.  The Platform Tennis courts are NLE, as well.

ChipOat

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Re: Happy Birthday, Merion (commemorative booklet available)
« Reply #21 on: September 24, 2012, 04:55:17 PM »
P.S. The commemorative booklet is, in fact, a full chapter from the 400+ page book that Jeff Silverman is writing and that is scheduled to be published next Autumn after the U.S. Open.