Please give an example where you use strategy off the tee.

[JLahrman]

stratˇeˇgy [strat-i-jee]; noun: a plan, method, or series of maneuvers or stratagems for obtaining a specific goal or result.

The definition of strategy is a plan to win, succeed, or get the best possible result you can.

I use strategy in every shot I hit, because I'm trying to get the best possible result out of every shot.

The design of the hole may make it easy or hard for me to figure out the best plan, but that doesn't change the fact that I have to strategize every shot. Stepping up and trying to hit the crap out of a driver is still strategy.

[Will Lozier]

John,

You can't simply take a strategic option off the table in a discussion of strategic options!  By definition, the decision to take additional risk with your chosen line off the tee is strategic...as is trying to drive the green on a short par-4.  

Pacific Dunes #6 allows a player to lay up short left into a huge area with a mid-iron leaving a shortish iron into the green from a horrendous angle - safe off the tee leaves a treacherous approach.  Or, one can hit a driver or 3-wood to the smaller area over to the right that is mostly blind - this choice, if successful, leaves a much better angle into said green, greatly improving ones chances for par or better.  Lastly, downwind one can try to take driver up to the edge leaving only a short chip - yet, if you pull your tee shot, you are SOOL, likely in a huge natural bunker with the absolute worst angle into the green.  

Cheers

[Patrick_Mucci]

JakaB,

Some architects design backwards, from the green to the tee.

Therefore, shouldn't you strategize using the same method ?

At Mountain Ridge, a Donald Ross course with very generous fairways, being in the middle of the fairway, while a good position, isn't necessarily the optimal position depending upon hole location.

MRCC introduces you to that situation on the very first hole and continues that theme throughout the golf course.

# 1 green has an angled back plateau.  On the lower front section the entire left side of the green slopes fairly sharply toward the center, such that approaches hit left can't get within 20 feet of any left hole location on the lower section.  The upper plateau is angled further left and not merely behind the front section.

When the hole is cut on the upper section, you MUST hit your drive to the right side of yhe fairway if you want to make your approach a viable shot.
But, there's a nice bunker on the right side of the fairway/rough.

And, the fairway slopes from high left to low right, promoting a fade/slice, so,if you're not on the right side of the fairway you gave to hit a draw off that lie in order to get to that back plateau.

It's quite a clever arrangement and it's all visible as you stand on the highly elevated tee.

Other holes have similar situations where you have to be on one side of the fairway, or even in the rough in order to approach a hole location from the optimal position.

Holes like # 8, 11, 17 and 18 present that dilema, whereas other holes present it to a lesser degree.

[Joe_Tucholski]

Depending on which tees I'm playing, and where the tees are, Rustic Canyon #7 now has 3 legitimate choices that I consider off the tee.



I've said it before but this hole was one of my least favorite when I started playing the course, it's now one of my favorite.  

The black line is honestly the line I favor.  That being said if the wind is in my face (I feel like it seems to be a hurting wind most of the time), the pin is back left, my playing partner is in trouble or I'm not feeling good with the driver I choose another option.  It's also worth noting I found the bunker at the end of the fairway last week so that adds to the decision process off the tee (the 80 yard bunker shot, with a bunker to carry at 50 yards, isn't a shot I enjoyed).

For me the red line is the safest play.  Before they added the additional fairway this my play off the tee the majority of the time.

The blue line is the line I take the least.  The only time I now consider this play is when the flag is back left, even then I don't feel all that comfortable with the play.

Honestly on the course only #4, #6, #9, #15 and #16 fall into the category where I just think put it in the fairway or on the green and even those I have a preferred "strategy"

[Carl Johnson]

I generally smash it down the fairway as far and straight as I can.  However, when I was a better player, I would try cutting a ball or drawing a ball to take one side of the course out of play or fit the ball into the desired path of the hole.

But generally....I've always tried smashing down the fairway as far and straight as it can go.

At my home course (Carolina GC, Charlotte) we have several holes on which if you smashed it straight down the middle, you'd be in heap of trouble (likely wet or lost).  On No. 11 you have to play to the left, and use less than your driver.  On 18, less than driver and far right.  If you hit that one properly, you pick up slope to advance the ball, not slope to dump it in the lake.  To make matters worse, you cannot see the trouble off the tee.  The tee shots disappear over a hill.  Some folks don't like these holes because you cannot just rip it straight.  I like them, personally, because they do require more precision off the tee than most holes.  Anecdote: I played a round at our club earlier this year with one of our GCA members who was visiting town.  I told him to play right and short on 18.  He did, and his drive ended up in a good (not great) position.  However, when he got to the hill and looked over, he said he thought straight and long would have been better.  Not.  Some of these things you just have to learn by experience.

[Sven Nilsen]

Shepherds Crook (IL) 7th Hole (Par 4) - 345 yds.

Fairway divided by an area of rough, the left side being higher than the right side.  A wide shallow green that slopes fairly severely from back to front protected on either side by fronting bunkers.

If the pin is on the left, play your tee ball to the lower right side of the fairway, avoiding a fw bunker at about 250 yds from the tee.  The line of approach takes the left side bunker out of play and the resulting diagonal across the green gives you more yardage to stop a shot below the hole.

If the pin is on the right, the play is almost as far left as you can go to the higher side of the fairway (or if you play to the middle you have to carry an area of rough that slopes down to create the division between the two sides of the fairway).  From here the approach is such that the right bunker is not in play and the slopes of the green will help to feed a ball to the pin.

With a pin in the middle, its a question of picking your comfort zone, a drive to the left may leave a shorter shot in, but the angle is slightly worse.

Downwind and/or from the up tees the green is drivable and being just short of the green is not a bad option..

A fun hole.  I'd love to see a version where the approach is blind and you need to check the pin location while playing a prior hole.

[Rick Shefchik]

Here's an example from my round yesterday: short par 4, 340 yards, second shot is downhill:



If you leave your drive 100 yards from the hole or farther back, you have a flat lie to the green below. If you hit your drive farther than that, not only does the fairway narrow, but your drive will probably roll down to a flat spot about 50 yards short of the green, on the same level as the green, with a ridge between you and the green that blocks your view of the bottom of the flagstick.

Yesterday my drive ended up about 100 yards from the green, and my sand wedge approach left me a five-foot birdie putt. Two guys in my group drove it to the bottom of the hill, 50 yards from the hole. Both hit excellent shots with enough backspin to stop inside 10 feet of the hole -- a shot I don't have from that distance. It made sense for them to hit driver and get close to the green, because of their skill set. It made sense for me to lay father back, because of my skill set. Of course, we all hit driver, but a few years ago I used to hit 3-wood on that hole to avoid the 50-yard shot. Now I don't have to.

[Terry Lavin]

I'm probably an old school dumbass, but I always aim for the middle of the fairway.  If there's a fairway bunker on one side, I might try to favor the other side, but acting like I can aim, fade or draw on command is something that I try to avoid at all costs.  I have much more success with trying to hit the ball straight than trying to move it one way or the other.  For these reasons, I usually chuckle at all of the chatter on this site about the great strategic options that are afforded by wide fairways without punishing bunkers.  Duh.  If I push it to the right but the fairway is wide enough, I have the option of trying to get on the green from the right side of the fairway.  If I pull it to the left, I have the option of trying to hit the green from that vantage point.  If I'm lucky enough to be in the middle, I have the option of trying not to push or pull my next shot but rather to hit it in the middle of the green, which is USUALLY a pretty good option, now that I think of it.

Of course, I can think of many, many situations where one is screwed if he is on the wrong side of the fairway, but there are thankfully very few golf holes where one is left with a horrible option if his ball is in the middle of the fairway.

[Carl Nichols]

I have the option of trying not to push or pull my next shot but rather to hit it in the middle of the green, which is USUALLY a pretty good option, now that I think of it.

I often wonder what kind of score I would shoot if I attempted to hit every approach shot, and maybe even every pitch/chip, in the dead center of the green.  I tend to think my medal score would be a little lower than normal, with fewer birdies but also fewer bogies and doubles. 

[Terry Lavin]

I have the option of trying not to push or pull my next shot but rather to hit it in the middle of the green, which is USUALLY a pretty good option, now that I think of it.

I often wonder what kind of score I would shoot if I attempted to hit every approach shot, and maybe even every pitch/chip, in the dead center of the green.  I tend to think my medal score would be a little lower than normal, with fewer birdies but also fewer bogies and doubles.  

Many years ago, we had a complete idiot of a greenskeeper at Olympia Fields who, in his first year on the job, convinced us even more idiotic members that he had to put the hole locations around the edges of the greens for the entire season because his predecessor had screwed up the turf by consistently putting the holes in the middle of the greens during his tenure.  Stupid, I know, but all damned year we had to deal with tour hole locations because of this goofball.  The unexpected bonus of this situation was that many players just aimed for the middle of the green rather than going for the sucker locations.  It was pretty much the consensus that us regular chops (I'm a 10) are better off going for the middle.  I still aim for the middle, to this day.  It allows the deviations a better chance to stay on the green, whether short, long, left or right.  It also improves the odds of the two-putt.  Middle of the fairway, middle of the green.  Call it boring if you want, but that's a pretty simple formula for decent scoring last time I checked.

[Bob_Huntley]

I think that Bill Seitz gives the classic example with his comments on the 10th hole ar Riviera. I played there for some time and with good players and a few pros and never saw any one attempt to drive the green. It might well have been because we were using small wooden headed drivers and wound balls, also in our matches the penalty for missing was painful to our wallets. 

Bob

[Jeff Shelman]

For me, strategy off the tee is most often in play on a short par 4 (something under say 340).

On holes like that, I have to decide whether I want to hit driver and potentially have an awkward half-wedge. Or is it better to hit 3 wood or hybrid and have a full club into the green.

Obviously things like wind, temperature, hard or soft turf and pin location all play into that decision.

[Chris Newton]

The 4th hole at Highlands Links, which is aptly named Heich O'Fash (Heap of Trouble) comes to mind. It is a short par 4 that is only 275 yards from the middle tees. You can take a rip and try to cut your drive towards the green, but there are deep bunkers abound. If you go long, your ball is pretty much gone as there is tall fescue + shrubbery on the slope behind the green. The safer play is to hit a short iron off the tee, but there are two ponds off the left hand side of the fairway that often come into play. The water is out of view from the tee box and catches most players by surprise when they play this hole for the first time. I've seen guys hit 8/9 irons off the tee on this hole.

[Adam Clayman]

The 15th at Wild Horse in Ne.  Depending on the wind, I will try to hit to different spots. Left in all but a N-NW wind.

With this year's drought, The 'brown bonus', on all single row irrigation courses, is used regularly as a strategic choice. On some sharp dogleg holes, into the wind, I'd rather hit my approach from fairway grass, so I play the hole much longer than I'd need to if I want to gamble with the hard pan. That's a strategic choice. Funny thing about hard pan is how one can go under the ball so easily and ineffectively.

John, On many courses, a standard maintenance presentation, likely makes strategic choices obsolete. Shrouded in rough, Soft and iridescent green, is hardly daunting.

[Bill Brightly]

I usually chuckle at all of the chatter on this site about the great strategic options that are afforded by wide fairways without punishing bunkers.  Duh.  If I push it to the right but the fairway is wide enough, I have the option of trying to get on the green from the right side of the fairway. 

Of course, I can think of many, many situations where one is screwed if he is on the wrong side of the fairway, but there are thankfully very few golf holes where one is left with a horrible option if his ball is in the middle of the fairway.

Terry,

I used to feel the same way about "width chatter" here, until I played Royal Melbourne. It was like a light switch going off in my head, I finally got it! But that is links golf. For most US parkland courses, the importance of angles is greatly reduced.

[Jay Flemma]

17 at red tail

[Chip Gaskins]

I hit driver every hole I can.  Simply put, it goes straighter than most clubs in my bag down to 4 iron....therefore I hit it as far and straight as I can.  That is why I say strategy has jumped the shark with modern equipment.

[Tom_Doak]

I try to hit my tee shot on the tenth at Crystal Downs right beside the 150 marker in the right rough.  The green is so severe that coming in from that angle is a big advantage.

[Bill Seitz]

I try to hit my tee shot on the tenth at Crystal Downs right beside the 150 marker in the right rough.  The green is so severe that coming in from that angle is a big advantage.

When I clicked on the front page and saw your name as the most recent comment,, I KNEW this was going to come up. I remember in our round hitting it almost exactly to that spot (maybe a little further right than optimal), and your response was that I'd be coming in from the proper angle, especially to the right pin we had that day. I don't know what the rough is like on that side in peak season, but in early May it wasn't too penal, and definitely a safe spot to be on that hole.

[Tom_Doak]

I try to hit my tee shot on the tenth at Crystal Downs right beside the 150 marker in the right rough.  The green is so severe that coming in from that angle is a big advantage.

When I clicked on the front page and saw your name as the most recent comment,, I KNEW this was going to come up. I remember in our round hitting it almost exactly to that spot (maybe a little further right than optimal), and your response was that I'd be coming in from the proper angle, especially to the right pin we had that day. I don't know what the rough is like on that side in peak season, but in early May it wasn't too penal, and definitely a safe spot to be on that hole.

Bill:

Sorry I'm so predictable.

There are several holes at Crystal Downs where I play strategically.  On #2 I try to hit it up the left side, because of the tilt of the green.  On #4, a fade will hold the fairway better.  On #7, I play to the end of the upper plateau with an iron, rather than leaving myself a blind second shot.  On #8, I make sure to stay to the outside of the dogleg, so as not to be blocked out by the tree in the corner, and on #16, I play to the outside so that I don't have to hit my second shot across the line of the deep rough on the left.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Terry Lavin,

I like perimeter hole locations, I think it makes you a better, smarter player, and you encounter interesting putts you haven't had in decades..

Aiming for the center of the green tends to be day and/or club specific.

With 9-iron and wedges I'm almost always going to go for the pin.
Depending how I'm playing that day, and, the consequences for failure to execute, will determine if i'm going for the pin with my other clubs.

[Bill Seitz]

Bill:

Sorry I'm so predictable.

There are several holes at Crystal Downs where I play strategically.  On #2 I try to hit it up the left side, because of the tilt of the green.  On #4, a fade will hold the fairway better.  On #7, I play to the end of the upper plateau with an iron, rather than leaving myself a blind second shot.  On #8, I make sure to stay to the outside of the dogleg, so as not to be blocked out by the tree in the corner, and on #16, I play to the outside so that I don't have to hit my second shot across the line of the deep rough on the left.

Tom, it's not that you're predictable, necessarily. It's just that I specifically recall you making a point of being on that side of the hole to that green, maybe after I had  already hit it there.  It's one of the things that stuck in my memory from that round.  That comment, my par #8, and losing my four-iron somewhere on the course (found and graciously returned by a member) were apparently my takeaways .  

[Patrick_Mucci]

I hit driver every hole I can.  Simply put, it goes straighter than most clubs in my bag down to 4 iron....therefore I hit it as far and straight as I can.  That is why I say strategy has jumped the shark with modern equipment.

Chip,

I tend to agree with you, between the ball and equipment I hit my driver straighter and longer than my fairway wood, and if need be, I'll choke up on my driver so that I can control distance to a degree.  But there are times when I'll throttle back.
# 5 at PV is a good example.

For me, strategy on most holes off the tee isn't so much a matter of distance, but more a matter of direction.

[Dan Byrnes]

Lots of holes where primarily driver can reach trouble and three wood can't.  Extra yards in side 100 vs 100-120 isn't worth the risk of missing with driver.

Dan

[JR Potts]

In today's game I don't think anyone on this board who has a handicap between 0 and 18 is good enough to use strategy off the tee. Yeah, it's great trying to hit the right side or left side of the fairway but who here is good enough to execute?  I sure am not.  Yeah, I guess there's some strategy in figuring out whether to hit it short and straight or long and maybe not so straight but I have a hard time believing that almost every person, if given the option of having  their ball placed in the middle of the fairway 270 yards yards from the tee, wouldn't think of that as being pretty damn close to perfect.