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Patrick Kiser

  • Karma: +0/-0
I too liked the 9th ... a lot!  Just a really nice approach, but don't go long.  Some fun contours in and around the green here.  Also, thanks to the tree clearing when you look back from the 9th towards the front of the green you get to see the 3rd, 8th, and 4th.

But can't wait for the stretch of 10-14.  Awesome!
“One natural hazard, however, which is more
or less of a nuisance, is water. Water hazards
absolutely prohibit the recovery shot, perhaps
the best shot in the game.” —William Flynn, golf
course architect

Kirk Moon

Kyle,

Quality photos here.  I usually bore quickly with photo threads with endless photos of the same hole, but not this time.  Good work.

+1.  The 7th and 9th are my two favorite holes on the course.  The 8th sandwiched between these two great is my least favorite.
I love the 8th.  Maybe because I have been able to get the ball within 10 feet from 215 twice in the last couple of weeks.  : )

It's a pretty hole.  The ground option is in play when the pin is on the front.  What's not to like?

The 6-9 stretch is perhaps the most fun part of the course.

Kyle Henderson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Thanks, Josh! It was good to finally meet you, however briefly.

Kirk, that little hump added just a bit short of the 8th green really makes the hole, IMO. It really playes in the mind for those running shots in to front pins and the shaping is pleasingly naturalistic. I wish more designers would  incorporate subtle features around their greens to add interest to the approaches and recovery shots, rather than thinking merely in terms of bunkering (which offer fewer recovery options and approach outcomes).
"I always knew terrorists hated us for our freedom. Now they love us for our bondage." -- Stephen T. Colbert discusses the popularity of '50 Shades of Grey' at Gitmo

Kyle Henderson

  • Karma: +0/-0
10th tee:


The landing trough.


Paired penalizations for righty slicers.


A look across the green’s stern from the left.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2012, 04:28:26 AM by Kyle Henderson »
"I always knew terrorists hated us for our freedom. Now they love us for our bondage." -- Stephen T. Colbert discusses the popularity of '50 Shades of Grey' at Gitmo

Patrick Kiser

  • Karma: +0/-0
One of my favorite holes on the course, but really ... it's the stretch of 10-14 that I really enjoyed.  It feels like one continuous hole in an "S" like shape. 

The 10th itself rewards the tee shot that tickles the rightside fairway bunker (like the 1st a little) with a pretty good power boost into a good position for the approach.  But you can't go wrong to the left either if playing it safe.  It just means a longer approach and more challenge if the wind picks up.  The run on shot works nicely here from left to right as I recall.  The apron from the left feeds balls into the green as well.  The transition to the 11th tee is seamless and there's a great view of the clubhouse.  Just a solid start to the back nine.

One thing I did not care too much for were the new plantings to the left fairway edge that intersects with the 11th fairway, but I understand the trees have to be replaced as part of some environmental requirements.

More please...
“One natural hazard, however, which is more
or less of a nuisance, is water. Water hazards
absolutely prohibit the recovery shot, perhaps
the best shot in the game.” —William Flynn, golf
course architect

Kirk Moon

I wish more designers would  incorporate subtle features around their greens to add interest to the approaches and recovery shots, rather than thinking merely in terms of bunkering (which offer fewer recovery options and approach outcomes).
Agree.

Another nice example of this would be the two humps in front of the first green (a relatively reachable par 5), which are kind of the inverse of the hump in front of eight.  Instead of helping direct the ball toward the hole on ground approaches, they serve to deflect balls laterally towards the greenside bunkers, making it much harder for semi-long hitters to use the downhill slope to run a ball onto the green.  Nice use of contouring to keep players honest. 

Matt_Cohn

  • Karma: +0/-0
I don't quite get #10 and it's probably my least favorite hole on the course to be honest, although it's not like it's terrible.

I just don't really think it works. Okay, you'd like to run your teeshot just inside of the right fairway bunker, but you're SO screwed if you're in it ("paired penalizations") that I don't know why you'd ever aim up there. Besides, although the view from up there is better, the angle stinks.

So instead you just play it down the middle-left, where it usually runs into the short rough where you're hopefully not behind one of those trees. Then you have a nondescript uphill semi-blind shot to a green that's a lot like #13. (I think the similarity to the second shot on #13 is also a bit of a weakness.)

I dunno. There's so much interest in really every other hole at Cal Club, but to me, by comparison, this one falls a bit flat.

Kyle Henderson

  • Karma: +0/-0
11th tee. Anywhere in the fairway should do, but fescue and trees lurk for sprayed drives.


Sweeping left, the fairway cut surrounds the 11th and 18th greens, as well as the 12th tee up the hill. Nice touch.


The approach is a dandy. Anything that carries the (well short) left bunker could roll down onto the green. A miss wide right will find a tightly mown hollow from which it is very difficult to recover.


The clubhouse view behind the 11th green.

"I always knew terrorists hated us for our freedom. Now they love us for our bondage." -- Stephen T. Colbert discusses the popularity of '50 Shades of Grey' at Gitmo

Kyle Henderson

  • Karma: +0/-0
12th tee: In full view of the clubhouse, one must stripe a long shot to a green surrounded by trees and a fronting upslope (the 11th green is in the forground on the right).


It’s best not to miss short (or left or right or long).


Retrospective.


Looking across the green from long/left to short/right (towards a flaming gas ball).
« Last Edit: September 04, 2012, 11:53:23 PM by Kyle Henderson »
"I always knew terrorists hated us for our freedom. Now they love us for our bondage." -- Stephen T. Colbert discusses the popularity of '50 Shades of Grey' at Gitmo

Patrick Kiser

  • Karma: +0/-0
The 11th is such a cool hole.  The tee shot towards the right side of the fairway, away from the green, provides a big power boost.  The approach is simply delicious.  I wonder if the long hitters ever go for the green with a big draw and the afternoon wind to their backs.

I love the 12th tee and how it provides a look back on the 11th and 18th greens.  Tough par 3 though and a rather good strike is required.  If the wind kicks up, even trickier.  Subtle green from what I remember.
“One natural hazard, however, which is more
or less of a nuisance, is water. Water hazards
absolutely prohibit the recovery shot, perhaps
the best shot in the game.” —William Flynn, golf
course architect

Kyle Henderson

  • Karma: +0/-0
For the 13th-17th holes, the Cal Club routing adopts a back-and-forth routing, with holes separated by rows of trees. I generally find such a routing to be the kiss of death, but the individual holes here are compelling enough to overcome most of this detraction. Of the lot, 13 might be my least favorite, but staggered the bunkering is well-conceived such that the hole doesn’t play as a straight-ahead/execute-or-die sort of mind-numbing brute.


The hole widens considerably moving past the teeing grounds. Also, the uphill approach to the ridgeline green, for short-driving members, sets up well for a running fade with a longer club.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2012, 01:34:33 PM by Kyle Henderson »
"I always knew terrorists hated us for our freedom. Now they love us for our bondage." -- Stephen T. Colbert discusses the popularity of '50 Shades of Grey' at Gitmo

Patrick Kiser

  • Karma: +0/-0
I guess I'm the only one commenting here...  :-\

In regards to 13-15 then 17, although they run parallel ... I'd argue the elevation changes between these holes lessens the feel of proximity.  I feel the 16th stands on its own plus changes directions and makes for a sweet little match play hole.  The wind there is quite interesting from what I recall.

But back to the 13th here, in the afternoon headwind it was a ballbuster.  The knockdown shot can really come in handy.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2012, 07:36:40 PM by Patrick Kiser »
“One natural hazard, however, which is more
or less of a nuisance, is water. Water hazards
absolutely prohibit the recovery shot, perhaps
the best shot in the game.” —William Flynn, golf
course architect

John Handley

  • Karma: +0/-0
I would argue from a membership standpoint, the 13th hole is a favorite.  Typically into prevailing wind, it plays 20-50 yards longer than on the scorecard.  An accurate drive is a must to stay out of and to left of the big fairway bunker on the right hand side of the fairway.  If you hit the right fairway bunker, go ahead and put a 6 on the card because that is what you'll most likely end up with.  Once the tee shot is safely executed, the golfer is faced with a 130-200 shot to a tough green.  The play is long and left as the ball can catch the contouring and roll onto the green.  The green is elevated with a false front so short is no good at all.  The green runs very fast back to front and I've seen guys put off the green on many occasions.  The green is well protected to the right with bunkers and a shaved run off area.  All in all I think, as many of my friends do, that #13 is a great challenge of a par 4 and a par will typically win the hole.

2024 Line Up: Spanish Oaks GC, Cal Club, Cherokee Plantation, Huntercombe, West Sussex, Hankley Common, Royal St. Georges, Sunningdale New & Old, CC of the Rockies, Royal Lytham, Royal Birkdale, Formby, Royal Liverpool, Swinley Forest, St. George's Hill, Berkshire Red, Walton Heath Old, Austin GC,

Kyle Henderson

  • Karma: +0/-0
I would argue from a membership standpoint, the 13th hole is a favorite.  Typically into prevailing wind, it plays 20-50 yards longer than on the scorecard.  An accurate drive is a must to stay out of and to left of the big fairway bunker on the right hand side of the fairway.  If you hit the right fairway bunker, go ahead and put a 6 on the card because that is what you'll most likely end up with.  Once the tee shot is safely executed, the golfer is faced with a 130-200 shot to a tough green.  The play is long and left as the ball can catch the contouring and roll onto the green.  The green is elevated with a false front so short is no good at all.  The green runs very fast back to front and I've seen guys put off the green on many occasions.  The green is well protected to the right with bunkers and a shaved run off area.  All in all I think, as many of my friends do, that #13 is a great challenge of a par 4 and a par will typically win the hole.


You have no need to present an argument, Sir Handley, but I am interested to hear the members favor this hole. Above, I stated that 13 might be my least favorite in the 13-17 stretch of side-by-side holes. I still like it. It is a challenging hole but, having played it just once, my initial imression is that it might offer a smaller range of playing experiences from one round to the next. Your post above suggests I might be correct -- once you hit your drive, you know what the scorecard is likely to say. 14, 15, and 17 seemed to predispose golfers to less predictable adventures and outcomes.

Am I correct or do I need to get back for another few doezen rounds? ;D
"I always knew terrorists hated us for our freedom. Now they love us for our bondage." -- Stephen T. Colbert discusses the popularity of '50 Shades of Grey' at Gitmo

John Handley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Personally I favor #13 to #14 at Cal Club but I think both are good, challenging par 4s.  Getting pars at 12, 13 and 14 is a good feat indeed.  At 13 I think the most challenging part of the hole is the second shot versus the drive.  But with the green so challenging too the player cannot think he's got a 4 just by hitting the green in regulation.  As for the look and feel of the hole I think the elevated green makes it interesting.  And yes you need to get back out to Cal to see the course again.  Once is certainly not enough to fully appreciate the nuances.  It's like watching Caddyshack just once, you miss a lot of the humor and great lines but know you've seen a classic movie.
2024 Line Up: Spanish Oaks GC, Cal Club, Cherokee Plantation, Huntercombe, West Sussex, Hankley Common, Royal St. Georges, Sunningdale New & Old, CC of the Rockies, Royal Lytham, Royal Birkdale, Formby, Royal Liverpool, Swinley Forest, St. George's Hill, Berkshire Red, Walton Heath Old, Austin GC,

Kyle Henderson

  • Karma: +0/-0

14th tee. Par 4. 479 yards.


Flashy bunkering? Mature trees with unique regional character? Check and mate.


For such a long par 4, the green presents a fairly narrow target.




Retrospective.
"I always knew terrorists hated us for our freedom. Now they love us for our bondage." -- Stephen T. Colbert discusses the popularity of '50 Shades of Grey' at Gitmo

Martin Toal

  • Karma: +0/-0
Looks delightful.

How difficult is it for the average citizen to get a game here?

Stephen Britton

  • Karma: +0/-0
New GM at the Cal Club, Glenn Smickley is one of the best in the business. Can't wait to get out there and play. Pics look awesome.
"The chief object of every golf architect or greenkeeper worth his salt is to imitate the beauties of nature so closely as to make his work indistinguishable from nature itself" Alister MacKenzie...

Patrick Kiser

  • Karma: +0/-0
A low running approach to the left green entrance into the 14th is really fun from what I recall.

From the fairway looking left, you see the 10th, 11th, 12th, and part of the 18th + the clubhouse and San Bruno mountains.  Josh captured this brilliantly in one of his paintings and I couldn't help but ask for a reproduction. 

Awesome sense of place on this 14th.
“One natural hazard, however, which is more
or less of a nuisance, is water. Water hazards
absolutely prohibit the recovery shot, perhaps
the best shot in the game.” —William Flynn, golf
course architect

Kyle Henderson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Climbing gently, the 15th is a short par 5 made great by a central fairway bunker set ~150 yards short of the green’s center and a dazzling green/bunker complex benched at the base of a steep hillock.


There is room to skirt the central trap on either side.


From the sand, few will make par.


Some might think the greenside bunkering is overdone, but its hard to complain about such handsome hazards.


The spacious green will accept longer approach shots, but 2-putts are no bargain, even from medium range.
"I always knew terrorists hated us for our freedom. Now they love us for our bondage." -- Stephen T. Colbert discusses the popularity of '50 Shades of Grey' at Gitmo

Al Jamieson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The California Golf Club of San Francisco: A pictorial!!! (10th hole)
« Reply #70 on: September 10, 2012, 03:19:39 PM »
the three trees left of the landing area on 10 replace three very large trees that greatly influenced play.

Looking at old pictures of Cal, one will see that it was a pretty dense forest. It was extremely penal. I still marvel at the fact that Ken Venturi shot 63 nine times, and the only reason he didn't shoot 62 was that the record was held by the home pro, Art Bell, and Byron Nelson always told Ken that, unless in competition, he should never show up the home pro.

About, 2,000 trees were removed 1997-98 which greatly improved the quality of the turf. The Kyle Phillips restoration removed another thousand, which, along with planting fescue grasses in the fairways, has given the course more of a links feel.

The original three trees left of #10 were two Cypress and a pine, all over 80 feet. The Cypress trees fell in winter storms around 1994-5 and the pine died after the 2008 new course opening. When the trees fell, players were then free to hit to the left side where one had the most level lie. Ken Venturi has told me that in his day the hole, on average, was a driver-five iron. The challenge of the hole was that your second was an uphill shot into the wind from a hanging lie.

Kyle's placement of the new back tee hopes to create the same shot value. He felt that replacing the trees on the left would cause the player to think more about his tee shot. I don't believe he wants a reforestation, and while we do have an agreement with the County to replace a per-centage of trees removed, those trees have been placed more on the periphery of the property.

As our own Arron Oberholser has opined, we now have a links golf feel with Augusta potential in the green complexes.

Patrick Kiser

  • Karma: +0/-0
The 15th's green definitely has a lot going on I thought.  I noticed one can play off the back slopes to the greens like on a MacKenzie green.  Quite fun actually.  I have to think this 15th plays plenty long from the Venturi tees AND the afternoon wind coming head on.

My only question is the green seems well defended in the front by the bunkers, so do members ever try to run it in or is it strictly a "fly in in" job?


Al,

Great to hear from you.  I too heard about this saying from Byron Nelson.  All class...

“One natural hazard, however, which is more
or less of a nuisance, is water. Water hazards
absolutely prohibit the recovery shot, perhaps
the best shot in the game.” —William Flynn, golf
course architect

Kirk Moon

Would really love to see the club host some USGA Amateur and US Open Qualifying events. 

Would do wonders for the reputation of the Club and draw well deserved attention to the quality of the course, which, IMHO, is every bit the equal of the well known heavyweights in the neighborhood.

If only .....







Kyle Henderson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Al,
Thank you for those insights.

Kirk,
I hope the USGA stays well away from the Cal Club of SF. I fear they would muck it up.
"I always knew terrorists hated us for our freedom. Now they love us for our bondage." -- Stephen T. Colbert discusses the popularity of '50 Shades of Grey' at Gitmo

Patrick Kiser

  • Karma: +0/-0
“One natural hazard, however, which is more
or less of a nuisance, is water. Water hazards
absolutely prohibit the recovery shot, perhaps
the best shot in the game.” —William Flynn, golf
course architect

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