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DMoriarty

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: MGC: you are on the clock!
« Reply #25 on: June 20, 2012, 05:43:07 PM »
David,

In 1930, they were playing with much less advantageous equipment, too!  Hickory shafts, etc.

Chip, the equipment was "less advantageous" but not to the extent you are presenting it here.  You seem to be assuming that the width was necessary then because otherwise they couldn't have hit the fairway with the equipment they were using.  I don't think this was the case at all.  Rather, the width provided the golfer with options; various possible avenues of attack depending upon the pin.  It might be an advantage one day to play well right near the rough for a certain pin, and then an equal advantage to play long and left near the water the next day.  Or the golfer could play it safe and down the middle but leave a more difficult angle.

As for the equipment, the steel shaft was approved in 1924.  But even with hickories, difference in advantage between hickory shafted irons and modern irons is often greatly exaggerated. The ball is certainly different as are the woods, but the irons?  Not so much. Exact distance control and spin control maybe, but it wasn't as if Bobby Jones and company could not hit an iron in the general direction the were aiming!  Yet your analysis seems to suggest that this was the case.  

Quote
The fairway is now much more narrow, the greenside bunker is about 2 feet deeper and the tee box has been lowered to ground level.

The strategy is the same as before and, given the equipment of today, probably no more difficult to execute than in 1930.

The strategy was the same?  You and I must have vastly different understandings of the word "strategy."   The strategy now seems to be to hit the fairway, then face whatever approach is left depending on the pin.   I think the strategy then was to try and hit the portion of the fairway which provided the best possible second shot!  To my mind the former is not really strategic, while the latter is.  



Golf history can be quite interesting if you just let your favorite legends go and allow the truth to take you where it will.
--Tom MacWood (1958-2012)

Patrick_Mucci

Re: MGC: you are on the clock!
« Reply #26 on: June 21, 2012, 12:30:56 AM »

That picture of 11 above is really eye opening. Amazing how small the fairway is compared to 10 yrs ago.

Jamie, be careful what you say about how narrow the 11th fairway is, TEPaul will tell you that you're not "wholly correct" ;D


I'd say for the ideal tee shot, players are looking to hit a 230-220 yd shot. With the downhill nature of the hole, it'll go a bit more than that for total yardage. With firm tournament conditions, you can even hit less club and chase it down the hill. Regardless of the yardage, being in the fairway is at a premium. It's a really tough approach from the rough with the surrounding creek at the green. From the short grass, its a birdie chance

Jamie,

From the rough does it make sense to play the approach short of the green ?


Patrick_Mucci

Re: MGC: you are on the clock!
« Reply #27 on: June 21, 2012, 12:42:29 AM »


Chip and Dave,

I think one of the major differences in # 11 is the height and texture of the rough then and now.



Here is the 11th fairway at the 1930 Amateur.   Is this even the same golf hole?  



From Google Earth. . .


ChipOat

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: MGC: you are on the clock!
« Reply #28 on: June 21, 2012, 10:46:06 AM »
David,

Our differing opinions are why there's both chocolate and vanilla ice cream.

I don't have Ran's skill in playing with hickories, but I've tried it and, to me, the degree of difficulty is exponentially higher.

As to options, you are correct that a wide fairway on #11 presents one that a narrow fairway towards the creek does not.  That is, a back left hole location is more of a direct shot from the far right.

Other than that, though, my experience is that it doesn't really matter.  Fairway = good and rough = bad.

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