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Mark Saltzman

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Re: Scarboro G&CC (Tillinghast), Toronto, Canada - A Review
« Reply #25 on: March 16, 2012, 01:18:30 AM »
1928



Source: http://www.la84foundation.org/SportsLibrary/GolfIllustrated/1928/gi286c.pdf


vs 2011






Removing the bunkers and restoring the fairway cut down to the water would make this one heck of a difficult par-3!

Wayne_Kozun

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Re: Scarboro G&CC (Tillinghast), Toronto, Canada - A Review
« Reply #26 on: April 10, 2012, 12:22:21 AM »
A few comments on this thread:

I did a review of the course on GCA about 5 years ago but I can't find it - perhaps someone can post a link?

The two par 5s on the front 9 (Holes #1 and #6) were greatly improved in the renos by Ian and Gil as they make you put some thought into your second shot - with fairway bunkering and the Sahara on #1.  Prior to this the second shot was grip it and rip it on these holes.

Hole #2 is not mentioned but it is a very strong par 3 and is arguably the toughest one-shotter on the course.  The course has several short par 4s but three of the par 3s are over 200 yards.

The third hole originally featured a large elm tree which was about 20 yards shorter, and slightly left, of the current chestnut tree.  This tree was lost to Dutch Elm disease in the 70s, along with many other trees on the course.  The current tree doesn't work that well, but this was the defining feature of the hole.  Ian and Gil moved the fairway to the right which brigns the ravine into play (as mentioned by Robert).  But this left the left side wide open.  Trees were planted to block this route and they also do protect the range.  One issue is that the club has had to plant trees as trees were removed in the

The bunkering on #4 has changed many times through the years and at times featured no bunkers or one behind the green.  The bunkers will hopefully be redone in the near history and should have be done already.  But there has been lots going on at the club, including the building of an irrigation pond (which pretty much all clubs in Toronto have had to do) and the club is celebrating its centennial in 2012 so this just didn't get done yet.  I have some photos taken from videos of Canadian Opens in 53 and 63 that I will try to post when I can locate them.  I have been told that the green was expanded in the mid 60s when a temporary green was added in the front as maintenance was beign done on the back part.  Some of the members liked the front portion as it made the hole much easier, but the size of the green is somewhat out of character compared to the other greens on the course.
 
#7 truly is a great short par 4 and only the young and foolish try to drive the hole, especially when the pin is on the front as it is impossible to keep a ball on the lower tier of the green unless you are hitting a full wedge.

#8 had its green moved to the left in the early 60s and then it was moved back some years later.  All stronger golfers will be able to drive the lower fairway.  If you are a long hitter then you can take an agressive line and be left with a PW in to the green.  The complaint for low handicappers is that this makes the hole too easy for them, with the green being very unguarded, especially from the left.

The tenth green is severly sloped from right to left.  This isn't evident for the first time player but putts from above the hole are extremely treacherous.

#12 is a longish par 4 that has (arguably) been made better by technology as one is tempted to try to drive over the second crossing of the creek which will leave less than 140 to the green.  Laying up means a shot of at least 180.  But the layup is somewhat tricky and is usually down with a fairway wood or a hybrid.

#13 was greatly improved by Ian and Gil as the front of the green was prow-shaped and all but the perfect shot was deflected away which is unfair on an uphill 420 yd par 4.

#16 is the hole that had the greatest improvement in the recent renos but, IMHO, it is still likely the weakest hole on the course.  The gully is  a little fearsome but if you drive to this location then you are left with a 30 yard pitch as your approach shot on a par 4.  I will try to drive this hole if the tees are forward and/or it is downwind as I think that makes more sense than #7.

The road on #18 does freak people out but it is very rarely an issue.  I have played the course a few hundred times and I might have hit the fence once or twice in my first year at the club.  Once you get past this it is a very good hole and I agree that it would be nice to have the collar of rough shaved so that balls could roll back down the fairway.  In this way it is like #9 at Augusta.

The clubhouse is very nice and the main lounge/bistro (The Tillinghast Lounge) was redone about 7-8 years ago and is very comfortable.  The rest of the clubhouse maintains an old world feel with fireplaces in pretty much all of the main rooms.  Unfortunately the main facade of the clubhouse was ruined in the late 50s when a curling rink was constructed where the grand entrance to the clubhouse originally stood.  The best part of the clubhouse is the verandah where golfers have a drink (or two) after their round and can watch other golfers finishing.

By the way, the club will be hosting the Canadian Tour Championship in late August and the Golf Channel normally has a weekly 30-60 minute show which shows highlights from the Canadian Tour.

Wayne_Kozun

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Re: Scarboro G&CC (Tillinghast), Toronto, Canada - A Review
« Reply #27 on: April 10, 2012, 12:30:09 AM »
One more thing regarding the fourth hole - it would be great to restore the line shown in the old photo but the issue is that there is a large tree (and several smaller ones) in the vicinity of where the tee would go and the club could not get permission to cut the tree down.   The tree is on the slope of a ravine and the issue is that the tree may be helping to hold up the slope.

A word of advice to those of you that are involved with golf courses - cut down trees when they are weed sized as it is getting almost impossible to cut down trees and this will only get worse in the future.

Jeff_Mingay

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Re: Scarboro G&CC (Tillinghast), Toronto, Canada - A Review
« Reply #28 on: April 10, 2012, 08:50:59 AM »
That is a great old, 1928 photo of the 4th hole, Mark. Thanks for posting.

Take a look at how the architecture doesn't compete with the setting - the hole (was) beautiful in its simplicity. The current bunkers, right of the green, detract from the beauty of the setting today, by comparison.

Wayne makes a good point about the clubhhouse at Scarboro, too. Aside from the curling rink addition (which, unfortunately, is awful) Scarboro's might be my favourite clubhouse in Canada.
jeffmingay.com

Wayne_Kozun

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Re: Scarboro G&CC (Tillinghast), Toronto, Canada - A Review
« Reply #29 on: February 03, 2020, 04:26:03 PM »
Wayne makes a good point about the clubhhouse at Scarboro, too. Aside from the curling rink addition (which, unfortunately, is awful) Scarboro's might be my favourite clubhouse in Canada.
An update, eight years later. 


The curling rink will be coming down in the near future.  There is a road-level railway crossing which is being changed into an underpass by Metrolinx which is the Government of Ontario entity that oversees transit.  This necessitates relocating the driveway into the golf club and it was decided that the best way to do this was to route the driveway through the current curling rink.  Needless to say, the curling members were not too happy about this.  There was a bit of a battle around this but curling ceased after the 2017-18 season.  The curling rink was to have been demolished by now but the construction has been delayed, although it is still supposed to go ahead.  Once the rink is gone the original formal entrance to the clubhouse will be restored.

Ian Andrew

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Re: Scarboro G&CC (Tillinghast), Toronto, Canada - A Review New
« Reply #30 on: February 03, 2020, 05:11:28 PM »
It amuses me that we did all the bunkers except the 4th green ... and after more than a decade, they still are not done. I bring it up every time I'm asked to drop by.

It was deferred originally because the green was going to be expanded toward the river and the bunker was going to come out. Now, it seems to have a life of its own ... I can't seem to get them out or at least renovated to match the other work.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2020, 06:29:22 PM by Ian Andrew »
With every golf development bubble, the end was unexpected and brutal....

Wayne_Kozun

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Re: Scarboro G&CC (Tillinghast), Toronto, Canada - A Review
« Reply #31 on: February 03, 2020, 05:27:53 PM »

And this is the course's signature hole!

I would love for the 4th hold to be done.  To me those bunkers stick out like a sore thumb, and the hole would be much better with the green much closer to the river as in your design.


One other interesting thing to note in the current and old photos of the fourth hole is how much the creek/river has expanded over those 80 years. This issue led to a lawsuit that went to the Supreme Court of Canada and apparently has become one of the benchmark cases in Canada on riparian rights:
 [size=78%]http://members.storm.ca/~river/letters/Scarboro%20Golf%20Club%20v%20City%20of%20Scarboro%20OCA%201988.pdf[/size]

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