Missing Links - Green Acres CC - fka Illinois GC

[Rick Wolffe]

HELP REQUESTED

Has anyone played Green Acres CC in Chicago Land and does it have any Tillinghast characterisics?

A.W. Tillinghast originaly designed an 18 hole course for the Illinois GC in Chicago land.  It was believed that this course became extinct.  However, there is now hope that this is not the case.  There is a club in Northbrook known as Green Acres CC that apparently purchased their course from the Illinois GC in 1945.  This sales documentation is Framed and on Display in the Green Acres Clubhouse.

Any thoughts from Chicago land would be appreciated.

RW

[Jeff_Brauer]

RW,

The other RW - Ron Whitten lists Green Acres as a George O'Neil design, with later renovations by Roseman (inventor of the Roseman Rake, a great finish implement) Killian and Nugent and Larry Packard.  Tillies only Illinois work were renovations to Westmoreland and Glen Oak, probably part of his PGA sponsored site visits.  From time to time, Ron does find errors, though.

When I worked for Killian and Nugent I did a little work there, but didn't notice Tillie characteristics.  On the other hand, at the time, I may not have known just what to look for, since I had Winged Foot in mind, and now know how variable Tillie was over the years.  

Sorry I can't be of more help, but it would be interesting to find another Tillinghast course.

[Rick Wolffe]

Jeff

Thanks for the quick reply.  It was actually Ron Whitten, who tipped me off to his discovery that Tillie had designed an 18 hole tract called Illinois GC which Ron believed was no longer in existence.  This discovery was made after the the latest publication of the Architects' of golf.  Which, as an aside, is another good reason to update this valuable reference electronically in some form.

In subsequent research we learned that Green Acres was once owned by Illinois GC.  Thus the possibility that the Illinois GC course may still exist.

I do not know who Tillie used as his constructor and engineer for this project, but do know that he used multiple contractors and engineers usually from the local area.

RW

[GeoffreyC]

Shivas

What does mention of Stanford, Medinah and others you mentioned have anything to do with Tillinghast?

You said "When he had a great site, he built a great course.  When he had an average site, he built an average course."

Do you actually think that Winged Foot GC is built on anything other then very ordinary flat property? Same for Baltusrol Lower (I don't think that's among his elite efforts but its still awfully good).

I think adaptable is very appropriate for Tillinghast.  His courses generally do not fit into a single style perhaps because of his sensitivity to the site he had to build each course. SFGC, Bethpage and Winged Foot for example are very different style courses yet each is greeat in its own right.  

I think you greatly underestimate AWT.

[Jeff_Brauer]

Rick,

Another possibility crosses my mind about green acres.  Since it was purchased in 1945, it may be like a few other courses in North Chicago that were closed and turned into military practice or camp areas.  I think Thorntree (now renamed, I think) and a few other faced this situation.  Robert Bruce Harris, who was really a land planner/landscape architect owned some of these, and they gave him his start in the business.

Green Acres may (I repeat may) have been similarly closed, which is why one club put it up for sale to another.  Thus, O'Neil (although Whitten credits it as new) may have remodeled the Tillie course.  If it was completely destroyed byu such operations, perhaps it really was a new course on the same land.

BTW,  Whitten says O'Neil, Roseman and Dearie (another partner) were all born in Philly, and emigrated to Chicago, and that Dearie did so to build courses for Donald Ross.  Don't recall a mention of him in Brad's book, but don't have time to look it up right now. (lunch is over)

I hate to combine facts with specualation like this, but it is an idea.

[Paul Richards]

Haven't played Green Acres yet.

However, mention of George O'Neil got me interested.

George was a well-known golfer, apparently friendly, or at
least knew Ross well, and was the first head professional
at Beverly CC.

We have two of the clubs that he made in our trophy case.

[Tom MacWood (Guest)]

RW
If there was still any doubt, I got a hold of an old source which confirmed the fact Illinois GC did change to Green Acres CC. I was looking at your website and it looks like all of AWT's Chicago area involvement took place in the mid-30's during his tour with the PGA - with the exception of Illinois and Westmoreland which have no date. Have you uncovered something that leads you to believe Illinois GC was an original design from an earlier date?

The fact that O'Neil, Roseman and Dearie were all from Philadelphia is very interesting and might explain a Tillinghast connection. From what I understand Green Acres (IllinoisGC) was built in 1917 with O'Neil being given credit. The other course that Tillie was said to be involved with was Westmoreland also built in 1917 by Roseman - who was formerly a caddie at Philadelphia CC. From what I have read Westmoreland was a pretty spectacular design at one time. Roseman and O'Neil collaborated on numerous designs. Do you have any idea when Tillinghast may have first come to Chicago?

[Rick Wolffe]

Jeff

Thanks again for the thoughts.

Tom

We have a brochure produced by Tillie around late 1925 that lists all of his courses under the banner, "Outstanding Golf Courses,"  The introductory heading to the list of courses reads, "THESE COURSE WERE PLANNED by A.W. Tillinghast, and the MOST NOTABLE WERE CONSTRUCTED UNDER THE SUPERVISION OF HIS ORGANIZATION."  In regards to Illinois Golf Club, Tillie lists this as an 18 hole course and original design.  The course is listed right after Shawnee, Essex County, Somerset Hills, Fresh Meadow and Cedar Brook and before Quaker Ridge, and San Francisco.  From this positioning in his listing one can conclude the date of this design would be between 1917 and 1918, which is consistent with the date that you have noted.

As for Westmoreland, Tillie lists this course under the Heading, "Reconstructed and Extended Courses."  Other courses under this heading that precede Westmoreland include Scarsdale CC, Spring Lake CC, Suburban CC.  From this inconclusive dating method, one could get a date slightly later than 1917, lets say 1919 to 1920.

However, an exact date may be difficult to determine as Tillie's projects were typically multi-year engagements with a start date and a completion that often floated, as what we could call today "punch list" or "warranty" work usually continued in the year or two that followed the course opening.

If you let me speculate some, could perhaps these projects have been started in the 1917 time frame as 18 stakes on a Sunday afternoon, and Tillie was possibly brought in to do a modern design after the property had been introduced to a primitive golf design.  In Westmoreland's case, this would be consistent with Tillie's listing it as a reconstructed and extended course.  Many of these courses, like Scarsdale, were pretty primitive nine hole affairs that Tillie totally reworked and extended.

RW

[Tom MacWood (Guest)]

RW
Your theory makes perfect sense to me. Actually Westmoreland was originally designed by the world famous David McCurrach, Jr. in 1911 and then remodeled in 1917 by Roseman. Both O'Neil and Roseman would have been neophytes in 1917 and may have have sought professional expertise -- and as Phila natives who might they have turned to? Its something to pursue.

[Paul Richards]

Tom, RW, Jeff:

I have searched long and hard for more information (including
photos) of George O'Neil.  In fact, my research led me to
finding out that he was taken care of by Albert Lasker, and
that Lasker might have his documents, etc.  I purchased a
book concerning the life of Lasker "After the flood", but that
didn't really get me any info on O'Neil.

From my research, it seems that either O'Neil alone, or in
tandem with Tom Bendelow, designed the original course at
Beverly CC.  Donald Ross came in in the mid-teens and
basically wrote up one of the first "Long-range master plans"
which the club implemented over a series of years.  Ross
changed much of the routing, and we can be assured that
which we are playing today is Ross, but I would really like
to find out more about O'Neil.

Any help you guys can provide would be greatly appreciated.

[Paul Richards]

Tom, RW, Jeff:

This is the extent of the info I currently have on George
O'Neil:

>GEORGE O’NEIL

>Beverly’s first golf professional, as well as its first Pro
>Emeritus, George O’Neil had been the pro at the Auburn Park
>Club, predecessor of the BCC.  O’Neil was a master club->maker, and we still have a few of his clubs.  He was a fine
>player in his own right, placing 11th in the 1911 Western
>Open at the Kent CC.

[SL_Solow]

I have played Green Acres many times.  Very cramped, nothing special about the routing.  Very flat.  About 4 or 5 interesting holes at most.  Any Tilly has been remodeled out of existence.  Several years ago they spent well over $500,000 and received a short par 3 with a faux waterfall as the main return.  Nice membership, well kept, old clubhouse but nothing memorable I'm sorry to say.

[AWT*]

In yesterday's report I mentioned this very favorable reaction of golf course architect Joe Roseman to our P.G.A. service.  This was particularly pleasing to me for it is my hope that all architects and course builders thoroughly understand that I desire to be only helpful and stimulating in aiding their work.  I would like to add that on the previous day, golf architect Ed Dearie accompanied me on a complete journey of a course, making many notations of suggestions, asking numerous questions an afterwards expressing his belief that the P.G.A. service would be very helpful to his profession and that it would result in the marked betterment of courses throughout the country.

A.W. Tillinghast
October 29, 1935

[Rick Wolffe]

Tom

I dug out the following Tillie letter that gives another clue to the date on Westmoreland.

President of the P.G.A.

Dear Sir:

Today was devoted to a trip to Wilmette, IL where I visited the Westmoreland Country Club at the request of P.G.A. member Al Lesperance, who combines the duties of club professional with those of course superintendent.  First I was taken to the twelfth hole, which the club intends changing, although undecided concerning the placement of a new green, which will add about 40 yards to the length.  Three sites have been under consideration but it was not difficult to find the proper one, immediately beyond the present green.  The site I selected is a half-natural one, which may be developed at very moderate cost.

While on this first inspection with Lesperance, I indicated a number of large sand areas, which serve no good purpose yet are very expensive to maintain.

In the afternoon we were joined by D.W. Bennett (President of the Westmoreland Club) and Dr. R.L. Lasater (Chairman of the Green Committee) and they took me immediately to the seventh (which was the sixteenth when I visited the course professionally fourteen years ago).  The hole measures 320 yards with a formal punch-bowl green and now they have secured adjoining property, which will enable them to extend the hole 50 yards.  I gave them advice concerning the recontouring of the new green.  At their request I gave advice concerning the recontouring of the sides of the fifth green to give the pits more depth without digging and also suggested the filling of very far-flung portions of pits on the ninth hole, which ware so far from the line of play as to be ineffective.

The officials and Lesperance expressed a particular sincere appreciation of the service.

A.W. Tillinghast
October 24th 1935

[Rick Wolffe]

Tom

Here is another reference to Roseman:

President of the PGA

Dear Sir:

This morning, at the request of P.G.A. member Joseph Roseman, I visited Evanston and with him went over his course (36 holes) the Pickwick Golf Club at Glenview, Ill.  After a thorough inspection of the entire course I could only express my admiration of the masterly way he had constructed (for Roseman is a golf course architect and builder as well as professional.)  He had made a great job of contouring, effectively breaking up the natural flat character of the terrain.  I was able to advise him, in answer to his questions, concerning the treatment of the fescue fairways to hold and improve them.  This was along the lines of proper fertilization methods.  While there were some other minor questions involving certain traps and sand areas, small criticism could be made.

AWT
October 28th 1935

[Tom MacWood (Guest)]

RW
I think it is very interesting that he surrounded himself with these guys in the mid-30's, it's not difficult to infer there was some kind of prior relationship. And it is interesting he refers to Roseman as not only an architect but also a builder. If he lists Westmoreland from pre-1925, it may be possible that he and Roseman colaborated there is some way.

[Paul Richards]

So no one has more info on George O'Neil than I provided
above?

[Tom Macwood (Guest)]

Paul
According to Whitten O'Neil was from Phila, and was a professional at Midlothian, Beverly, Lake Shore and Edgewater. He practiced golf architecture as a sideline, collaborating with Daray, Roseman and Jack Croke. He formed a full-time practice in the 20's but closed down sometime during the Depression. During the 30's, 40's and 50's he was bothered by very poor health and his friend and former pupil A.Lasker helped him with the expenses. He also designed a golf course for Lakser in 1928 called Melody Farms. He died in Miami, Fla. in 1955.

[Paul Richards]

Tom:

Thanks.  I am just looking for more info than is available
from the Architects of Golf.

[Rick Wolffe]

I found more references that would certainly cement the relationship between Tillie and Dearie.  I have no more info on O'Neal unfortunately.  Here is another letter:

President of the P.G.A.
Dear Sir:

The weather turned very cold today.  I went to the Oak Park Country Club at the urgent request of P.G.A. member Ren Smith (who succeeded his brother Horton there)  It will be recalled that I made certain recommendations at Oak Park just a year ago and already Constructore Eddie Dearie has completed both the Sixth and Fifteenth greens, and I am pleased to report that these are regarded very highly indeed.  Dearie had followed my instructions to the letter.

Today I was wanted to check the work on the Eleventh and the Seventeenth, both greens being now in the process of reconstruction.  I gave them the finishing touches and also instructed concerning the recontouring of the mound work on the left-frint of the Fifteenth green.  Dearie accompanied me today as well as W.C. Spears (chairman of the green committee) and W.W. Hodson (of the committee)

It is also interesting to know that Dearie informed me that another piece of work, which I sketched at another Chigaco course last year, had been completed and that a beautiful hole was the result.  This is the new home hole at Ridgemoor, outlined in my daily report of November 9th 1935.

Certainly it is very heartening to find our service is proving something more than mere recommendations, but that it is reality of completed work.

A.W. Tillinghast
November 4th 1936

[Joe Zucker]

Looks like Green Acres is going away to housing.  I've never been to the course, so I'm not sure how sad it will be to lose this Tillinghast course.


http://patch.com/illinois/northbrook/green-acres-country-club-planned-development

[Jeff_Brauer]

Years ago I did a semi-comprehensive list of course designs and redesigns in Chitown, starting with Architects of Golf, but adding what I knew locally.


Whenever we did remodels, Roseman and Dearie greens always had nice character.  I thought a few were actually Colt greens.  Maybe he learned from Tilllie, too.  Funny how the apprenticeship system worked in those days, although in some ways, its not too different now.


What I liked about their greens was, while then modern architects put green surround mounds on the inside curves of greens with shape, the aforementioned architects (including Colt) used roundish greens, and placed rises, mounds, earth forms on the outside curves (actually, few inside curves to put them on!) giving them a pleasing rolling look.  I could never convince KN of this way of thinking, but use the theory often on my own.


As to Melody Farms, that was the name of the most common dairy around Chicago, and as kids, we went to sort of a working farm exhibit there.  I would hazard a guess that the Melody Farm GC was right on that location....it is just east of I-94 on the way to Milwaukee.

[PCCraig]

Interesting...what was the club's downfall? Lack of memberships? Or clubhouse renovations?

[Bill Seitz]

Kind of a bummer, as this is one of those courses that I was only interested in playing because I had seen it from the Edens Spur so many times.  Always looked like it was in perfect condition, though I never really heard much discussion of it.  Given its prime location, one would think it would be a little more well known, but it never comes up in discussions of Chicago's better courses. 

[Peter Flory]

I've been a member of it for about 12 years.  I'm about 50% of the way through digitizing it into the simulator software.  I have taken hundreds of photos of it to reference in the process in case it gets developed over next year.


I also have the 1938 version in line to do next.  I've studied the old aerials extensively.  Almost all of the old features can be seen on the course today.  They just filled in the traps and never smoothed them over.  When I complete the 2 designs, I'll post them here. 


There are still a lot of the original bones in the current layout... maybe 50%.  The course got very crowded with trees over the years.  Over the past 10 years, they have been steadily removing trees and it has helped a lot.  They maintain it beautifully, keep it very firm and fast when possible, and have tons of plantings/ flower beds throughout. 


In 1940, shortly before the original club folded, they re-routed the back nine.  I don't know why they did it, but almost everything that is awkward about the back nine was due to that decision.   


Holes that still exist that were a part of the original Tilly design:
#1, #2, #3, #7, #8, #9, #10, #11, #12, #16 (but from a different angle), and #18


Summary of routing events
1924: original design
1940: re-routed several holes on the back nine
Early 70's: eliminated 2 original holes on the front nine to put in a driving range.  They added 2 new holes adjacent to the property.  They also shortened a short par 4 and made it a par 3 (the current #6) to keep par at 36 for the nine. 


Of the holes that are still originals, a lot of great cross bunkers were taken out in the 40's and 50's.  Most other bunkering has been adjusted, moved, reshaped, contoured, etc.  A few of the greens were shifted slightly and bunkers were added in front to prevent run ups.  Also, in the original design, there was one body of water between #11 and #12.   7 new bodies of water were added since, most in the 80's and 90's. 


Overall, it is a very flat property.  I think that the best quality of the original Tilly design was the bunkering.  It's only 115 acres and had approximately 81 traps.  His routing on the back nine was better than what currently exists. 


It's a shame to see any course go down.  In this case, it is especially a shame to see a Tillinghast course close (in a nice location and not during a recession).  But there are a lot of great courses in the area to absorb the members.