[Chris Johnston]

Fellow GCAers:

Many have asked for it, you've got it!  We have scheduled September 16-18 for a GCA/Rater weekend at Dismal River Golf Club.  You may come out to see (or get reacquainted with) our wonderful existing course and we will arrange for afternoon all access tours of Tom Doak's new layout, now under construction.  Now, you can see firsthand what all the "fuss" is about and fall in the Sandhills can be special.

We very much believe good golf should be shared, so golf will be an unheard of $85 for all day play and rooms will be offered at "Member Accompanied" rates on a first come/first served basis.

The course is in terrific shape, the food is wonderful, and the accomodations are simply as good as it gets out this way.  Feel free to come with a buddy, or bring your spouse.  We may even throw in a rainbow, or an evening light or star show!

Your first beer is on me, and we will have plenty of pork chops, meat loaf, and dry aged steaks ready for you.  Cigars at the fire pit on the back deck?

Call or email me if you are interested. 


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[Jason Hines]

Chris, I am already booked that weekend with two other friends and look forward to the trip.  Thanks for great offer and see you then.

Jason Hines

[mike_beene]

better make sure Mr Speaker has his group gone first. we have some strong opinions here.

[Mac Plumart]

I'm already booked to be there!  Cool!!

[Adam Clayman]

Wow Chris. What a great idea. I can tell you all, the turf in the fall here is wonderful. Cool nights tighten it up and makes for the most fun. Come out and if anyone needs before or after suggestions, or assistance, please don't hesitate to ask. Look forward to it. Now I hope I can make it. I do have a conflict on Sunday but wil bust hump to be there for some part. Thanks Chris.

p.s. I was wondering how the site for 18 green was selected. That picture says it all. 

[Jason Hines]

Good idea about the before and after suggestions. We arrive early Friday morning and depart early Sunday morning and are playing our way there.  As soon as our itinerary is set, I will post if others want to join in.

Chris, one small question, do your televisions show college football in the evenings?

[Eric Smith]

Chris, one small question, do your televisions show college football in the evenings?

Jason,

You can count on it!

[Jason Hines]

Eric, thanks for the confirmation.

[Frank M]

I would have been there in a heartbeat if I could.

[Dan Herrmann]

Trust me guys, Dismal River has really gotten into my head in a very good way.  I had such a great time there.

The course is really interesting and presents some really neat architecture.  It stands extremely well on its own.  Add the new course and you're going to have a combination that's tough to beat.

And the clubhouse...  Aah, the clubhouse.  Satellite TV and big leather recliners in a theater room.  That's cool!

[rjsimper]

Is there a comprehensive (and concise) breakdown of all the changes made from opening/first reviews until now? Even better, before/after photos? It's still remarkable to me what a great turnaround has occurred in the general perception of the golf course amongst GCA and I am extremely curious what was done....and also wondering if any other maligned courses can follow the same formula.

I would love to be there 9/16 but a major new life responsibility expected any day dictates that I stick close to home.

[Scott Warren]

It's still remarkable to me what a great turnaround has occurred in the general perception of the golf course amongst GCA and I am extremely curious what was done

Is it unfair to suggest the owner joining the forum and two of our more popular contributors joining Dismal River probably didn't hurt?

That said, in the recent GCA.com Post Modern ratings it came in around the mid 40s from memory which is fairly on par with the opinions I've read on here and elsewhere over the past few years.

[Mac Plumart]

Scott...Frank and honest commentary, homeboy.  Frank and honest...that is the mantra of this site.  So, it is fair to say what you want as long as it not an outright lie (which has been done previously, but that is a whole 'nother conversation  )

I've said this before and, knowing me, I'll say it again  ...

I didn't see Dismal prior to last year...so I don't know what the issue with the course were.  All I know is what is there now.  And to me, it is fun, thrilling, and interesting golf in a dramatic landscape.  It is a difficult golf course and I think the better players will like it the most.  I would imagine it would score better under the Golf Digest criteria (as I'm sure the resistance to scoring and shot values scores would be HIGH), but I do think it is under-rated across the board.  I hope the new course is a great compliment to the existing course.

Furthermore, simply being there (at Dismal River) is freakin' fun and a great experience.  To me, that adds a great deal to the trip and makes me want to go back again and again.

That is my 2 cents...take it or leave it.

[Dan Herrmann]

What's even better is the sense of the place having a real soul.  It's so abstract, but it's (to me) so true.

Scott - I'm not a rater and I'm not a member, and I thought the place was fantastic.  I had NO idea what to expect, and I was blown away.

I'd played Sutton Bay the week before.  The staff there was great too, but there was something different and better than Sutton Bay.  Sutton Bay was by no means a bad experience, but there was such a sense of community and real common vision at Dismal River.  The employees were more like friends and everybody seemed to have a smile on their face.   

To quote from my friend Eric Pevoto, it's like the Cheers bar - a place where everybody yells "Norm!" when you walk in because they're genuinely happy to see you.

Oh yeah - the golf course is really wonderful.

[Scott Warren]

Dan/Mac,

To be clear, I am not suggesting 40-odd Post Modern is some kind of slight, no back-handed bitchslap there. Top 50 on a field of every golf course built since John Lyon was in Kindergarten is no mean feat.

My point by listing that was that I don't think the view of the course has necessarily changed of late on GCA, but that by having the owner and two members here we are hearing more enthusiastic talk about it, in part from people who clearly joined/bought the place for a reason!

Sometimes I think folks feel that to make the point that they love a course they need to say it's one of the best ever, but I think I saw Mac gave DR 1* during the PM100 voting and let's face it - one-star on that scale is a hell of a golf course.

[Mac Plumart]

Sometimes I think folks feel that to make the point that they love a course they need to say it's one of the best ever, but I think I saw Mac gave DR 1* during the PM100 voting and let's face it - one-star on that scale is a hell of a golf course.

Scott...you make a great point here.  I know a lot of people are crazy in love with their course.  And this love causes them to be irrational in conversations about it.  I see it all the time with people I interact with, especially in my day-to-day play with non-GCA members.  For instance, the type of criticism that the Atlanta Athletic Club is taking right now would make some of the members I know furious AND defensive.  In fact, it happens on this site as well...all the time.

In your comment, you state that "folks feel that to make a point that they love a course they need to say it's one of the best ever."  And yes, I see that on this site as well...there are certainly sacred cows that any criticism of will be met with a harsh response from known entities.  But I, personally, have tried to be as objective as I possibly can be with every course I've played.  And I've clearly said that Dismal is not "one of the best ever."  It is not in the class of Shinnecock Hills or The Old Course.  BUT I truly believe it is under-rated as a golf course and more than anything I find it FUN to play. 

[JC Jones]

I wonder if it could be a combination of changes to the golf course and, more importantly, people actually going out there and playing it as opposed to ripping it for being a Nicklaus course.  Remember, Mac and Eric joined AFTER playing the golf course and before Chris joined the website.  They had no incentive to fall in love with the place but did so anyways.  Just look at the lashing Eric got when he said he liked it more than Ballyneal last year.

There is a certain GCA.com love that isn't reflected in the general public ratings.  Same can be said for Ballyneal, Kingsley, Long Shadow, Rustic Canyon, any Doak or C&C course, etc., etc.  Very few people seem willing to take that same question of whether courses are overrated on gca.com to the architects of those courses who participate on GCA.com the same way they will take it to the owner of a golf course.

But I think the most convincing evidence of the greatness of Dismal River is the views of Don Mahaffey pre and post visiting Dismal River along with the opinions of the uninterested like Dan Herrmann and John Lyon.  It is easy for the gca.com crowd who hate Nicklaus designs to dismiss a course without ever playing it, especially considering its proximity to Sand Hills; I think what we are seeing now is people actually playing the golf course and then having an opinion on it.

[Adam Clayman]

JC, That's a load. It's the changes that have been made that are what is pushing the course to receive favorable reviews.

Those who report on their experience, with constructive criticism, is not bashing.

As an example, there's a real true believer who once said he would never ever return to DR. Well, I played with him a few weeks a go there and he was quite impressed with the golf. A lot went into the hatred, and most of it, for some, was a specific individual. But, there have been lots of reports, both then and now, and their differences have zero to do with who the designer was.

[Eric Smith]

One can be a regular guy, join a club because he loved it and honestly believe it to be among the finest courses in the land without having to incur a letter from magazine panel czars who deem it otherwise - the #'z don't lie, right? Get in line private!! Sounds like work, not golf, to me.

I've played a few golf courses in my life, including some of those the magazines tell us are the best and I have no shame in my one and only ranking of DR in the thread Scott mentions. Remember, NGLA and Crystal Downs members - Tom Doak brought you your lofty ranking. Made it 'OK' for magazine panelists to be true to theirselves with their opinions.

I wish Dan was a member. We'd certainly have the makings of a heck of a football team from the gca ranks. Mac the former star QB and the rest of us blocking for him. Chris - let's get a game against SHGC one fine fall saturday. They can come over to our place. Our range at the clubhouse would be perfect. Matter of fact, let's light that sumbitch and have night golf at Dismal. Put in on the Underhill's bill.

[Jim Colton]

Mac,

 I believe you have Shinnecock 8th and Dismal River 9th in your personal rankings. That certainly seems like you have it in the same league. Or is there a wide gap between those two spots.

 I still get conflicting views about DR from those who have seen it before and after, so it's hard to know what to believe. If you trust Chris, Mac, Eric and others, then this could be one of the greatest Doak scale jumps of all time.

I guess the only way to know for sure is to see it for yourself, which makes it that much better that Chris provided this generous invite.

[JC Jones]

JC, That's a load. It's the changes that have been made that are what is pushing the course to receive favorable reviews.

Those who report on their experience, with constructive criticism, is not bashing.

As an example, there's a real true believer who once said he would never ever return to DR. Well, I played with him a few weeks a go there and he was quite impressed with the golf. A lot went into the hatred, and most of it, for some, was a specific individual. But, there have been lots of reports, both then and now, and their differences have zero to do with who the designer was.

Adam,

How many here on GCA.com have seen it both pre and post changes to the golf course?  Sure that may be the sentiment out there in Nebraska but from my understanding, the golf course has seen much more play from GCA.com people this year than it had in all the prior years to this.

[Eric Smith]

Oh, JC - I never took any lashing over my comments. Questioned, of course,  but no pain was inflicted! Yes, some take me less seriously then before, but I always have been friends with Anthony and you so I was already written off as a hack by the cognoscenti!

[Mac Plumart]

Jim...

That is a list of my favorites...and Dismal is one of my favorite places to be that is for sure.  That is NOT a list of how I rate the architecture of each course.  For instance, TPC Sawgrass on a architecture basis would be MUCH higher...but I don't like many aspects of how they do what they do down there.

And yes, Chris' invite is the perfect opportunity for people to see the course...and experience the club.

[JC Jones]

Oh, JC - I never took any lashing over my comments. Questioned, of course,  but no pain was inflicted! Yes, some take me less seriously then before, but I always have been friends with Anthony and you so I was already written off as a hack by the cognoscenti!

Death by association.  My wife has similar problems

[Chris Johnston]

Cool places attract great people and cool people make great places.  Look around, are the people who are members cool?

BedBoss - I love the idea.  Dan does need to sign up to anchor the trenches and Patron and Saltz too to give us some young legs on the outside.  You and me working the center of the field (bunkers" range with Mac slinging the ball.  Kavanaugh can play the role of Vince Lombardi...Perfect!  Clayman in charge of the ground game!  We may be on to something!

Remember folks, this is an invitation to come out and see for yourself.  May even be a home game for Mullen HS - 8 man football is a hoot!

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