Getting more Golf Digest Raters

[John Kavanaugh]

  Is John Kavanaugh still a GD rater?

  Anthony

I was never a rater for a magazine.  I would have been happy to have been one but was never asked.

  Sounds like you have been black balled. I would like to see you on the list. How about Golf Magazine? Have they contacted you?

  Anthony

My brother is married to Joe Passov's sister, Joe is the architectural editor of Golf Magazine.  I would never put Joe's job a risk by accepting a position on their panel.  The letters to the editor from past members of this site alone would give the magazine cause.

Like I said above, there was a point in my life when I was interested in being a magazine rater.  I am past that as I am afraid I no longer possess the energy to live up to my own high standards.

[Tony Weiler]

Steve, welcome.  In his press conf. today Tiger mentioned your name and the '96 Am. 

[Eric Smith]

Welcome to the board, Steve.

I remember seeing you play in the Golfworld at Palmetto Dunes. You finished right up there near the top iirc, and I'm pretty sure you were paired with Hank Kuehne when he set the course record, though I may be running my years together. It was a while back!

Anyway, welcome to GCA and if you don't mind me saying - GO VOLS!! Did you go to any of the Tennessee/Florida games when you were at UF? What a series back then, though my VOLS lost 'em all! There was nothing, absolutely nothing that compared to the game day excitement of playing against Coach Spurrier, Danny Wuerffel, Jack Jackson and the Mighty Gators!

[Michael Wharton-Palmer]

Very welcome Steve...glad to have you on here....

[John Kavanaugh]

Steve,

What are your personal favorite top ten courses in the United States that you have played?

[ward peyronnin]

Welcome Steve,

Perhaps you could personally contact some of the guys from the Philly/New York area....it is often obvious who they are, who post on here and they will know folks.

This give me an opportunity to recall a perhaps even more amazing performance on Pumpkin Ridge than yours and Tigers. Several years ago an article in the wsj covered a speed golf round by an Oregon teaching pro/triatlhete who quickly became a personal hero.

They recorded an 18 hole speed golf round he played there in which he shot 114 and 1/2: a gross 66 played in 48 and 1/2 minutes using 6 clubs...I marvel at that still. And on a championship course !

[Steve Scott]

Steve,

What are your personal favorite top ten courses in the United States that you have played?

My personal faves in no particular order:
Oakmont, Pebble Beach, Seminole, Augusta, The Preserve (Carmel Valley), Shinnecock, Shoreacres, Pumpkin Ridge, Mountain Ridge, and The Ridge at Back Brook (of course!)

[Melvyn Morrow]

Steve

Is that a tone of desperation in your writing or is it that only Raters are welcome at your club?

Man,  you need to relax and take up playing golf as it will offer much help in fighting stress and keeping in shape. Add to that the fun of walking and thinking while you navigate courses may take your mind off this useless spreading illness of wanting to be mentioned in the Despatches of Golf Digest.

Do not rate the raters, but pity them for they do not know the damages they do in wasting our time and interest.

Or have all the modern aids finally condemned golf to a game played by folk who do not want to walk, think and now can't decide by their own efforts which courses they should play.

To want your club associated with any rater cries out desperation IMHO why, because the first person reading the listings will wonder if you deserve that position you have been given – thus questioning the viability of the whole rating business -  Well its sell magazines to the lost souls of golf  - who in their defence know better  - for the simple reason they start to ask questions along the lines of why is this club up there, while another is well down the list – ever decreasing circles until you disappear up you own as……... – well I think you get the picture.

Fight the need, ultimately they are as much help as a hole in the head – your head and wallet.

Apart from that enjoy yourself, cast out these devils and enjoy your game, club and surroundings, life is just too short.

Melvyn

[John Kavanaugh]

Steve,

What are your personal favorite top ten courses in the United States that you have played?

My personal faves in no particular order:
Oakmont, Pebble Beach, Seminole, Augusta, The Preserve (Carmel Valley), Shinnecock, Shoreacres, Pumpkin Ridge, Mountain Ridge, and The Ridge at Back Brook (of course!)

Nice list.  Reads like an EKG.  Thanks.

[Dan Herrmann]

Melvyn,
HI there - Steve invited raters and others  in post #1.  All is well

[Terry Lavin]

Melvyn,
HI there - Steve invited raters and others  in post #1.  All is well

As a good man hereabouts once said, "Don't feed the troll.". Starvation is the best diet.

[Dan Herrmann]

Terry - your point is very well taken.  Merci!

[Steve Scott]

Melvyn,
HI there - Steve invited raters and others  in post #1.  All is well

Thank you for noticing Dan... I am inviting all raters to experience The Ridge!!!

[Joel_Stewart]

This is a fairly interesting attempt to get more raters.  Maybe this will open the doors for other courses to invite panelists?  You're not the only course seeking panelists so I hope it works.

I'm not sure what your motive is?  Having not played it, (I did live in New Jersey for 6 years and have played all of the courses ranked above it) I'm not sure if you're trying to move the course up a bit  to sell memberships or for some other reason?   I would think you could move up one or two spots but probably not enough to garner top 100 status in the US which is now limited to the top 6 courses on the list below.

1. Pine Valley G.C., Pine Valley
2. Baltusrol G.C. (Lower), Springfield
3. Plainfield C.C., Plainfield
4. Baltusrol G.C. (Upper), Springfield
5. Galloway National G.C.,Galloway 
6. Somerset Hills C.C., Bernardsville
7. Ridgewood C.C.(East/West), Paramus
8. Bayonne G.C., Bayonne
T9. Liberty National G.C., Jersey City
T9. The Ridge at Back Brook, Ringoes
11. Trump National G.C.Bedminster (Old), Bedminster
12. Hidden Creek G.C., Egg Harbor, Township

Read More http://www.golfdigest.com/golf-courses/new_jersey#ixzz1UkKFkr00

[Melvyn Morrow]

Hi Dan

I take it that the meaning of my first line is unclear

Is that a tone of desperation in your writing or is it that only Raters are welcome at your club?


Terry
As for the Troll comment, well if you are childish and stupid enough to believe in their existence, I think that shows us all how weak your argument must be to troll up such crap. Anyway I thought that a troll is the poor gullible individual that believes he is playing golf when he rides a cart and used distance aids. Now that is a Troll in every sense of the word.

Melvyn

[Steve Scott]

This is a fairly interesting attempt to get more raters.  Maybe this will open the doors for other courses to invite panelists?  You're not the only course seeking panelists so I hope it works.

I'm not sure what your motive is?  Having not played it, (I did live in New Jersey for 6 years and have played all of the courses ranked above it) I'm not sure if you're trying to move the course up a bit  to sell memberships or for some other reason?   I would think you could move up one or two spots but probably not enough to garner top 100 status in the US which is now limited to the top 6 courses on the list below.

1. Pine Valley G.C., Pine Valley
2. Baltusrol G.C. (Lower), Springfield
3. Plainfield C.C., Plainfield
4. Baltusrol G.C. (Upper), Springfield

5. Galloway National G.C.,Galloway 
6. Somerset Hills C.C., Bernardsville
7. Ridgewood C.C.(East/West), Paramus
8. Bayonne G.C., Bayonne
T9. Liberty National G.C., Jersey City
T9. The Ridge at Back Brook, Ringoes
11. Trump National G.C.Bedminster (Old), Bedminster
12. Hidden Creek G.C., Egg Harbor, Township

Read More http://www.golfdigest.com/golf-courses/new_jersey#ixzz1UkKFkr00

So if I understand correctly, only a max of six courses per state are allowed in top 100? That is interesting...

[Joe_Tucholski]

This is a fairly interesting attempt to get more raters.  Maybe this will open the doors for other courses to invite panelists?  You're not the only course seeking panelists so I hope it works.

I'm not sure what your motive is?  Having not played it, (I did live in New Jersey for 6 years and have played all of the courses ranked above it) I'm not sure if you're trying to move the course up a bit  to sell memberships or for some other reason?   I would think you could move up one or two spots but probably not enough to garner top 100 status in the US which is now limited to the top 6 courses on the list below.

1. Pine Valley G.C., Pine Valley
2. Baltusrol G.C. (Lower), Springfield
3. Plainfield C.C., Plainfield
4. Baltusrol G.C. (Upper), Springfield

5. Galloway National G.C.,Galloway 
6. Somerset Hills C.C., Bernardsville
7. Ridgewood C.C.(East/West), Paramus
8. Bayonne G.C., Bayonne
T9. Liberty National G.C., Jersey City
T9. The Ridge at Back Brook, Ringoes
11. Trump National G.C.Bedminster (Old), Bedminster
12. Hidden Creek G.C., Egg Harbor, Township

Read More http://www.golfdigest.com/golf-courses/new_jersey#ixzz1UkKFkr00

So if I understand correctly, only a max of six courses per state are allowed in top 100? That is interesting...

I believe he's saying the 6 are the limited number in New Jersey, not that GD limits to 6 max from each state (CA and NY both have above 10...others may as well).

[John Kavanaugh]

Mr. Scott,

Before you give up hope go play Rich Harvest Links.  You can buy your way on any list even though personally I believe your time would be better spent playing with the best junior golfers in the metropolitan area instead of raters. Be careful what you ask for.

[Joel_Stewart]

Steve: You misunderstood my post or I wasn't clear.  There is no limit per state on courses, all I'm saying is currently the top 6 courses in New Jersey are on the top 100 US list.  Joe is correct in California and New York as an example have more then 6.

I think you need to take a look at the categories and ask Pete to send you the Ridge at Back Brooks numbers.  From there you may be able to see what the panelists like and don't like as well as their comments.

You have a few things going for you, one it's a Fazio and their is a large faction of panelists who like Fazio.  Furthermore you're in New Jersey which has a large concentration of panelists from the surrounding states.

Please don't listen to John.  You can't buy your way on the Top 100 list.  A lot of people still bring up the Shadow Creek fiasco and the extrinsic features and activities but that is long gone and closely monitored.  With that said, you do have to "manage" panelists and make sure they are there to evaluate the course and not entertain their friends or guests or just looking for a free round.

[Adam Clayman]

  Is John Kavanaugh still a GD rater?

  Anthony

I was never a rater for a magazine.  I would have been happy to have been one but was never asked.

  Sounds like you have been black balled. I would like to see you on the list. How about Golf Magazine? Have they contacted you?

  Anthony

Man, Are you really that ignorant? To be on Golf's panel one needs extensive international experience.

[Ronald Montesano]

I love the transparency and the irony of this thread. SS showed his hand from the start with a very generous invitation. At the same time, given the annual "access-harlot" thread that no doubt is due to appear, this is the ironic reversal, where a course issues an invitation to a group of knowledgeable (present company excluded) aficionados.

[Adam Clayman]

Forgive me Steve, I forgot to welcome you to the bar room brawl. Welcome.

I'm curious if you know...
1) How many site visits Mr. Fazio made when the course was under construction?
2) Who was his lead on the job?
3) What was the final costs?

We'll start there and I completely understand if you are relatively new to the course and don't know the pre-opening minutia.

I hope you take the time to read the course reviews and feature interviews provided on this site. They can be very insightful in learning what to look for when analyzing golf courses for the purposes of identifying why it is you like what you like.

[Steve Scott]

Steve: You misunderstood my post or I wasn't clear.  There is no limit per state on courses, all I'm saying is currently the top 6 courses in New Jersey are on the top 100 US list.  Joe is correct in California and New York as an example have more then 6.

I think you need to take a look at the categories and ask Pete to send you the Ridge at Back Brooks numbers.  From there you may be able to see what the panelists like and don't like as well as their comments.

You have a few things going for you, one it's a Fazio and their is a large faction of panelists who like Fazio.  Furthermore you're in New Jersey which has a large concentration of panelists from the surrounding states.

Please don't listen to John.  You can't buy your way on the Top 100 list.  A lot of people still bring up the Shadow Creek fiasco and the extrinsic features and activities but that is long gone and closely monitored.  With that said, you do have to "manage" panelists and make sure they are there to evaluate the course and not entertain their friends or guests or just looking for a free round.

Just so it is clear, in no way, shape or form am I saying we should be top 100 or anything like that and we are not interested in "buying" onto any list.  I am just trying to get the message out about our club that if a rater wants to come play we would welcome them, simple as that.  We are a very new club (opened in 2002) and most people do not know about us or how close we are located to other top rated clubs.  I feel I know a decent amount about golf and going about things the proper way, but there are new territories that I am exploring as a PGA Golf Professional and this is one of them.  In the short amount of time I have posted this, I am learning a lot about the whole picture of ratings.  I appreciate everyone who has added to this posting as it seems like it has generated a lot of interest.  There is a lot of knowledge held by the GCAers and if I can tap into that then that would be great.  In my career I have always tried to learn about new things from those who are smarter and have more experience in certain areas and this one is no different.  Thanks to all who have posted and I look forward to learning more about how GCA members view golf.

[Steve Scott]

I love the transparency and the irony of this thread. SS showed his hand from the start with a very generous invitation. At the same time, given the annual "access-harlot" thread that no doubt is due to appear, this is the ironic reversal, where a course issues an invitation to a group of knowledgeable (present company excluded) aficionados.
[/quot
Ronald,
Thanks for noting the generous inviation.  This has been an interesting thread.  We will see what happens from here!

[Chris Johnston]

Steve:

You are doing great and it's great to have you around here.  Making your place available is admirable and you have done it with class.