Way OT - Anyone know why Walton Heath is not a "Royal" club?

[David_Tepper]

With two Kings (one serving as the Club Captain) and two Prime Ministers as past members, does anyone know why Walton Heath has never received the designation of being a "Royal" club?

[Mark Bourgeois]

David,

Not only that but I believe Walton Heath can claim the only king to ever have served as a club's captain.

I don't have the club's excellent history on hand but the two obvious answers are either the club never solicited the designation or was rejected. The club's unparalleled political connections (eg, "putt you for the premiership?") may have rendered it more a liability. See: David Lloyd George.

This is a question I have seen raised also for Ganton, Rye and Durban -- Alwoodley certainly would seem deserving of the honor as well. In Rye's case it applied for royal patronage in 1937 but was rejected. In Ganton's case Edward VII served as patron and played there with some regularity. The club history notes despite his patronage as king "he had no inclination to allow the title 'Royal' to be added to the name of the club.

I guess Flashman was right: the man's a pig!

[Mark Chaplin]

I believe Walton Heath never asked, they had the option in their centenary year and Royal status would undoubtedly have been granted but they decided against it.

[Tim Martin]

I believe Walton Heath never asked, they had the option in their centenary year and Royal status would undoubtedly have been granted but they decided against it.

Mark-Is there a reason that they would not wan`t the "Royal" designation?

[Mark Bourgeois]

Phil Pilley's outstanding history to the rescue:

http://www.waltonheath.com/Heritage/Royalty.aspx

Unsurprisingly for a club with such a rich history, the answer is not straightforward.

[David_Tepper]

Mark B.  -

Many thanks for taking the time to post the link to that article. Very interesting stuff.

DT

[Tim Martin]

Phil Pilley's outstanding history to the rescue:

http://www.waltonheath.com/Heritage/Royalty.aspx

Unsurprisingly for a club with such a rich history, the answer is not straightforward.

Mark- Thanks for the link.

[Bob Jenkins]

The reason it is not yet a "Royal" course is that Mayhugh has only played the course on one occasion.

Had he had the opportunity to spend more time there instead of having to follow Jenkins into London for dinner, he would likely have had chance to raise the status of the course.

Bob J

[Mark Chaplin]

Bob this topic could easily be entitled "is Jenkins Royal ?". I trust you are well, hope to catch up before too long.

[Mark Bourgeois]

John and Tim,

You're both welcome. If you enjoyed the story I think you would enjoy the Pilley history. Won the USGA book of the year award if I recall.

Mark

[Bob_Huntley]

In spite of the actions of the Club at certain times, I am sure that some members recall that Edward the Eighth was a bit of a cad when remembering his score and wondering whether his putt was indeed whithin the circle of friendship.

The elevation of the Duke of York to captaincy of the R&A on their Two hundred and Fiftieth aniversary was not universally acclaimed by the rank and file; I do know this for a fact.

Bob

[Mark Bourgeois]

Bob, the Scots and colonials had their fill of English cram-downs?

[Terry Lavin]

Looked regal on television despite the fact that a golf pauper won the championship.

[Kalen Braley]

What does a course benefit/get when designated with a Royal status?

Something tangible or is it like getting an honorary degree from some college you never attended that doesn't really mean anything.

[Niall C]

Kalen

As far as I know it simply gives the club the right to call itself Royal. Whether or not another club without Royal patronage could put Royal inits title I'm not sure. I suppose there's no law against it but who would want to be a member of such a club.

Niall

[BCrosby]

Niall -

I've never understood what is entailed in getting royal patronage.

I assume you can't - on your own - begin selling Heinz mustard as Royal Heinz mustard.

Bob

[Kalen Braley]

Thanks for the comments Niall,

As much as I have honestly tried, I really don't get the whole royalty thing in the UK in these modern times.  Getting a piece of public funds, living in exhorbiant castles/mansions, traveling to and fro on the taxpayers dollar, all for what in return?

[Mark Chaplin]

Kalen - I expect the President's annual transportation bill is higher than the Civil List cost of the Queen and the Duke of Edinburgh, I cannot find disclosure on it so cannot be sure. What cost a Head of State, ours is truly independent of the government and doesn't need to get the most votes (or least in the case of Bush) to be elected.

As the Monarch is my Head of State I do not expect you to get it or understand it.

[Scott Warren]

There is also the tourism value to the UK of its Royal family...

Plus, without Harry and Wills the red tops would be pretty light on for content!

[Sean_A]

Kalen, I am not keen on the idea of a monarch, but at the end of the day there are tons of blue bloods so there isn't much point in losing sleep over it.  Besides, its probably a wash in what the country takes in from monarch tourism compared to the expenses.

To be frank, I am disappointed when a club doesn't have an image of the reigning monarch in a prominent position.  I would never begrudge a toast to the Queen. 

Concerning Walton Heath, I think it was best to leave the royal out.  Walton Heath has a ring to it which royal patronage cannot improve upon.

Ciao 

[Melvyn Morrow]

Kalen

It’s an adult thing, Royalty.

In time I suspect you will understand it.

Yet I still find it hard to believe that anyone would go to war on the orders of an actor, but then it takes all sorts. I live in a Kingdom you live in a Republic.

I feel that we have the best of both worlds, well that’s until we got Blair then Brown as our PM’s. See what happens when you allow ordinary people the right to vote, next thing will be allowing carts on golf courses, equipment technology to run amuck and distance aids ever where you look.

Golf is a Royal game, so I do not understand the game being so strong in America

Melvyn

[Mark Bourgeois]

Melvyn, I agree with you on the "grown-ups" point. As I explain to friends baffled by the concept of the British monarchy, the Anglo-Saxons realized they couldn't govern themselves and brought in the Germans and the Normans to lord over them.

[Kalen Braley]

Guys,

Point taken, and at some point waaaaay in the past that was true that they actually wielded power, but it isn't anymore.  They are just powerless figureheads.

As for American officials, sure you may not like them as I don't like many of them.  But at least they are people who are voted into real positions with actual authority over something.

P.S.  I had a good chuckle at the grown-ups comment.  Most of us have actually moved on and stopped believing in Cinderella-like fairy tales with castles, unicorns, rainbows, and frogs who turn into princes.  But I guess not everyone has gotten past that 10 year old stage!

[Melvyn Morrow]

Mark

“the Anglo-Saxons realized they couldn't govern themselves and brought in the Germans and the Normans to lord over them.”

I wonder what the percentage of people make up the USA – well the ones that have to sit when playing golf and use distance aids to make up for the questionable IQ’s. Mind you your country is so big I understand why you need GPS and that’s only to get from home to course.

Don’t worry, in time we all mature

Melvyn
(from an old Scottish family)

PS Kalen - Moved on - you guys with your Disneyland - love it, at least our castles could face a real seige  - did you know they have a room for cart riders - bottleneck dungeons - ever tried to do the wall of death ride in a cart on the walls of the bottleneck dugngeons - next time in St Andrews check out the old castle dungeon, its a bottleneck one. Have a nice cart day

[David Egan]

Kalen

It’s an adult thing, Royalty.

In time I suspect you will understand it.

Yet I still find it hard to believe that anyone would go to war on the orders of an actor, but then it takes all sorts. I live in a Kingdom you live in a Republic.

I feel that we have the best of both worlds, well that’s until we got Blair then Brown as our PM’s. See what happens when you allow ordinary people the right to vote, next thing will be allowing carts on golf courses, equipment technology to run amuck and distance aids ever where you look.

Golf is a Royal game, so I do not understand the game being so strong in America

Melvyn

I guess it's fitting that one ridiculous anachronism supports another.