Template Hole Madness! Redan - Full Roster Preview!

[Richard Choi]

Sorry it took so long, but I am finally ready to announce the roster of Redan holes for Template Hole Madness and the seedings.

I have picked 40 holes for the tournament, which means there will be a "play-in" round and I have divided the candidates into 4 divisions.

I am still missing information for some holes, it would be greatly appreciated if folks can send me any additional information you may have.

Clarification: #7-#10 seeds will be playing the "Play-In" games starting end of this week. I will convene max of 4 matches at a time so that the first page of the discussion is not taken over by THM threads.

So, without further ado, here are the contestants.

TEPaul Division
1 (overall) North Berwick #15
2 Old Macdonald #12
3 Camargo #15
4 Lawsonia #4
5 Shinnecock Hills #7
6 Fox Chapel #6
7 Greenbrier (Old White) #8
8 Tamarack #7
9 Kingsley #16
10 Rivermont #4

Huntley Division
1 NGLA #4
2 The Country Club in Pepper Pike #14
3 LACC #11
4 Hidden Creek #4
5 Westhampton #7
6 Chicago #7
7 CC of Fairfield #9
8 Mountaintop #11
9 Glen Mills #14
10 Kiawah Island (Ocean) #8

Mucci Division
1 Piping Rock #3
2 Yeamans Hall #6
3 Shoreacres #14
4 Swinley #4
5 Inniscrone #8
6 Blue Mound #13
7 CC of Charleston #11
8 Forsgate (Banks) #7
9 Knoll (West) #3
10 Stevens Ranch #7

Vander Borght Division
1 Somerset #2
2 Riviera #4
3 Yale #13
4 Mid Ocean Club #17
5 Hackensack #12
6 Pacific Dunes #17
7 St Louis CC #16
8 Mountain Lake #11
9 Dormie Club #7
10 North Shore #9

[Richard Choi]

TEPaul Division #1
North Berwick #15, 190 yards

From Ran - The much copied 190 yard Redan par three. The term Redan is borrowed from the military and means ‘guarding parapet.’ The key is for the tee ball to clear the parapet and yet still stop quickly on the green. Subsequent versions have been better done as a mound some forty yards short of the green obscures part of this hole.   

   


   

[Richard Choi]

Huntley Division #1, NGLA #4, 190 yards   

From Ran - Of all the versions of the oft-copied Redan, this one is supreme thanks to a) its glorious natural location and b) its pitched green whose slope is severe enough to help the ball continue torollwhile at the same time not too severe as to reduce the number ofinteresting hole locations.Interestingly enough, the high to low point on the green is a whopping five feet. In terms of routing, this hole represents a finechange in direction in a relatively straightforward out and back layout.   

[Richard Choi]

Mucci Division, #1 Seed, Piping Rock, Hole #3, 185 yards

The Redan hole for many. Who can argue? The front left bunker is a fulltwelve feet deep, making it the most intimidatingof Macdonald/Raynor’s Redan front bunkers. Still, the bunker should be avoided as the green has greatsweep fromfront right to back left. The proper aim can be as much as twenty yards right of certain hole locations, and seeing the ball take the slope just perfectly is the favorite shot for many on this course.

[Richard Choi]

Vander Borght, #1 Seed, Somerset, Hole #2, 175 yards

Tillinghast, like Macdonald, tried to make as many annual trips to Great Britain as possible. Like Macdonald, Tillinghast was impressed with the Redan hole at North Berwick. Combined, the two produced the two finest versions of it in the United States. This one is set over land that begs for it. More so than with other Redans, the player pays a significant price for missing the green to the right as this green is pitched severely to the back-left corner. The only shame is that the rear of the green has subsided to such a degree over the years that there are only two real hole locations: front and back-center. While tinkering with one of the great holes in American golf would make many nervous, clubs should be able to recognize a hole in need of a little help. Tillinghast’s own take on Redans was that ‘some of the most interesting holes are those where the best line of the flag is not direct.’ He delivered on this point at the 2nd hole.

[Richard Choi]

Vander Borght, #2 Seed, Riviera, Hole #4, 236 yards

From Ian Andrew's Blog: One of my favorite long par threes is the 4th at Riviera. The hole was conceived as a redan with players facing the option of flying the ball over the massive front bunker or hitting a ??draw to use the natural contour of the ?fairway right of the bunker and green to feed the ball down onto the putting surface. Thomas created a daunting carry with the placement of the front bunker, but gave such an open and inviting ?alternative by adding fairway right of the bunker for the player to use the natural slopes to funnel the ball around the bunker. The only unfortunate thing about Riviera is the infestation of the Kikuya grass really has ruined the viability of this clever approach.

[Richard Choi]

Mucci Division, #2 Seed, Yeamans Hall, Hole #6, 190 yards

A classically manufactured Redan hole.One could sit on the tee all day trying to get the draw just right. The Club wisely allowed Jim Urbina to extend the tee box back anothertwelve yardsin 2003 toallow the better player tokeep a mid to low iron in his hand.The ground game aspects of a Redan green complex do not function as well if the player is hitting in too short (i.e. too high) a club.

[Richard Choi]

Huntley Division, #2 Seed, The Country Club in Pepper Pike, Hole #14, 215 yards

As seen at many of his best designs, Flynn was a true admirer of the playing characteristics of the Redan hole and here is The Country Club’s version. A draw at the tree that has shed most its leaves is the perfect play as the tee ball will hit and trickle down the right to left slope toward the day's hole location. Note the grassing schemes by Mabie that are starting to lend The Country Club great texture.

[Richard Choi]

TEPaul Division, #8 Seed, Old Macdonald, Hole #12, 237 yards

"From Tim Bert: The Redan at Old Macdonald is like no other that I have played.  I thought I had the basic concept of a Redan down.  Then I came across this one.   I also talked to Jim Urbina in Bandon about the original, and I realized just how different some of the holes that I have played are from the original template.  Some share similar characteristics, but most are very different in style.

Many of the ""Redans"" I have played have very clear spots to miss right of the green that could be advantageous to a shot striking the green.  When I think of a Redan, I think use the kick plate on the right.  At Old Macdonald, you won't be receiving any helpful kicks if you miss the green to the right!

The green is very long from front to back on a bit of a diagonal from the tee.  It is severely pitched with everything running left.  In a moderate to heavy wind, I would expect that this would be one of the most difficult greens in regulation on the course despite the fact that, unlike #10, everyone gets a sure fire shot at the approach since this is a par 3. "

[Richard Choi]

TEPaul Division, #9 Seed, Camargo, Hole #15, 190 yards

The last of the excellent one shotters, this Redan features a neat twist in that the green has a spine that runs through it.

[Richard Choi]

Huntley Division, #3 Seed, LACC, Hole #11, 245 yards

The architectural merits of the hole equal the one-of-a-kindview and it’s a mystery where Thomas/Bellgathered all thefill for creating this push-up green, which iswell elevated from its surrounds. Puttingis difficultto gauge – is the putt downhill or uphill? A sad three putt has been the end for many a golfer on this green.

[Richard Choi]

Mucci Division, #3 Seed, Shoreacres, Hole #14, 185 yards

A completely manufactured Redan hole, and none the worse for it. Raynor pushed up a tenfoot high ridge and the pitch on its shoulder is as steep as any of his Redans. On the left side are two deep bunkers which in this case may be saviors for the teeball tugged a little left: the same bloody ravine (!) is only a few paces from the edge of these bunkers. The green itself is the only safe haven as it is reasonably flat.

[Richard Choi]

Vander Borght, #3 Seed, Yale, Hole #13, 210 yards

Though a striking Redan with postcard qualities, its playing characteristics are somewhat diminishedbecause the hole is both downhill and Yale struggles to present firm and fast playing at this sheltered green. Thus, the needed release of a tee ball from right to left across the green that makes any Redan hole great is often times found wanting here. If anything, on a downhill Redan, the green slopes need to be more pronounced than usual given the steep descent of the tee ball. Here, the slope and right kick boardaretoo muted. Given the boldness of the Redan green at the eighth, the author would not be surprised to learn that this green has been softened/tinkered with over the years.

[Richard Choi]

Vander Borght, #4 Seed, Mid Ocean Club, Hole #17, 205 yards

For many traditionalists, the decade of the 1920s represents the pinnacle in golf course architecture. Coming as it did so early in the decade, there still wasn’t a lot of precedence in North America from which an architect could draw upon for inspiration. For instance, at the seventeenth, would a lesser architect than Macdonald have seized upon the right to left slope of the land as the perfect invitation to build a Redan while at the same time gracefully transporting the golfer to the cliff for a rousing Home hole? Perhaps not and fortunately the point is a moot one. A majority of Macdonald/Raynor designs feature the Redan hole in the first nine. Coming as the penultimate hole, this one falls at the latest stage in the round of the approximately twenty Redans that they built. Frequently played against the breeze, a hooded long iron or wood that just carries the short bunkers, takes the slope and runs onto the green is one of immense satisfaction. Its outstanding playing characteristics coupled with the hole’s setting “ an elevated tee with sweeping uninterrupted views of the cobalt ocean “ help make this one of the very finest Redans in the Macdonald/Raynor family.

[Richard Choi]

Mucci Division, #4 Seed, Swinley, Hole #4, 185 yards

One of the finest inland(or otherwise) one shotters in the British Isles, this Redan green is set on a natural shelf. A savage front left bunker gathers indifferent shots with swift certainty. The distance is difficult to gauge, as the golfer is sheltered from the wind by the green and frequently underestimates just how much uphill the shot really is., the proper club may be two more than the golfer first suspects. The green has a false front and is swift from back to front.

[Richard Choi]

Huntley Division, #4 Seed, Hidden Creek, Hole #4, 222 yards

A breathtaking hole, with immediate comparisons belonging with the all-world Long Redan fourth at Riviera and the Long Reverse Redan eleventh on The North Course at Los Angeles Country Club.The design team opted to clear a large area of trees well behind the green to help give the hole the same sense of drama and scale as one experiences when standing on the tenth tee of The Old Course at Sunningdale. Similarly, they also cleared a large area behind the sixth and twelfth greens, which, in addition to giving those holes an expansive feel, also provides for improved air flow and sunlight for the greens.

[Richard Choi]

TEPaul Division, #4 Seed, Lawsonia, Hole #4, 203 yards

A  fine hole, one of two long par 3’s intended to test one long iron and fairway wood play.  The holes plays 1-2 clubs uphill to another large oval green whose surface is blind from the tee.  With a large bunker at the base of the green giving the hole the look of a Redan, the hole does not posses the right to left angle and cant of the green required of a Redan.  It may look like a Redan, but if it doesn’t play like a Redan, IMHO it is not a Redan.  Redan or not, it is a great hole, one of the strongest and most unique on the course.

[Richard Choi]

TEPaul Division, #5 Seed, Shinnecock Hills, Hole #7, 1

The Redan seventh at Shinnecock is overshadowed by the fourth hole at nearby National Golf Links of America. The reasons? The right to left pitch of this green is more severe and when coupled with its smaller putting surface, there are both fewer ways to play the hole as well as fewer interesting hole locations. Nonetheless, this holeremains an exceptional Redan in its own right. Built by Macdonald/Raynor in 1916, this was the only hole that Toomey & Flynn retained during their re-design.

[Richard Choi]

Huntley Division, #5 Seed, Westhampton, Hole #7, 200 yards

While it is generally acknowledged that National Golf Links of America and Piping Rock possess the finest Redan holes, what other courses possess a Redan as good or better than the original at North Berwick? Well, this one is one of the few. Uniquely, theleft hand side of the green slopes away from the frontbunker and a fade can work wellfor certain hole locations.

[Richard Choi]

Mucci Division, #5 Seed, Inniscrone, Hole #8, 238 yards

[Richard Choi]

Vander Borght, #5 Seed, Hackensack, Hole #12, 184 yards

[Richard Choi]

Vander Borght, #6 Seed, Pacific Dunes, Hole #17, 208 yards

From Time Bert - The 4th and final par 3 on the back nine rounds out one of the finest sets of par 3s I've played.  The summer wind is usually coming against you from the left side.  It has played as both primarily a cross wind and a head wind on different days.  I've played just about everything from a 3-wood to a 7-iron on this hole, depending upon wind and where they've got the green tee on any given day.  The surrounding area from the tee is something to behold.  Much of the natural beauty comes from the gorse-filled dune behind the green that drifts into more of a natural looking sand dune further left in the distance.  (Side note: Is that dune being used as part of OMD and if so, will it retain its natural appeal or is it being shaped into something else?)

A ball struck to the right of the green really wants to feed onto the green, though depending upon the strength of the wind this can be hard to properly accomplish.  Ideally for all but the most extreme left pin positions I think one would want to aim at the right-center or right portion of the green, allow the summer wind to take it slightly more to the right, and then have the bank run the ball back to the putting surface.  The bunkers guarding the front of the green can be difficult, and in the strongest winds many of the gorse patches short, right, or long can come into play.  We've lost more than one ball off to the right side where there are some mowed down strips between rows of gorse.

The 5th, 10th, 11th, and 14th all have a lot of appeal to me, so it is hard to rank this hole individually ahead of any of the par 3s that have preceeded it, yet it is also difficult for me to believe this is the worst par 3 on the course.  I'll simply refrain from ranking them, but I'm interested to hear others thoughts on the order of preference.

[Richard Choi]

Mucci Division, #6 Seed, Blue Mound, Hole #13, 185 yards

All pretenders to Redans across the country ought to make a pilgrimage to Blue Mound to see the real thing. It’s all here – the kick-bank right, the angled green tilted sharply away from the golfer, the deep and penal bunker guarding the entrance left. Although I didn’t get a picture of it, an enormous bunker – the largest on the course – sits at the backside, and well below, the kicker ramp and green.

[Richard Choi]

TEPaul Division, #24 Seed, Fox Chapel, Hole #6, 192 yards

I suggest it has the most sloped Redan green of them all; if you are above the hole, enjoy the slide from left to right!!

[Richard Choi]

TEPaul Division, #25 Seed, Old White, Hole #8, 217 yards