drop shot par three

[corey miller]

On an other thread Crystal Springs in New jersey is being discussed.  Matt W. likes the par three 10th.  I do not care for it though i only played the course twice about six years ago.  The hole is 185 yards off a 80 ft limestone cliff to a figure-eight green surrounded by rock and water.  

I would guess other than actually hitting balls there is  no way of knowing what club to hit because of the severity of the drop.  Granted if the hole was only 100 yds it would be easy but at 185 how much shorter does the hole play?
  
I do not recall any other par three I have played where one has no clue as to  playing distance.  Is this acceptable?  Does it fall into the "only blind once" category?

[Matt_Ward]

Corey:

The 10th at Crystal Springs is a marvleous hole -- and I am not one to say that automatically because I find that too many designers have opted to provide the downhill par-3 with all the obligatory bells'n whistle features. It's become the calling card of design for too many architects today.

The hole from tip tees play about 186 yards (latest scorecard) and clearly there are different green sections since the putting surface wraps itself so nicely around a natural water-filled quarry. As a strong player I usually hit no more than a short iron (9-iron to rear placements and PW or SW to front ones).

I've played the hole numerous times in a variety of winds. Most times managment tries to keep the pin in the front third section in order to give players a shorter hole and much easier target to reach. In this position the hole is probably no more than 150 yards from the tips.

When the hole is placed deep in the back or if you prefer more challenge when the pin is extreme left and in the "tongue" area you had better be really precise. I rarely see the hole in this location because of "speed of play" considerations. Club selection can vary from 2-3 clubs -- again depending upon wind and pin location. The hole does give you maximum elasticity. The thing is you must keep players moving otherwise you'd have players hitting balls like they were at the driving range.

David Glenz, the Director of Golf at the facility, has told me he has hit as much as 4 or 5-iron because of extreme wind. However, keep in mind wind conditions in Northern New Jersey are never as severe as eastern Long Island or the Great Plains.
 
Corey, you mention blind holes. The reality is that once you have played the hole you begin to "feel" what is needed. Of course, wind on par-3's is always guesswork (see Augusta's 12th or TPC / Sawgrass 17th, as just two examples).

But the 10th is really a test of short iron control in most climate situations and I believe von Hagge did a marvelous job incorporating a hole in such a dynamic setting. In my mind, the hole fits well and is one of the state's best public par-3's.

If you want to see a much more difficult hole with the same motif (but not downhill) -- i.e. water-filled quarry in front of green, try the new Wild Turkey and it's "do or die" 7th hole -- 208 yards from the tips and featuring a green that has a wasitline thinner than Britney Spears. The intimidation factor on this hole rackets up the notch considerably.

I like both holes and believe the "effective playing yardage" on the 10th at Crystal Springs requires some adjustment no less than other downhill par-3's. But, the main reason why I like the hole is that it "fits" the surroundings and is not "forced" to provide a pro forma downhill hole that you often see on too many daily fee courses today.

Hope this helps ...

[TEPaul]

Is it acceptable to have to calculate what club to use to a severely downhill par 3? You're being facetious, right? Is it acceptable to have to calculate what club and shot to hit into a quartering 30mph wind?

Actually you really don't even have to no the downhill hole all that well or even at all to get a feel for the club selection--there is a bit of a seat-of-the pants formula for it anyway.

I love really dramatic downhill par 3--most are very memorable.

Merion's West's tiny #6
Reading's #15
Wyoming Valley's #4 (?)
Lehigh's #7
Inniscrone's #5
Pine Valley #14
And hundreds of other good ones..

There's something else about them we should all be aware of. In a routing context they can really solve some problems for the seamlessness of a course, particularly the holes around them because in almost no case are they created they just solve a topographical obstacle that might not be overcome any other way!

[JBergan]

Wyoming Valley's drop shot is #7.  I heard that a woman once had two holes in one in the same week on the hole.

[Mike_Cirba]

Matt,

Although I don't have much aversion to drop-shot par threes, I really don't care for the one at Crystal Springs for a number of reasons.  

First of all, the green is actually two greens; separated by a narrow neck of green that backdrops to a sheer rock cliff.  It is very possible to just overshoot the green by a bit, and have the shot deflect off the rock face back into the water hazard.  

If you happen to end up on the wrong green, you face that ultimate predicament of needing to play a pitch or chip shot despite the fact that you are actually ON the green!  

I'm all for demanding holes, but could you tell me how the average golfer should play this one?  

[Matt_Ward]

MikeC:

My good man -- when you have a short iron in your hand how much landing area do you need? The square footage of the green I believe is over 6,000 square feet! I mean the hole features an 80 foot drop from just 185 yards from the absolute tips! Mike, if you overshoot or undershoot by that much it's time for any player to go to the range and freshen up the game. FYI -- if a player is at Crystal Springs they should make an appointment to see one of the nation's premier teachers in David Glenz.

Keep in mind, the notion of chipping over an obstacle is OK for such holes as the 6th at Riviera. Why should there be an issue with the 10th at Crystal Springs?

Mike, just realize that management usually keeps the pin in the easy-to-reach front third. The only time the pin is placed in the extreme rear or left positions is when an event of substance is contested.

I still think the hole is grand -- precision with the short iron is a fine way in testing your nerve and control. I've played many a short hole that demanded nothing less than pinpoint accuracy -- in my mind that's fair game in determining how good a golfer you are. If the hole was extremely long then a better case can be made -- not when most players are hitting 7-iron or less.

Hope this helps ...

[John_D._Bernhardt]

The Bluffs has a 40 foot drop hole being the 200 yard 17th. this is some of Palmers best work. I am not sure I understand why people like these holes so much. I like a 10 to 20 foot drop, but long drops just seem ok after a few trys at it. spyglass has two par 3's on the back nine the first of which is almost to much down.