Golf Course Architecture and Music

[Sven Nilsen]

Kingsley - a little bit dirty but a whole lot of fun:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DvkPSwwVVQ

[Jud_T]

Tim,

Glad you're coming around from the dark side! Lose King of Limbs from your ipod rotation and get deep into Kid A and Amnesiac, from when they were really pushing the envelope but before they jumped the shark...

[Carson Pilcher]

Kingsley - a little bit dirty but a whole lot of fun:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DvkPSwwVVQ

Fantastic Pigpen-style rap in there!

I tend to play my best golf and "see" the course when I hum a tune in my head.  Sometimes when I hit a shot a little chunky, I have to start saying to myself, "Fly Baby Fly" to the tune of the Beatles' "Cry Baby Cry".

[Jud_T]

Carson,

My go to song to slow down the tempo yet have some rhythm is "Althea"...

[Tim Bert]

Jud - the entire collection is on my iPod and I have gone pretty deep on them all in the past year. I can appreciate Kid A though it isn't my favorite. It is a 50-50 split of really good and not so good.   Fans of Amnesiac make me chuckle.  "Pushing the envelope" amounts to a bunch of b-side quality tracks. I can't latch on to more than a few songs on that one despite numerous listens and plenty of patience. I'll let you keep that one. Easily the worst of their 8 full length albums, even when Pablo Honey is included.

As for King of Limbs, it is anything but mainstream or jumping the shark. Very difficult to listen to. It very rewarding. It has probably worked its way up to 3rd in my list of their albums and I didn't give it much of a shot from the beginning. The From the Basement recording of King of Limbs is super.  I understand how a fan boy that was attracted by them no longer playing guitars and mumbling things like "I woke up sucking on a lemon" might not appreciate it but it doesn't make that fan boy right!

The cool  thing about Radiohead is that it is pretty easy to find fans from all walks come to the defense of them but in many different ways. Great band and I hear they out on a great show.

[John Shimp]

Tim,
Just saw this thread. I am a huge radiohead fan and just saw them in atlanta.   You are lucky that you still dont like amnesiac.  Songs like pyramid song, knives out, and you and whose army will sink in first then you will like pakt liked sardines, morning bell and i might be wrong, etc.  You have a lot of stuff to look fwd to.  Hail to thief is my favorite right now but that moves around.  Btw, they ended the atalanta show with street spirit off the bends.  His voice is still totally up to signing those high clear bends songs beautifully. 

[John Shimp]

Tim,
Just saw this thread. I am a huge radiohead fan and just saw them in atlanta.   You are lucky that you still dont like amnesiac.  Songs like pyramid song, knives out, and you and whose army will sink in first then you will like pakt liked sardines, morning bell and i might be wrong, etc.  You have a lot of stuff to look fwd to.  Hail to thief is my favorite right now but that moves around.  Btw, they ended the atalanta show with street spirit off the bends.  His voice is still totally up to signing those high clear bends songs beautifully. 

[Carson Pilcher]

Carson,

My go to song to slow down the tempo yet have some rhythm is "Althea"...

Very nice Jud.  I'll have to try that today.

Years ago when I would get on the "bogey train", I would starting singing, "Stop that train, I'm leaving".  Low and behold, I'd leave it behind.

[Jud_T]

Tim,

I was seeing these guys in theaters while you were still wanking off to Tool!  If they only had a drummer who actually swung.  Yes I'm a guitar player and it's a bit annoying to watch Jonny stand around playing a thumb piano for an hour and a half with a vintage Telecaster collecting dust on a stand nearby.  As for jumping the shark, that happened for me at the Auditorium Theater in Chicago when the Black Keys opened up for Radiohead and proceeded to blow them off the stage (the difference in the two drummers from a musician's point of view was ridiculous).  Now the Black Keys have jumped the shark as well, so you're only two generations too late this time...  pick this up:

http://www.amazon.com/Jonny-Greenwood-Is-Controller/dp/B000MTPA9A/ref=sr_1_3?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1331475910&sr=1-3

[Tim Bert]

Jud - you seeing Radiohead in boutique theaters before i liked them doesn't make Amnesiac not suck. 

By the way, I saw TOOL in the Auditorium Theater so now we have something in common. Nice venue.

[Bill Seitz]

You could make one really good album from Kid A and Amnesiac, but there are a lot of songs on both albums that make me reach for the skip button. OK Computer, however, is still one of the three best albums I've ever heard.

[John_Cullum]

For the most part, all music annoys the shit out of me

[Tim Bert]

You could make one really good album from Kid A and Amnesiac, but there are a lot of songs on both albums that make me reach for the skip button. OK Computer, however, is still one of the three best albums I've ever heard.

Thank you for a rationale voice in the matter. Jud is a bit extreme in his opinion.

[Jud_T]

I actually agree with Bill on this.  With the exception of OK Computer, these guys essentially have one hell of a double greatest hits album in 'em.

[John Shimp]

You guys that are song picking their albums dont get  Radiohead that well.  Amnesiac is a tight record and not a bunch of B sides as Tim put it. 
Good bands like radiohead make 45 min long sound experiences that are sometimes not all set to be singles.  Tossing out fitter/happier off ok computer is easy to do but not in the spirit of what they put together.  Its fine if thats who you are; you know an oreo filling eater type...   

The Old Course isnt all holes 11-13 or whatever you think the best stuff is.  But no one would go and start tossing out holes 9 and 10 or skipping them during their round.  You just play them patiently and wait for 11.  They have their roles in the overall course and enhance ones enjoyment of the real great holes.   

Tim when you see them live ask yourself why they choose to play the gloaming or myxamatosis instead of straight karma police or other fan faves.  I dont think its  to make the crowd suffer.

[Tim Bert]

John - I find your first statement to be quite arrogant and presumptive unless you have a personal relationship with the guys in the band. Because someone has a different opinion of a particular album or sequence of songs doesn't mean the person doesn't "get" the band.  It means they have a different opinion. So let's toss the comment aside and from here we can have a productive discussion.

I enjoy listening to albums in their entirety (when worthwhile) and also enjoy picking and choosing songs Iike. If it is so important to listen to an album in its entirety every time then ask yourself the same question about why Radiohead mixes is it up at every show. Why didn't they just make me sit through King of Limbs in its entirety and in sequence last night?  Because music isn't always meant to be listened to in the rigid structure of an album.  It is also a collection of songs. A good one flows as a unit as well as a collection of individual pieces.

The great thing about Radiohead, and to answer your question about Gloaming and Myxamatosis, is they can play almost any of their songs live and sound great doing it. They are a great live band, as I already knew but witnessed in person last night.

They bring a wonderful live musicianship to their songs and they take the filler junk from the albums and still turn it into an incredibly engaging live experience. The worst and least energetic song they performed last night was Paranoid Android.   Pyramid Song and Everything in its Right Place were delivered beautifully, but it doesn't leave me preferring those songs to Android on the album experience. It gave new new appreciation for the possibilities of those songs for sure.

Other than Creep I haven't seen any evidence that they shun their popular songs on tour. Karma Police has been played at half the shows this year. Android has been played more than that. Gloaming gets played but not any more than the others. They appear to enjoy mixing it up, which makes it fun, surprising, and enjoyable.  This tour if you look at the distribution has been very heavily skewed toward material released post King of Limbs, stuff from King of Limbs, and In Rainbows.

I think they played 22 songs last night and a quick but not perfectly accurate estimate would be:

post KOL - 3
King of Limbs - 6
In Rainbows - 5
Hail to the Thief - 2
Amnesiac - 1
Kid A - 3
Ok Computer - 2

It was a great show and a perfect mix (with the exception of Exit Music, which is my personal favorite, being neglected)

[Jud_T]

Idioteque?

[Tim Bert]

Everything in its right place
How to disappear completely (2012 tour debut and performed to perfection)
Idioteque

[Jay Flemma]

Shouldn't this thread be called "GCA and Radiohead?"

Question:  Can those of us who hate Radiohead leave now?

Answer:  No, you have to stay even longer

I'm actually gonna do an article later this year comparing bands and courses, but again exploring their social impact and position in the collective cultural zeitgeist, similar to what I did with the Traverse Rock City/Exile on Fisher's Island article from last year.

And for all you Deadheads out there, Jack Straw from Wichita cut his buddy down...

[John Shimp]

Tim,
Appreciate your recent post in reply to mine.  Didn't mean to be arrogant but there needs to be some taking the "out there" or different with the easy to like with Radiohead and bands like them (pixies, sparklehorse, beck, etc).  (I do think there is some of that needed to like some of the quirkier and more interesting golf courses out there too.) 

Your post #29 if you re-read it which is mostly what I was reacting to is pretty arrogant also in that you are quite smug in "chuckling" at those that like Amnesiac and all of the fan boy comments re the silly words in Everything in its right place off Kid A (still a really good song despite the lyrics or lack there of....).  I'm sure you know this and obvioiusly don't have to agree but a lot of big RH fans think that KidA/Amnesiac are there very best stuff. 

Anyway, no big deal.  Really glad you liked the show.  The heavy electronic/percussion stuff they are doing now is cool live and fits back well to playing a song like There There live with more drums, etc.

[Tim Bert]

John - I re-read my post and I can understand how you reacted the way you did. My apologies. To put my remarks in perspective I was in the midst of a trash talking exchange with Jud, whom I have met and with whom I have shared enjoyable rounds of golf. We have also had many good debates on music, so when I said things like chuckling at people for musical tastes I was really talking about Jud!

Jay - the original intent of this thread was to focus on the architecture and the questions I teed up. It ended up being more about music and most recently Radiohead. Radiohead inspire the original post.  Feel free to get back to the original thoughts and questions.

[Jay Flemma]

Tim, like I said, I'm doing an article on this a little later down the road, but I need time to think about it and work on it, but great thread!  In the meantime, you guys are having as much fun as Kyle and I did on the Genesis discussion from last year

Kyle (essentially) :  I'm glad we agree that New Genesis is as good as and more progressive than Old Genesis.

Jay (essentially) : No, we do not agree to any such thing!

Comedy!

[Michael Wharton-Palmer]

Miles Davis' classic album...Kind of Blue and Merion.....the two smoothly flow through different moods...invoke thoughts of timelessness and also innovation, maximising the time and effort that you are taking to listen/play.

Rumours by Fleetwood Mac and Cypress Point but playing side two of the album first...each song is distinctly briiliant from the start, not in your face dazzling but a very high level of qulaity staright from the begining.
Then as you reach side two the quality steps up a notch..remember now we are on Side One of Rumours...each hole becoming a potential all time classic...and at the end you feel as though you have truly exerienced something wonderful.

Kingsley Club and Trombone Shorty's Backatown......A modern classic based upon the previous works of the Masters but with a modern twist that leaves you bedazzled with the sheer boldness and brilliance of the artist.
The knowledge that what one is experiencing is going to become a classic of the future, something people will turn back to and point as  being the begining of two briiliant carreers that gave us so much joy.
Destined to become the Kind of Blue and Merion of it's time.

[Jud_T]

By the way, Albums (and CD's for that matter) have gone the way of the buggy whip...  Longer compositions need to be segued in a single track for anyone under the age of 30 to ever hear a sequence of songs as originally intended.

[Kalen Braley]

Give me Coldplay to get the juices flowing anytime.....

If I was operating a dozer looking for inspiration to get it done, thats what I'd want!