Trump in Scotland

[archie_struthers]

 

Sean , environmental and personal issues aside, I'm not getting the complaints strictly related to the architecture only.   We all know that all things  politic tend to smell,

[Jud_T]

Aside from my personal revulsion to all things Trump, I just don't understand the business model. 1) Seems quite pricey for the locals and 2) IMO most Yanks go to GB&I to play the classic links.  Unless the course is considered off-the-charts good by folks more respected than the Donald his ownself, nobody I know would include the course on their itinerary.  Only top shelf places like a Castle Stuart would persuade me to skip an old-school links experience on such a trip.  There are simply too many good modern options available on this side of the pond that don't involve jet-lag and an onerous exchange rate.  Furthermore, who are they selling property to?  Again if I were looking to buy property there I'd be in the market for something in town with a bit more history and better hair.

[Ally Mcintosh]

Unless the course is considered off-the-charts good by folks more respected than the Donald his ownself, nobody I know would include the course on their itinerary.  Only top shelf places like a Castle Stuart would persuade me to skip an old-school links experience on such a trip.  

This is an interesting comment Jud...

Frankly, I'll be a little disappointed if the course isn't considered in the same bracket (quality wise) as Castle Stuart... The site they had to work with at Balmedie was multiple times better for a start....

Ally

[Sean_A]

Sean , environmental and personal issues aside, I'm not getting the complaints strictly related to the architecture only.   We all know that all things  politic tend to smell,

Archie

I am not sure I have heard any complaints about the design - the course isn't built yet!  At this point, folks are either for or against the concept of the development.  I have always had my doubts about the economic impact of a resort complex, but billion pound figures (so far as I know never backed up by any independent expert) have been bandied about and everybody seems impressed.  So far as the course is concerned, I would be amazed if it doesn't go straight into top 50 GB&I or even higher.  I think it has every chance to be wonderful IF the difficulty factor can be kept in check. 

Ciao

[Mark Pearce]

One unexpected bonus of all of this is that my home club has been fortunate enough to hire Paul O'Connor as course manager, following his "falling out" with The Donald.

[Melvyn Morrow]

Ally

It is a great site and has the ability to prove itself a first class course, yet I am in wonder as to how many fake attachments we are going to be presented with i.e. half rotten sleepers etc. to try and present the age and maturity of a brand new golf course. It’s new, so what as long as it plays and returns value for money it may well be a success, just be proud of its newness as we all know age very quickly creeps up upon all things.

Green fees, in this country are the key, hence why I believe the Links Trust got it way wrong with the Castle Course (forgetting for the moment the rights/wrongs of its location) when it opened trying to charge the equivalent of TOC. The courses was not even proven and yet the Fees where just bloody stupid, they should have started low to average for that area, not gone in at £140 I believe which gave it far more cred, well above its ability to repay (in golfing terms).

Stick to honest Scottish design and they may well make it. try to produce an international course and it will be ignored by many, leaving it to the overseas visitors to make it pay, which will no doubt be reflected in their Green Fees.

Who knows, but I am not holding my breath, as it has the beginnings of being a true White Elephant or a Palace of what is wrong with the modern game of golf and GCA.

Melvyn

[archie_struthers]

 

Sean , see page 1 and 2 of this very thread . No worries, just looking for consistency as is Jud I suppose.

[Brian_Ewen]

It is a great site and has the ability to prove itself a first class course

Melvyn, when did you see the site ?

[Brian_Ewen]

I am not sure I have heard any complaints about the design - the course isn't built yet!

I flew over it last week, and the course is complete.

Strangely its not as bright green as it was when the Walker Cup was on !

[Melvyn Morrow]

Brian

That’s an easy one, about 5-6 years ago I was searching for Old Tom’s course near Collieston Aberdeenshire, apart from the villages name I had Tullock’s reference from page 287 from his book on Old Tom. He describes Collieston being ‘hard by the famous sands of Townie’. Never heard of Townie in that location although was aware of Forvie.



So searching the area the only famous sands I came across was Forvie Sands near to the site of Trumps potential elephant. In my search I did find the site of Collieston Golf course closed circa 1939/40. This being a sister course to Askernisk, owned by the same people with the same intention of using it for golf as wells a fishing and shooting breaks.

If I remember there is a large bird sanctuary in the area of Forvie Sands.

Melvyn

[Niall C]

Aside from my personal revulsion to all things Trump, I just don't understand the business model. 1) Seems quite pricey for the locals and 2) IMO most Yanks go to GB&I to play the classic links.  Unless the course is considered off-the-charts good by folks more respected than the Donald his ownself, nobody I know would include the course on their itinerary.  Only top shelf places like a Castle Stuart would persuade me to skip an old-school links experience on such a trip.  There are simply too many good modern options available on this side of the pond that don't involve jet-lag and an onerous exchange rate.  Furthermore, who are they selling property to?  Again if I were looking to buy property there I'd be in the market for something in town with a bit more history and better hair.

Jud

The business model is quite simple, build lumping great big hotel in oil rich city short of hotel bed spaces, build 500 executive homes in in one of the few places bucking the housing trend in the UK. Very hard to go wrong with that, the golf component is incidental other than helping getting the planning for the rest of the development.

Niall

[Niall C]

I cannot really tell if the course is worth playing from just two holes. Yes, the tall dunes look interesting but no course final ranking is determined by the background.

Scott

Have you never played Turnberry ? Personally I quite like Turnberry buit its position at the very top of the rankings has a great deal to do with the aesthetics as most critics and raters freely admit. If it was ringed with 50 ft high dunes between the course and the water, I doubt it would be top 50 let alone top 10.

Niall

[David_Tepper]

The Donald is already campaigning to host the Scottish Open:

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2011/10/04/uk-golf-european-scottish-idUKTRE7930MS20111004?rpc=401&feedType=RSS&feedName=sportsNews&rpc=401

[Anthony Gray]

Aside from my personal revulsion to all things Trump, I just don't understand the business model. 1) Seems quite pricey for the locals and 2) IMO most Yanks go to GB&I to play the classic links.  Unless the course is considered off-the-charts good by folks more respected than the Donald his ownself, nobody I know would include the course on their itinerary.  Only top shelf places like a Castle Stuart would persuade me to skip an old-school links experience on such a trip.  There are simply too many good modern options available on this side of the pond that don't involve jet-lag and an onerous exchange rate.  Furthermore, who are they selling property to?  Again if I were looking to buy property there I'd be in the market for something in town with a bit more history and better hair.

Jud

The business model is quite simple, build lumping great big hotel in oil rich city short of hotel bed spaces, build 500 executive homes in in one of the few places bucking the housing trend in the UK. Very hard to go wrong with that, the golf component is incidental other than helping getting the planning for the rest of the development.

Niall

  Is it truly not about the golf? Maybe its the real estate that will insure the success of the golf. A golf course alone may have uncertainty like Castle Stuart. I think Trump is golf crazy.

  Anthony