Most difficult par fours you have played and why

[Sean Leary]

Of courses I have played a lot, 9 at Prairie Dunes. 8 is more famously difficult, but somehow 9 just kills me. I cannot get the tee ball in play, and the times that I do, the second shot with the wind quartering into me from the right just kills me. I have 50+ plays and no birdies and maybe 3 or 4 pars as a 3-5 handicap. And countless x's.

[Deucie Bies]

1st at Oakmont. Just incredibly difficult. OB right, ditches left, dead straightaway hole (which I find visually makes a hole look narrower), and then the slope down to the green, and on the green itself, just makes it nigh on impossible.

I agree with Tom, getting on the green only starts the adventure.  It can get you off to a really bad start in a hurry.

[Bob_Huntley]

Most difficult par fours you have played and why?

How about the 16th at Carnoustie in the wind?

Bob

[Jim Adkisson]

The corral hole, 15th at Bethpage, is a brute. Not that hard to hit the fairway but everything after that was brutal.

Agreed...and tougher still if you don't hit the fairway...was glad to hole out for 7!  I hear that the green has been mellowed/leveled a bit...that might have kept me down to a double.

[Tim Gavrich]

Ket me nominate the 12th hole at Lexington G&CC in Lexington, VA.  At only 434 yards from the tips, it may not  seem possible that it's a damned difficult hole.  But because the hole is a near-90 degree dogleg right, in order to have less than 200 yards the player must blast a tee shot over a corner of a forest to a very shallow, sharply pitched left-to-right fairway.  Then, you'll probably have, at best, a mid-iron into a green that is abut 15 yards deep and whose left edge must be five feet above the right edge (the green's about 25 yards wide).  There are scant few places to put a hole on that green if the green is any faster than "very slow."  There's a bunker front-left and a deep grass hollow short-right.  If your ball lands right of the green, it will probably careen out-of-bounds.  The only place to miss is short of the green, and from there an up-and-down is still very difficult.  I've probably played the hole about 100 times and I've made four birdies.

[ward peyronnin]

Whitty I would play it again in a heartbeat. I think Anders would be glad to help sort out a future Buda there someday.

[Kris Shreiner]

Foxy @ RD for me as well. Only hole I've never made par on at the course! Probably have 30 rounds in there and the bastard gets me every time! Funny, when I played with two chums, both solid, low handicaps, and told them how tough it was... they both made par and I settled for my umteenth bogey. The tee shot is awkward, but not to penal and there are numerous options to find the putting surface. The hole is just a @%*#!? for me. That said, I love it.

The road hole at The Old rates as well...no explanation needed.

#16 at Spyglass...in the old days, with overhanging Monterey Pines guarding the left approach of the green(with bunkers ta boot) was an absolute bear to par with a back left pin. Hell it was a stout par for any pin location.

[Steve Kline]

I can't argue with the choices that have been listed so far, especially Oakmont#1, Dornoch #14, Carnoustie #18, and TOC #17. However, I  have played each of those holes only 2-5 times.

Thinking of holes I have played a lot, none are as tough on me as #5 at Pinehurst #2. I usually play to make a 5, and even that is pretty tough. I know that most here have played it. For starters, it is very long and it requires 4 very good shots, or at least one outstanding shot.
For the average guy, it takes two excellent shots just to reach the green in two. Even then it is very difficult to keep the ball on the green. Any shot landing or running up on the left side of the green will probably turn hard left and wind up in the left front bunker. Or maybe it runs long and over the back left down a steep slope. The only safe miss is long right from where you have a decent chance of getting up and in. The short hitter who leaves a wedge for the third shot will find that the green is even hard to hit with a wedge. BTW, the green is very difficult to read and 3-putts are very common.

Most long hitters have similar problems. During the past two Opens, most pros found the green hard to hit from a hanging, side-hill lie and there were very few birdies made. The previous hole is a par 5. If you put a gun to my head and told me I had to make a 4 and could choose which hole to play, I would choose the par 5 where I have probably made more 4's.

Jim Lewis

Great description of #5 at #2. That is the hole I was going to nominate. I've played that hole several hundred times and have made one birdie (and I've always been below sratch). In those few hundred times I might be able to coun on two  hands how many times I've hit the green in regulation. The problem is it is a lie with the ball fairly far above your feet but left is just dead. However, you can't aim way right because there are bunkers and that leaves the green running away from you on your third shot. Inevitably if I play for a big draw and aim just right of the green I hit the ball straight into the bunkers but if I aim more towards the middle I hit a big hook  to the left and I'm dead. The green has way more slope in it than people see and they 3 putt a lot. I agree making a 4 on the previous par 5 is easier. And after you screw up on #5 you get the sixth which is a long, difficult par 3.

[Steve Salmen]

This story was told to me last summer by the member in question, we'll call him Mr. C:

In a competition at Dornoch, he played 13 and 14 in 1-3.  After the round he told of his accomplishment.  The initial response  he got was, "how the hell did you make 3 on Foxy?"

[Matt OBrien]

#10 at Shinnecock with a real strong tailwind because there's just nowhere to chip or pitch to for you 3rd, 4th, 5th or 6th shots...then you pick up and curse your way over to #11.

And 11 is not much easier!!!!

[Anthony Gray]

Most difficult par fours you have played and why?

How about the 16th at Carnoustie in the wind?

Bob

  Story goes that Nicklaus was the only player to get his ball past the pin in four days.

  Anthony

[Scott Szabo]

I'll throw a few out from Ballyneal - #6, 10, 13 and 17.  All are close to 500 yards and depending on the day's wind may be unreachable in two.  Even on a calm day a par is hard earned.

[jim_lewis]

Steve:

I have a reliable eyewitness report that Marty McKenzie, who was a very fine local player (still is), once birdied #5 twice in one day. That's got to be one of the most remarkable golf achievements I've ever heard of.

I have always felt that one reason #6 is so tough for me is that I am always pissed off at how I just screwed up #5.

[Dan Boerger]

I define a "most difficult" par four as a hole where I have a great drive and am still left with a very difficult approach shot. A hole that comes to mind in the 7th at St. Davids golf club in Wayne, PA. A perfect drive (for me) leaves me with an uphill long iron shot to a blind and very sloped green. Miss left and you're OB, and if you are above the hole a bogey is a fine score.

[Jim Tang]

My vote goes to Royal County Down's 2nd, measuring 444 yards from the back tee.

Blind tee shot to a narrow fairway.  Played entirely along Dundrum Bay, where the winds are strongest.  If the fairway is missed you now need to decide if you'll either challenge a crazy evil cross bunker 50 yards short of the green, or, lay up.  The cross bunker also partially obscures the view of the green and flag on the 2nd shot.  The green is very narow, although deep.

The 2nd is just a very hard golf hole.

[Tom ORourke]

I have to vote for the 5th at Merion. It was extremely difficult at 420 yards. The creek on the left is in your mind, but the further right you play off the tee the more the fairway slopes right to left, plus the hole plays longer. The green tilts a little from right to left as well, toward the creek. When the pin is on the left side of the green you feel that even a good second shot may run off the green into the creek. There is also a ridge that bisects the green that is a killer if you bail right. I saw some players at the last U.S. Amateur playing to a right hole location, which took the creek out of play, but putts that were made either went in with pace, or went past the hole and backed in. And now that hole is 500 yards with the new tee. The only flat place to play a second shot is from next to the creek, so you need to get aggressive with your tee shot or you will agonize over the second shot. Even a good tee shot does not alleviate the pressure much. I think four pars at the next open picks up a few shots on the field.

[Martin Toal]

My vote goes to Royal County Down's 2nd, measuring 444 yards from the back tee.

Blind tee shot to a narrow fairway.  Played entirely along Dundrum Bay, where the winds are strongest.  If the fairway is missed you now need to decide if you'll either challenge a crazy evil cross bunker 50 yards short of the green, or, lay up.  The cross bunker also partially obscures the view of the green and flag on the 2nd shot.  The green is very narow, although deep.

The 2nd is just a very hard golf hole.

Sure is.

The 3rd is no bargain either, nor is the 15th into the wind.

[Jin Kim]

No. 5 at Bandon Dunes before they cut down the gorse around the green.

[Ken Kearney]

7th County Sligo
Really difficult par 4 that plays into a left to right prevailing wind... normally.
tee shot has been tightened over the years with additional bunkering (didnt need it) to a green with a deep stream that crosses to the front and tightenes to the green on the right side (dont come off the second shot!!!)... try hitting that green from 210 yards, into the wind and your hands like ice blocks in january...


KK

[cary lichtenstein]

The 18th at the Ritz in Jupiter is a difficult par 4, I've made lots of 6's there, but I did make a 2 once:)

[Patrick_Mucci]

Ward,

For me, the most difficult par 4's aren't always the hardest par 4's.

For me, the most difficult par 4's are challenging par 4's that happen to be the opening hole, your introduction to the golf course.

I'm addressing your question in the context of a round that has meaning, a qualifying round, or a medal play round in a tournament.

Often, in addition to the difficulty of the hole, there's the pressure of getting off to a good start as opposed to a bad one, which often sets the tempo for the entire round.  There's the uncertainty of taking your warm up on the range out onto the course where it now counts.

Holes like # 1 at WFW and Wannamoissett would be good examples.

Once you're into the round the first tee jitters or pressures diminish.

The other most difficult par 4, for me, is a challenging par 4 at # 18 where you have a good/great round going, or are in a match where # 18 will decide the match.  # 18 at WFW, Riviera, ANGC, Seminole, PV, Merion and Shinnecock might be examples of those holes.

When you've won or lost your match 3 & 2, those holes are a lot easier than when you're all square on the 18th tee.

[Chris Johnston]

Take your pick...#2, #4, or #18 at SHGC - into a strong wind (or crosswind) each is most challenging and greens offer little relief.  Great holes all!

Same can be said for #2, #7, and #14 at Dismal River - same into the wind with uphill/downhill lies.  Tough greens as well.

[Mark McKeever]

15 & 16 at Bethpage Black are always up there in difficulty in my eyes.  You absolutely need to hit the fiarway, mostly because of the length of the holes.  You're already well behind the eight ball if youre 200-220 out and in the rough on both of them.  15 the challenge isnt over once youre on/around the green (I still need to play it post restoration) and 16 always invites a nice litte fade on the second shot which is typically eaten alive by the front right bunker.  Sixteen is nother deceptively difficult green as well.

Mark

[John Kavanaugh]

I still remember getting to the 13th tee at Torrey Pines South and telling my playing partners that I did not recall Torrey having two par 5's in a row.

[ward peyronnin]

Jim

I was going to add no. 2 at RCD if no one else did. And those bloody bunkers are savagely terrifying- huge, deep, and wildly ragged; scare shit out of you