News:

Welcome to the Golf Club Atlas Discussion Group!

Each user is approved by the Golf Club Atlas editorial staff. For any new inquiries, please contact us.


Ally Mcintosh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What kind of blind shot do you like?
« Reply #25 on: September 30, 2010, 07:45:10 AM »
Those tee shots that carry crests of a hill are important looks, for without them how repetitious would golf courses be?  

Personally, I don't think this choice is ever desirable and if used too often it is not ideal and can be counted as poor design / routing. In my estimation, I think that most designers try not to route uphill holes that have a slightly steeper incline at the start than at the end (i.e. creating a small crest which renders the tee shot blind). Many who do have to move earth to make the hole visible, generally creating unnatural looking mounding to the sides in the process.

As much as I admire much of David Kidd's work, I think that this is a fault with Queenwood. There are a few holes on that course with blind tee shots over a crest.

I tend to agree with Adam.  Even though I am not overly fond of the 17 Porthcawl look, it is part of the bag of tools.  I seem to recall Co Down having more than a few of this general sort of blind tee shots.  RCD could in no way be considered a wide course and on at least one blinder the fairways turns with nasty rough.  It all depends on what comes before, after and how well the routing yields quality holes.  On some courses a lot cna be forgiven and on others little can be tolerated.

Ciao

I consider RCD to be different though... There you are playing over dunes with features in the landscape of the hill, usually to level or falling ground beyond and with the dunes quite often at a diaganol... It is altogether a different issue to just route holes up a hill where a crest renders the landing area blind even though the hill is still climbing... I'm not saying it shouldn't be done and some times it's unavoidable or is the lesser of two evils... I just think that all architects try to avoid it and to have it twice or more in a round is far from ideal...

P.S. I suspect the hole you refer to at RCD is the 6th (as well as the 11th to a lesser extent) and apart from a great green complex and approach, I don't care for the hole for the very reason you mention...
« Last Edit: September 30, 2010, 08:23:18 AM by Ally Mcintosh »

Tim Martin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What kind of blind shot do you like?
« Reply #26 on: September 30, 2010, 09:16:40 AM »
Those tee shots that carry crests of a hill are important looks, for without them how repetitious would golf courses be?  

Personally, I don't think this choice is ever desirable and if used too often it is not ideal and can be counted as poor design / routing. In my estimation, I think that most designers try not to route uphill holes that have a slightly steeper incline at the start than at the end (i.e. creating a small crest which renders the tee shot blind). Many who do have to move earth to make the hole visible, generally creating unnatural looking mounding to the sides in the process.

As much as I admire much of David Kidd's work, I think that this is a fault with Queenwood. There are a few holes on that course with blind tee shots over a crest.

Ally-I wonder if you would call the tee shots at Yale #`s 10 and 17 poor design? I would respectfully disagree. :)

Ally Mcintosh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What kind of blind shot do you like?
« Reply #27 on: September 30, 2010, 09:31:42 AM »
Those tee shots that carry crests of a hill are important looks, for without them how repetitious would golf courses be?  

Personally, I don't think this choice is ever desirable and if used too often it is not ideal and can be counted as poor design / routing. In my estimation, I think that most designers try not to route uphill holes that have a slightly steeper incline at the start than at the end (i.e. creating a small crest which renders the tee shot blind). Many who do have to move earth to make the hole visible, generally creating unnatural looking mounding to the sides in the process.

As much as I admire much of David Kidd's work, I think that this is a fault with Queenwood. There are a few holes on that course with blind tee shots over a crest.

Ally-I wonder if you would call the tee shots at Yale #`s 10 and 17 poor design? I would respectfully disagree. :)

Tim, I'm very slow to call things "poor design". I said that it is less than ideal and can be counted as poor design if used "too often". I stand by that. In my opinion, two holes can be too often in many cases.

However, I have never seen Yale - the only way I can comment is by looking at the photos on Ran's course description.... I can't tell much about 10 - Does the blind tee-shot make the hole or is it the green defences as Ran suggests?...

As for 17, there is interest in that drive. It plays over a lake, it plays up a steep incline to what looks like a flat landing area beyond. That is slightly different to what I was referring to. However, Ran does state that the ridge has been lowered 9 feet since Raynor's death... It looks like fun... Is it ideal? Probably not... If that hole did not have a blind tee shot, do you think Raynor would have thought any less of it?... Definitely not says I... He routed it as he did because that was the best available option (although the style of it actually fits quite nicely with his geometric / rampart style of design in my opinion)...

 
« Last Edit: September 30, 2010, 09:53:39 AM by Ally Mcintosh »

Tim Martin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What kind of blind shot do you like?
« Reply #28 on: September 30, 2010, 09:56:45 AM »
Ally- Yale is a remarkable collection of holes on arguably one of the greatest inland sites in all of golf. There are a pile more blind shots on this course that only enhance the routing rather than hurt it. As far as number 10 both the tee shot and the green "make" the hole. As far as 17 I can`t imagine that Raynor compromised the routing one bit as this is a world class hole. The tee shot is over a small pond and not a lake. I think you would need to see the property to make a fair and accurate assessment.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2010, 03:36:24 PM by Tim Martin »

Ally Mcintosh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What kind of blind shot do you like?
« Reply #29 on: September 30, 2010, 10:22:12 AM »
Ally- Yale is a remarkable collection of holes on arguably one of the greatest inland sights in all of golf. There are a pile more blind shots on this course that only enhance the routing rather than hurt it. As far as number 10 both the tee shot and the green "make" the hole. As far as 17 I can`t imagine that Raynor compromised the routing one bit as this is a world class hole. The tee shot is over a small pond and not a lake. I think you would need to see the property to make a fair and accurate assessment.

I'm not questioning the quality of Yale... I also didn't suggest he compromised the routing on 17... I'm only commenting because you seemed to want me to with your previous post... The golf course looks fantastic from any photos I've seen and sounds fantastic from all first hand reports I've heard...

I tend to like the odd blind hole (hence this thread) but routing numerous uphill blind tee shots over the crest of a rising hill is not ideal - you won't change my mind on that.... I'll try and find an example of what I'm referring to...

Anthony Gray

Re: What kind of blind shot do you like?
« Reply #30 on: September 30, 2010, 11:12:15 AM »


  I like the ones that have the three headstones on top of the hill and on the tee box a marker telling you wich one to go over....Prestwick.

   Anthony


Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What kind of blind shot do you like?
« Reply #31 on: September 30, 2010, 01:08:50 PM »


  I like the ones that have the three headstones on top of the hill and on the tee box a marker telling you wich one to go over....Prestwick.

   Anthony



Anthony

Are you not well?

Ciao


New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What kind of blind shot do you like?
« Reply #32 on: September 30, 2010, 03:32:18 PM »
Ally- Yale is a remarkable collection of holes on arguably one of the greatest inland sights in all of golf. There are a pile more blind shots on this course that only enhance the routing rather than hurt it. As far as number 10 both the tee shot and the green "make" the hole. As far as 17 I can`t imagine that Raynor compromised the routing one bit as this is a world class hole. The tee shot is over a small pond and not a lake. I think you would need to see the property to make a fair and accurate assessment.

I'm not questioning the quality of Yale... I also didn't suggest he compromised the routing on 17... I'm only commenting because you seemed to want me to with your previous post... The golf course looks fantastic from any photos I've seen and sounds fantastic from all first hand reports I've heard...

I tend to like the odd blind hole (hence this thread) but routing numerous uphill blind tee shots over the crest of a rising hill is not ideal - you won't change my mind on that.... I'll try and find an example of what I'm referring to...

Ally, have you played Elie?  I mentioned the blind tee shots over ridges to marker posts above.  Is that the kind of blind tee shot you don't favor?  I personally find them whimsical and an act of faith to aim at the marker post!

Paul_Turner

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What kind of blind shot do you like?
« Reply #33 on: September 30, 2010, 03:37:22 PM »
A big lump is best, one that defines the strategy of the hole:

De Pan 6th


can't get to heaven with a three chord song

Wade Whitehead

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What kind of blind shot do you like?
« Reply #34 on: September 30, 2010, 03:49:57 PM »
I love the tee shot on 18 at Conewango Valley Club in Warren, Pennsylvania.  Anyone else played there?

WW

Alister Matheson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What kind of blind shot do you like?
« Reply #35 on: September 30, 2010, 04:18:13 PM »
My favourite type of blind shot is a drive through a saddle and the best ive played is the 10th hole at The Carnegie Club .
Cruden Bay Links Maintenance Blog

http://crudenbaylinks.blogspot.com/

Tags:
Tags:

An Error Has Occurred!

Call to undefined function theme_linktree()
Back