Help Wanted With...

[Phil_the_Author]

Tony Muldoon, on Ran's "Problem's with the Discussion Group thread" stated:

"Am I the only one, working harder and spending less time on the computer?  I have lots of research ideas and no time to follow them up and I know I’m not alone."

I thought that this needs some following up on. I'd like to know what these research ideas are and I'd like to also encourage others to list the things that they would like to see researched or see more information on.

The reason? This is a pretty bright group on site and many may have answers and information that can be brought forward. It also might encourage some who do have the time to look into some of these questions and post their findings (in separate threads of course) and thereby promote healthy discussions...

So Tony, care to list them so we all can maybe be of help?

I have one of my own. Where exactly was Tilly's Anglo-American Club in Lac Lachigan, Montreal, Canada, and the 27-holes for it actually located? Does anyone have any information or photos or anything else? Tilly wrote about the difficulty in building it and construction of at least a portion of it that opened for play. Since the early 1930s we can find no mention of it anywhere. I say "we" because there is one very dedicated French-Canadian who actually has spent several of the past few summers on the ground looking for it...

[Tony_Muldoon]

Thanks Phil,  appreciate the thought. I think this thread might attract more attention if changed to “Help wanted with...?
  Off the top of my head, I would like to find time to

...know more about Mackenzie’s involvement at Gleneagles – he mentions it in one of his books.  My guess is that local papers circa 1911(I’ll check exact dates) may reveal more.  I know Neil etc are looking into this.

...Abercrombie.  I’d like to know a lot more about him.  I had a drink with an ex captain of the Addington and he said some controversial things. I’d like to find time to interview him properly.

...visit the British Library periodicals section at Colindale, just to see what they have and to read some old Country Life and The Filed magazines’

...research Franks Harris Bros. Ltd , the people who built most of Colts courses.  Guildford library might be a good place to start.

There’s many others, but it’s great when you see collaboration on here.

[Phil_the_Author]

Tony,

You got it! Hopefully we'll see what others can find...

[Dónal Ó Ceallaigh]

Tony / Philip,

I sorry I cannot help you with any of the listed areas, but if I come across anything relevant to you in my own personal searches, I'll let you know.

I am currently researching the early years of golf in Donegal. I'm focussing on the clubs, courses and their evolution, architects, prominent players, championships, founding club members etc. It's a fascinating journey, but there's so much to research, the vast majority of which is not available on-line. It'll take me many years to accomplish this. Golf has been played in over 30 different areas of the county, with many of those early clubs now ceasing to exist, so there's much to learn.

Dónal.

[Niall C]

For about as long as I've been coming on this site (2 years ?) I've been delving into the early history of Scottish courses in general. Largely this has involved trawling through old newspaper copy, national archives and such like. During that time there have been a few specific topics which have caught my interest starting with Old Tom course design references, MacKenzies involvement in courses in Scotland and the early history of Cruden Bay and Turnberry. Other topics include the work of Willie Fernie, John McAndrew and Archie Simpson.

Th topics are endles but unfortunately the available time to do the research is not. Anyone with time can learn heaps by spending time at the National Archives of Scotland. For example they have Colts 1909 report on changes to Turnberry. If anyone is interested in doing a bit of research I'd be happy to point them in a few directions.

Niall

[Alain Chaput]

Tony Muldoon, on Ran's "Problem's with the Discussion Group thread" stated:

"Am I the only one, working harder and spending less time on the computer?  I have lots of research ideas and no time to follow them up and I know I’m not alone."

I thought that this needs some following up on. I'd like to know what these research ideas are and I'd like to also encourage others to list the things that they would like to see researched or see more information on.

The reason? This is a pretty bright group on site and many may have answers and information that can be brought forward. It also might encourage some who do have the time to look into some of these questions and post their findings (in separate threads of course) and thereby promote healthy discussions...

So Tony, care to list them so we all can maybe be of help?

I have one of my own. Where exactly was Tilly's Anglo-American Club in Lac Lachigan, Montreal, Canada, and the 27-holes for it actually located? Does anyone have any information or photos or anything else? Tilly wrote about the difficulty in building it and construction of at least a portion of it that opened for play. Since the early 1930s we can find no mention of it anywhere. I say "we" because there is one very dedicated French-Canadian who actually has spent several of the past few summers on the ground looking for it...

Hi Philip, the French Canadian you are refering too is me. We've exchanged in the past regarding the Anglo-American Club at Lac l'Achigan. After nearly 5 years of research, I still haven't found it. Not sure what you mean by 27 holes... I thought it was only a 9 hole course. As per articles in Golf Illustrated - 1922 and 1924), Tilly also mentioned a club house to complicate things even more. I have old golf directories of that era and no mention of a golf course at Lac l'Achigan... Alain

[Phil_the_Author]

Hello Alain! Good to have you aboard here. It shows the danger in taking things for granted because I thought you knew that Tilly wrote that he had designed 27 holes there.

Below is Tilly's 1925 advertisement listing a number of teh courses that he had designed and were built. Notice that the third one listed under "Twenty-seven Holes" in the upper part of the left is the Anglo-American Club.
 


For those who've never had the privilege of meeting, ciorreponding or speaking with Alain, he has taken on locating the vestiges of teh Club and course as a passion that few can equal. He is meticulous, patient and obviously a lover of Tilly's work. All you Canadian members should be proud to make his acquaintance.

By the way, Alain, was it you who shared this photo with me? Someone sent me this, and I can't find who in my notes, as the possible site of the Anglo-American Club. If you did, what did you find out about it. If you didn't, then here's another clue for you!

[Alain Chaput]

Hello Alain! Good to have you aboard here. It shows the danger in taking things for granted because I thought you knew that Tilly wrote that he had designed 27 holes there.

Below is Tilly's 1925 advertisement listing a number of teh courses that he had designed and were built. Notice that the third one listed under "Twenty-seven Holes" in the upper part of the left is the Anglo-American Club.
 


For those who've never had the privilege of meeting, ciorreponding or speaking with Alain, he has taken on locating the vestiges of teh Club and course as a passion that few can equal. He is meticulous, patient and obviously a lover of Tilly's work. All you Canadian members should be proud to make his acquaintance.

By the way, Alain, was it you who shared this photo with me? Someone sent me this, and I can't find who in my notes, as the possible site of the Anglo-American Club. If you did, what did you find out about it. If you didn't, then here's another clue for you!

Thanks for the nice words Philip. The picture was sent to you by Claude Gravel (a friend of mine). I work for Bell Canada and Claude wanted to know if our company had a country club in the laurentians since the picture has the name Bell in the title. Although this looks like a picture from the same era, I doubt that this would be the club house of Anglo American.

According to the "Registrary of enterprises of the province of Quebec", the Lake L’Achigan Golf & Country Club was incorporated on February 19th, 1930. Could this be Anglo American? It must be.

The city doesn't know anything about the existence of this club. I'm investigating a new place: The salvation army is running a camp at LAc L'Achigan since 1933. I sent them a note yesterday asking for information about who they bought the land from in 1933, etc. The location of the camp is lakefront. Since they opened the camp just after the depression and that I believe that the club may have gone through some financial crisis (reason why we can't find anything today), I hope that this will lead to something.

I still have a hard time understanding why they would build a 27 hole complex in the laurentains in 1922-1925. At the time, the region only had a few 9 holes and it was more than enough for the population, even for those on vacation during summer time...

I'm really pushing the city of St-Hippolyte to help me with this. They have a few thousands citizens around the lake and close to the city...  Someone must know something...

Can you tell me where does this 1925 advertisement comes from? And if Tilly did 27 holes, which should have been a huge contract for the time, do you happen to have names of the people who hired him for the job?

Alain

[Phil_the_Author]

Alain,

I'm at Shawnee where I'm working on their 100-year anniversary book for next year, so I can't answer all of your questions till I get back. As for those who hired him, we have no idea. All we have is the information from this flyer and the Golf Illustrated article(s) where he mentioned the course and the construction that was underway.

[TEPaul]

"Tilly wrote about the difficulty in building it and construction of at least a portion of it that opened for play."


Can you show us exactly what he said about that or what he or anyone else said about a portion of it that opened for play?

[Phil_the_Author]

Yes I can. Unfortunately I am out of town and it will have to wait until I get back.

[Bob Jenkins]

This is one of those threads that leaves many of us appreciative of being close to a significant finding in golf club architecture from years ago. Alain, your contribution is most appreciated. All that the vast majority of us can do is sit back and hope you can come up with some information in support of the Club.
Thank you.

Bob J