[Ally Mcintosh]

There are many courses that in recent years have changed their hole sequencing without altering their base routing (i.e. with no noticeable redesign), quite often because of a clubhouse move... Examples that come to mind include Ballybunion, Banff and Baltray (the three 'B's)...

What other examples are there?... Why has the change been made?... Is it an improvement on the old routing?

[Dónal Ó Ceallaigh]

Rosapenna (old course) has changed it's starting hole a couple of times in recent years from the 1st to the 11th.

These two starting points were/are located nicely in the transition area between the pure links holes of the valley and the downland like holes that are routed around the coastguard station.

I my opinion, it was better to start with the easier valley holes and when you were sufficiently loosened up, you were ready to tackle the more difficult coastguard holes.

[Eric Smith]

Arcadia Bluffs comes to mind.  Maybe someone on here can tell us why.

[Jeff_Brauer]

Geez, all of my new courses seem to have at least reversed nines at some point.  And whenever anyone discusses my course in Davis, CA with me, I am lost, primarily because they have changed the hole numbers around a lot given the number of close holes and tees that allow those kind of options.

My home club of GSW in Dallas has changed the numbering a few times since I have been there.  I made a hole in one on what was 17 when I played it and now its 6!  Do I get credit for two holes in ones?

[jeffwarne]

Geez, all of my new courses seem to have at least reversed nines at some point.  And whenever anyone discusses my course in Davis, CA with me, I am lost, primarily because they have changed the hole numbers around a lot given the number of close holes and tees that allow those kind of options.

My home club of GSW in Dallas has changed the numbering a few times since I have been there.  I made a hole in one on what was 17 when I played it and now its 6!  Do I get credit for two holes in ones?

Atlantic had a really weird routing when it opened involving walking across a couple greens so that nines could return to the clubhouse and to avoid a difficult  starting hole (now #14)
The routing is now better save for long walks on 13 and 14. 13 tee-fairway is unavoidable over a protected area and 13-14 is much of the walk you would've made back  to the clubhouse as 13 was supposed to be 18 originally

[Gary Slatter]

Congressional  their 18th became the 10th(?)    Not sure why, convention?

[Phil_the_Author]

No Jeff, but I bet you are really proud of telling everyone that you got a hole-in-one on the 17th especially if it is now a par-4 or par-5!

[Kalen Braley]

Indian Canyon in Spokane, WA has switched thier 9s fairly recently.  The problem was pace of play as the original #1 and #2 were both short par 5s leading to long waits on both holes.  It wasn't uncommon to finally get to the 3rd tee and already be 40-45 minutes into your round on the weekends.

[Adrian_Stiff]

I would say most couses have at some stage.

[Anthony_Nysse]

Arcadia Bluffs comes to mind.  Maybe someone on here can tell us why.

It was my understanding that it was done to bring the golfer to the clubhouse throughout the round more often.

[Adam Clayman]

There are many courses that in recent years have changed their hole sequencing without altering their base routing (i.e. with no noticeable redesign), quite often because of a clubhouse move... Examples that come to mind include Ballybunion, Banff and Baltray (the three 'B's)...

What other examples are there?... Why has the change been made?... Is it an improvement on the old routing?

 I've found most changes to routing to be ill conceived as far as the GCA is concerned. Banff for instance, has to be the biggest blunder on that scale, I know of. All for what? Revenue?

Switching the configuration is the most common example, I've seen. My opinion is I just don't see how any course would work better than originally intended unless the original design was is some way deficient.

Pinon Hills- is the Second biggest blunder and for no other reason than the starter couldn't see down the first fairway, but could the tenth.

The Palmer design near Kalamath Falls ?  Very subtle difference but still palpable.

Antler Creek might be the only improvement i've seen.

[Jim Tang]

With Arcadia, I believe the changes allow for the 9th hole to return to the clubhouse.  The old routing had the 9th hole out by the lake and you were nowhere near the clubhouse.  The newer routing also creates three holes in a row that play along the lake, whereas the old routing only had two holes in a row that played along the lake.

[Matt Bosela]

Indian Canyon in Spokane, WA has switched thier 9s fairly recently.  The problem was pace of play as the original #1 and #2 were both short par 5s leading to long waits on both holes.  It wasn't uncommon to finally get to the 3rd tee and already be 40-45 minutes into your round on the weekends.

My home club, St. Catharines GCC suffered from the same thing - the course opened with a sub-500 yard par five, followed by a driveable par 4 (305 from tips) and a tough par three.  At club championship time, pace of play was a disaster and even during normal periods, this opening sequence was problematic.

They reversed the first five holes of each nine so we now start with three consecutive par fours and pace of play is almost always less than four hours now.

[Pete_Pittock]

Reserve Vineyard North course by Cupp. What is now the 10th hole used to be #1. Changed because of pace issues, better control over the tee and closer to the practice putting green. Current/Old #s 1/10, 2/11, 3/12, 4/13, 5/14, 6/15, 7/7, 8/8, 9/9
                                                                                10/1, 11/2, 12/3, 13/4, 14/5, 15/6, 16/16, 17/17, 18/18. 

[Gary Slatter]

what about the Old Course being played in reverse, that must qualify as the most drastic sequencing change.
Was itdone for variety to confuse visitors from Berwick or Prestwick?

[Jason McNamara]

The Machrie has had multiple changes.

[Mike_Clayton]

 For tournament play they have changed the routing of the Composite Course at Royal Melbourne.
And the last three tournaments at Kingston Heath have been on completely different routings.

[David_Tepper]

Golspie GC (north of Dornoch) moved its clubhouse inland in the 1950's due to coastal erosion.  What was the 1st hole is now the 3rd hole.

[Niall C]

what about the Old Course being played in reverse, that must qualify as the most drastic sequencing change.
Was itdone for variety to confuse visitors from Berwick or Prestwick?

Gary

You'll find that back then North Berwick and Carnoustie amongst others reversed their routings as well. It was quite common to do this to save the turf. Courses at one time, in the late 19th/early 20th century were far more open with little or no hole definition other than greens and tees so it wasn't that much of a deal. Another very good example is how Prestwick was rerouted, creating new holes with existing tees/greens.

Glasgow Gailes also got the same treatment with at least 3 or 4 different courses being laid out over the same tract of land in the first 20 years of its existence.

Niall

[Gary Slatter]

Thanks Nial.  Playing Carnoustie in January 2009 they used their winter card, with a different routing (Excellent, after two you play Hogan's par five).  I asked the starter why they did it in the winter, he asked a couple of caddies and the answer was "always do it in the winter".

[John Moore II]

Pine Needles changed #1 to #18 a good while back, certainly not recently. They did this because they built the present clubhouse instead of the old one which is the present 'assisted living home' behind the #2 tee.

[Mike Hendren]

No mention of Augusta National Golf Club reversing the nines.

Killspindie's 2nd was originally the 1st.

Von Hagge's Nashville Golf & Athletic Club (fka Crocket Springs CC) 7th was originally the 1st.

[Mike Cirba]

Merion changed their sequencing...today's 6th was originally the 3rd back when the 1916 US Amateur was played, and today's 3rd was the 7th if you follow along, but later the routing significantly changed so it's a bit moot at this juncture, except to say that the old routing was probably more logical and less interesting, if that makes any sense.

[Thomas McQuillan]

There are many courses that in recent years have changed their hole sequencing without altering their base routing (i.e. with no noticeable redesign), quite often because of a clubhouse move... Examples that come to mind include Ballybunion, Banff and Baltray (the three 'B's)...

What other examples are there?... Why has the change been made?... Is it an improvement on the old routing?

Just curios to know what changes in routing occured at baltray?

[TEPaul]

At one point my club decided to resequence by simply flipping the nines.

Why? Because the board felt it was a whole lot easier to have a couple of hard liquor pops before taking on the second nine.

True story.

They tried it for a year or so and I guess the prohibiontists must have ganged up on them and made them put it back the way it was.

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