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Philippe Binette

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Crump Cup 2009
« on: August 26, 2009, 10:59:01 AM »
Hi,

I might go down to Pine Valley for the Crump cup this year.

what date is it?

any course in the area (public) worth playing.

Thanks

Dan Herrmann

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Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #1 on: August 26, 2009, 11:08:55 AM »
Philippe - just sneak on to Pine Valley - it's easy!  (Actually not - only golf course I've ever seen that has their own legit police department).  To help you get ready, check out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pine_Valley,_New_Jersey



Pine Hill is nearby.  But all the better courses are over here in Pennsylvania (just saying that to get a rise out of Matt Ward ;) )
« Last Edit: August 26, 2009, 11:11:47 AM by Dan Herrmann »

archie_struthers

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Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #2 on: August 26, 2009, 11:14:15 AM »
 ;D :D ;)


Philippe  ...you should definitely play Pine Hill   ,  particularly in that it's on ground very similar to that of it's neighbor....it's a good golf course , difficult  .  Lots of real good stuff in the area , on both sides of the river>   

ps  the Crump is typically the last weekend in September...spectators allowed for th eSunday round after 12 noon  ...admission is free!

Joe Bausch

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Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #3 on: August 26, 2009, 11:26:24 AM »
But I'm fairly confident that this year the CC is not the last weekend in September, but is rather the week after the Walker Cup.  Since the WC is the 12th and 13th, I think the Crump Cup is the 19th and 20th.  But I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong!

I will 2nd Archie's rec of Pine Hill, as long as cash is not an issue.  And Archie was too modest, perhaps, to mention his layout Twisted Dune, although that is farther away.  Some others I would consider on that side of the Delaware River:

Scotland Run
Riverwinds
Pitman
McCullough's Emerald Links (make it 36 that day with Twisted Dune, as they are very close to one another)
@jwbausch (for new photo albums)
The site for the Cobb's Creek project:  https://cobbscreek.org/
Nearly all Delaware Valley golf courses in photo albums: Bausch Collection

JSlonis

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #4 on: August 26, 2009, 12:10:12 PM »
Philippe,

Joe is correct...

The day for spectators will be Sunday, Sept 20th.  The Crump Cup is moved up a week due to the USGA State Team Championship and the the US Mid-Am in subsequent weeks.

Parking is at the Clementon Amusement Park lot and there are bus shuttles to the front gate of Pine Valley.  Gates usually open around 12:45-1:00 pm.

Dan Herrmann

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #5 on: August 26, 2009, 01:18:20 PM »
Like Joe, I happily suggest Twisted Dune.  It's a drive, but it's a lot of fun.

Michael Blake

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #6 on: August 26, 2009, 01:23:20 PM »
I would play Twisted Dune early that Sunday then head to the Crump Cup afterwards.

I also recommend following the Senior flight, as there are few spectators.  I followed that group last year and watched gc architect Steve Smyers win it.

Jamie, they changed parking last year.  It wasn't at Clementon Park.  It was at a Middle School nearby.  Not sure if it remains there for this year.

Kyle Harris

Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #7 on: August 26, 2009, 01:45:47 PM »
Ignore Pine Hill - that's best saved for your 6th trip to Philadelphia, maybe 7th.

There's plenty more and better to see in the area for cheaper.

JSlonis

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Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #8 on: August 26, 2009, 01:45:54 PM »
Michael,

Thanks. I didn't realize parking had been changed.

Kyle Henderson

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Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #9 on: August 26, 2009, 02:35:02 PM »
I believe Mr. Pitock will be in attendence, if you're looking for GCA brethren to share in your journey.
"I always knew terrorists hated us for our freedom. Now they love us for our bondage." -- Stephen T. Colbert discusses the popularity of '50 Shades of Grey' at Gitmo

Pete_Pittock

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Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #10 on: August 26, 2009, 06:41:18 PM »
Kyle is right, I wll be spectating on Sunday and could be up for golf on Saturday if the rest of the trip schedules out okay.

Dan Herrmann

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #11 on: August 26, 2009, 08:15:38 PM »
Peter,
I still owe you a round at my place if you're up to a 40 minute drive from Merion-ville.

Pete_Pittock

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Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #12 on: September 19, 2009, 08:05:15 AM »

Ron Csigo

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Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #13 on: September 19, 2009, 09:38:54 AM »
Thanks for confirming the parking situation.
Playing and Admiring the Great Golf Courses of the World.

Dan Herrmann

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #14 on: September 19, 2009, 09:14:01 PM »
Weather should be fantastic.  Clear blue skies and refreshingly cool.  Mid-Atlantic September at its best.

ChipRoyce

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #15 on: September 20, 2009, 04:28:12 AM »
I read through the Bloomberg article and found something strange.

The article says that the membership list is ultra-secret, however, I remember from my last trip to PV (want to say 1999 or so) that there was a very plain board near the entrance that had a list of the current membership.

Has that been removed?

Steve Kline

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #16 on: September 20, 2009, 12:56:38 PM »
The board was there when I went in 2004 or 2005.

Pete_Pittock

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Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #17 on: September 20, 2009, 09:21:03 PM »
Andrew Biggadike spotted!
Awesome. Seeing Pine Valley and Merion really sets my mind at ease when looking at a club with top ten potential. Joe Bausch was the only GCA spectator I saw, but there on the scorboard was the name A Biggadike in the third flight playing Tripp Davis. Started on 10 about 10 minutes before they opened the gates,  but I find them hitting approaches to 11. AB misses a 6' downhill slider for a half. Goes 1 down but wins 14-16 to go 2 up. At the turn at a 2 hour pace, check the scoreboard and see Chris Maletis from Pumpkin Ridge in the 1st flight senior championship. They started 35 minutes ahead of AB/TD, hitched a cart ride and found them 5 1/2 holes ahead.
Followed them to the 20th hole where Maletis won with a great approach over the trees (11th hole from the left side of the fairway.
Don't know how Andrew finished, it was 5 o'clock, everyone else was finished and the buses were leaving.

Signs and police everywhere saying no cellphones, cameras. Saw plenty in use. Mine stayed in the car. Now I have to come back.

  
« Last Edit: September 20, 2009, 11:13:29 PM by Pete_Pittock »

Steve_ Shaffer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #18 on: September 20, 2009, 11:25:30 PM »
I followed the championship match won by Skip Berkmeyer 1up with a birdie putt on 18. He came from 2 down to win an exciting match.

http://www.golfweek.com/news/2009/sep/20/berkmeyer-takes-home-crump-cup/

The course was in great condition. Fast and firm. Berkmeyer consistently outdrove Eliot by 30-40y but sometimes struggled off the tee himself. I was impressed with size of some the greens and their difficulty. The fairways were more than generous-just don't miss them. The new back tee on 4 works well. The scorecard revealed these slope/ratings:

Back 74.2/154@6999y
Regular 72.4/151@ 6532y




« Last Edit: September 21, 2009, 08:00:32 AM by Steve_ Shaffer »
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Matt_Cohn

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Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #19 on: September 21, 2009, 12:44:16 AM »
Back 74.2/154@6999y

Purposefully not 7,000, or a coincidence?

Steve_ Shaffer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #20 on: September 21, 2009, 07:30:16 AM »
Matt,

PV must have been giving out their old scorecards as some holes have been lengthened for the back tees- for example to 4th is listed on the scorecard at 451y but a new tee makes it about 485y. So the current yardage from the back is more than 7000y.


"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

C. Squier

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #21 on: September 21, 2009, 08:14:20 AM »
The new 4th tee looks absolutely terrifying.  Definitely puts the teeth back into that hole, if it ever lost any.

Pete_Pittock

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #22 on: September 21, 2009, 08:27:23 AM »
Not only longer, but even lower by about six feet.

TEPaul

Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #23 on: September 21, 2009, 09:36:36 AM »
"Back 74.2/154@6999y

Purposefully not 7,000, or a coincidence?"



Matt Cohn:

By the way, congratulations on your good win!

About 4-5 years ago when that new back yardage card (6,999yd) came out I asked the man who would be the best one to know if that was a coincidence or purposeful. He said it was just the way it worked out (coincidence). I basically said: "Oh come on, I could've found you at least one extra yard" ;) but he said that was just the way it worked out.

That new back tee on #4 was considered for a number of years now but it was somewhat complicated I guess as I think it needed to pass some permitting approval (because of where it is vis-a-vis a watercourse etc).  When we looked back some years ago where it was planned it looked like that back tee would sort of lose the angle on that fairway but when we went back on it when it was first built it really didn't seem to lose the angle much at all. Also obviously a number of trees had to be taken out all up the right but when that was done it looked pretty good from back there. I think this year at some point I tried to walk off the additional yardage from the back of the old tips but it was pretty hard to do because of the topography back there. I think I recall getting something like an additional 40-50 yards so if that's what it is that would up the tips to around 7,050 on the card even though they may've also added a bit more (since that 6,999 card) on #7 and perhaps some since on #16 but I am not sure about that. If that is true though the potential tip card could be around 7,100.

On #4 there is some historical material that indicates Crump (and W.C. Fownes after Crump died) very much wanted good players to have to play essentially a wood for their second shots to the green and that it should obviously be from the top of the hill and that drives should not go over that interesing turbo-boost fairway down to the lower fairway tier which was basically what all good players were doing from the old tip tee even with 3 woods.

With this new back tee on #4 now in play I don't know if it accomplishes that purpose because some of these players today are so long but it might.

I also walked off all the yardages on that fairway. It is very interesting in the ways you can get the ball down to that lower tee because the turbo-boost really is on a diagonal (easier to get it down to the lower tier by going down the right side and if you go too far left on that fairway the longer left side turbo-boost will actually take the ball off the fairway and into the woods). However, from side to side that fairway is a tad over 65 yards wide and from the beginning of the fairway to the turbo-boost is around 65-75 yards long or deep depending on the direction the player takes off the tee.


 
 

JESII

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Crump Cup 2009
« Reply #24 on: September 21, 2009, 09:44:04 AM »
The real question is...have they installed shatter-proof safety glass along that side of the clubhouse/pro shop yet?