The Sagebrush Golf & Sporting Club Experience (w/2010 Update)

[Keith Cutten]

Matt, thanks for the great pictures and summary thus far. It has been exciting to see the pictures of the course with grass! I have not seen the course since August 2008 when holes 7-18 were nothing but topsoil.   

This course is truly a testament to Rod’s routing ability. Spending two years on this site during its construction has made me a firm believer that no better routing could have been conceived.

It is great to read that the course looks like it has been there for a long time. Rod and Jeff’s on site design process definitely influenced this result.   

Philippe: How could a summary of the 15th be complete without talk of the Penguin’s Bathtub!!!

[Jeff_Mingay]

Keith,

The "Penguin's bathtub" bunker is behind 14 green; not 15! (I'm sure you meant 14!)

That was the first bunker Philippe dug for us, at Sagebrush. This little trench was so deep when he finished Rod and I made him put some dirt back in it... a literal first!

Keith's post also reminds me to mention that there are A LOT of people who deserve credit for the final result at Sagebrush.

So many put their hearts and souls, and time, into the project. I'm apprehensive to start naming names tonight, fearing I'll miss someone. I'll get list together though; because, as at all golf course projects, the hard work of many, who typically go unrecognized when the "hoopla" surrounding a new course opening begins, deserves credit.

Cheers,

[Keith Cutten]

Jeff, I can always rely on you to catch my mistakes. Yup, I definetly meant 14... maybe it is a good thing I am headed back there soon!

As for people deserving credit, "Lights Out Charters" wins my vote. 

[Joe Hancock]

I'm enjoying the golf course and the views very much through these great pictures and descriptions. Well done to all involved!

Joe

[Philippe Binette]

Thanks for making my nickname famous: K. Cutten...

The shape of the Penguin's Bathtub was already there, created by the side of an old road that use to go on the 14th green. Jeff  asked me to built a bunker there... small blind bunker behind a green, I had Garden City in mind and started digging...

I can remember the look on Jeff's face when he saw the huge pile of dirt that came out of that little hole.

Among the crew: Dancing Jay Charters who asked the best question of the project: Jeff asked him to go out and water the bunkers on 9, and Jay replied: what is a bunker?... that can start a philosophical debate and actually did produce an entire book on the subject.

It was an emotionally intense project, that's what happen when a bunch of passionate people meet

[Mike Hendren]

This course is truly a testament to Rod’s routing ability. Spending two years on this site during its construction has made me a firm believer that no better routing could have been conceived.

I am enjoying these photographs immensely, but am I correct in calculating that 10 of the first 13 holes play downhill?  I take no issue with your argument that no better routing could have been conceived, but at the same time is an architect "cheating" a little big by using green to tee transitions to climb back up the site?

Mike

[Matt Bosela]

This course is truly a testament to Rod’s routing ability. Spending two years on this site during its construction has made me a firm believer that no better routing could have been conceived.

I am enjoying these photographs immensely, but am I correct in calculating that 10 of the first 13 holes play downhill?  I take no issue with your argument that no better routing could have been conceived, but at the same time is an architect "cheating" a little big by using green to tee transitions to climb back up the site?

Mike

I maybe should defer to Jeff, Philippe or Keith but I'll give it a shot:

#1 - Uphill significantly the whole way (VERY SHORT TRANSITION TO NEXT TEE)
#2 - Downhill (SHORT TRANSITION TO NEXT TEE)
#3 - Elevated back tee but the other tees are pretty close to the fairway grade - this hole is cut into the hillside so there is a natural right to left kicker slope but I wouldn't call this hole downhill (VERY SHORT TRANSITION TO NEXT TEE BUT A BIT MORE OF A CLIMB IF PLAYING THE TIPS)
#4 - Downhill - significant drop (VERY SHORT TRANSITION TO NEXT TEE)
#5 - Downhill (SHORT TRANSITION TO NEXT TEE)
#6 - Pretty flat - again, there is an elevated back tee but the other tees are either on grade with the fairway or slightly above (SHORT TRANSITION TO NEXT TEE)
#7 - Uphill tee shot but a downhill approach...plays downhill overall (MID-LENGTH TRANSITION TO NEXT TEE)
#8 - Again, uphill blind shot on the drive but back down the hill on the approach - overall, downhill (SHORT TRANSITION TO NEXT TEE)
#9 - Uphill (SHORT TRANSITION TO NEXT TEE)
#10 - Downhill (LONG UPHILL CLIMB TO NEXT TEE)
#11 - Approach shot is significantly downhill (LONG, WINDING CLIMB TO NEXT TEE)
#12 - Uphill (SHORT TRANSITION TO NEXT TEE)
#13 - Downhill (LONG CLIMB TO BACK TEE, NOT AS LONG TO OTHER DECKS)
#14 - Elevated back tee to a lower landing area but the rest of the hole plays uphill...overall, it's uphill slightly (VERY SHORT TRANSITION TO NEXT TEE)
#15 - Downhill off the tee but right back up the hill on the approach  (SHORT TRANSITION TO NEXT TEE)
#16 - Downhill (VERY SHORT TRANSITION TO NEXT TEE)
#17 - Plays slightly downhill overall (VERY SHORT TRANSITION TO NEXT TEE)
#18 - Uphill

So I'd say 10 of the 18 holes play downhill, 5 are uphill and the rest are relatively level.  I indicated the transitions above as well just to reiterate that there are very few significant climbs from green to tee but the few that are there are definitely challenging and make it a difficult but not impossible walk.

[Will MacEwen]

Matt,

Thanks for doing this.  Bob J and I are slated to tee it up here tomorrow morning and I am sure we will both give our impressions.  I don't think it will be photo-documented like the donnybrook at Wine Valley. 

I have a bit of a wacky travel schedule and won't be giving any strokes if I have had to sleep in my truck. 

[henrye]

So, Will & Bob, what's the verdict?

[Will MacEwen]

So, Will & Bob, what's the verdict?

Henry,

I will post more in detail later, but here is the 10 cent review.

I was skeptical about the course ever since I heard about it.  Zokol was wildly positive about it, and it is easy to throw out terms like "mimimalism" and reference Coore, Doak, etc.  Most BC courses that get hyped are more sizzle than steak, particularly those in the interior.  I expected that we were being sold more of the same.  My skepticism did fade since discovering GCA, but I still had reservations.

Not only was I pleased with the course, I was flat out blown away.  It is crazy fun to play.  Bob and I were enthralled for 18 holes.  The whole experience is, in my modest experience, unique.  Considering the steady diet of Bear Mountain/Tower Ranch type courses that we get in BC, Sagebrush is a remarkable achievement.  Zokol, Whitman and the rest of the crew (including those who post here) did something exceptional.

I actually bumped into Dick Zokol in a diner on the way to the course and we chatted for 15 minutes.  He was very friendly and frank, and actually seemed interested in my opinions.  I realized that he comes off as wildly positive because that is how he is wired.  He should be very proud of what he has accomplished and I hope it ends up as a success for him.  I know the membership model must be up in the air right now.

In short - two big thumbs up from Bob and I.  It was also nice not to get waxed by Jenkins like I did at his club last year.

Bob is considering a GCA event there.  He is hoping to get some sort of committment from Mr. Mayhugh, which I guess is required for official GCA events.

[Jeff_Mingay]

Thanks for posting your post-round thoughts, Will... and, of course, I'm glad you enjoyed yourself so much at Sagebrush; knowing I speak for Dick and Rod, too.

Looking forward to photos of 16, 17 and 18... what happened to Matt 

[Brad Tufts]

Wow looks fantastic...they even have NESN HD in BC!

I see some similarities between #15 and Prairie Dunes #3...

[Bob Jenkins]

As Will McEwan said, we had a great day at Sagebrush on Saturday. I took some pics and will try to post them tonight. I was trying to show the green complexes and the contouring which does not always show up well with pics taken mid-day but hopefully they will show what blew us away!  The greens were incredibly true, I would guess at about a 10-11 on the Stimp, but most of all they were just plain fun!  On approaching most greens, several of which are huge, I just stood there taking it all in and thinking of the possibilities for pin positions, how to approach the green, etc. The undulations were significant but not goofy and just made you think about the options available on pitching into a green.

I don't think there are any forced carries on the whole course, which is incredible considering there is a fair amount of elevation change. I was so much fun to stand in the fairway and watch our shots bump in and take off and roll out for 10-15 seconds while we stood and watched. The exception may be the short 12th hole but that is just over 100 yards with one of the smaller greens and some very subtle contouring.

It is a course you have to play more than once and if you are there for the first time, read the hole descriptions or you will be teeing off in the wrong direction and directly into the sage and cabbage. Cannot wait to return!

The idea of the Hideout is also sooo cool! Walking into a tent tucked between a few hills and a lake and behold, High definition TV showing the Barclay's, a great lunch and much more!  The staff, Dick, his partner Terry and all of the others were also a pleasure.

I could go on but Dick, Rod Whitman, Armen Suny, Jeff Mingay and others all did a fabulous job on the course and the concept. I went with high expectations and those expectations were exceeded by a mile!

I know, it is golf in a cart, but that did not take away from the experience. No GPS, no sprinkler head yardages, just a rock at the edge of each fairway at 150 yards to measure distance. Also no rakes in those wonderful bunkers! Just sweep around the sand with your feet to smooth it out.

Loved the place.

Bob Jenkins

[Matt Bosela]

Thanks for posting your post-round thoughts, Will... and, of course, I'm glad you enjoyed yourself so much at Sagebrush; knowing I speak for Dick and Rod, too.

Looking forward to photos of 16, 17 and 18... what happened to Matt 

Still here Jeff!  Just had a busy weekend but I'll be posting the last three holes tonight.

Great to hear Will and Bob's impressions as well!

[henrye]

Thanks guys for your takes.  Sounds like a great place & atmosphere.  Congrats to all involved.  The golf guys sound like they earned an A+.  This should certainly make it easier for the bus. & marketing guys/gals.

[Sean Leary]

Bob J,

Can't wait for Mayhugh to pick me up in his jet to come play here and at PR with you.

[John Mayhugh]

Bob is considering a GCA event there.  He is hoping to get some sort of committment from Mr. Mayhugh, which I guess is required for official GCA events.

Will,
Bob is stuck with me for a week in England, so he's just trying to stay on my good side.

Sean,
My jet has way too many scheduled stops I'm afraid.

[Matt Bosela]

16th Hole: Par Five – 644 Yards (Championship Tee)

The tee shot on this long par five should be played toward the valley of trees in the distance, as the middle of the fairway is obscured by the hillside in the foreground.  Balls hit to the right will likely bounce well left to safety off the sagebrush.

View from back tee



The second shot can be partially blind, depending on how far you hit it off the tee and plays well downhill.  The proper line is just a bit left of the rockpile in the distance, as there is a high likelihood of the ball filtering down the hill and onto the green.  However, you must be sure to avoid the deep and scraggly fairway bunker that offers protection from players going directly at the green.

View from landing area



View of fairway bunker



The third shot will be played from above the green to a very large and undulating putting surface that breaks sharply from right to left.  Little pitch and runs work great here and it’s incredible fun to watch the ball run down the hill and off to the left toward the pin.

View from approach area



View from behind green



They are doing a bit of drainage work, as you can see in the photo above but this is another hole where many options present themselves to the player.

17th Hole: Par Four – 434 Yards (Championship Tee)

I’m pretty sure Richard said that this is his favourite vista on the entire course, with Nicola Lake and the mountains in the background and the 18th hole sitting above the 17th in the foreground.  The tee shot here is played downhill to a fairway that is blind in the picture below.  The proper aiming point is the fairway bunker on the left hand side.

View from back tee



It’s a pretty straightforward approach shot here into the prevailing wind, with a bit of a false front and a large swale near the back of the green.

View from landing area



View from approach area



18th Hole: Par Four – 420 Yards (Championship Tee)

A solid finisher where you need to decide how far right you want to go to open up the view for your second shot.  Balls will tend to bounce a bit to the right due to some fairway sloping in that direction but you can have a bit of a blind second shot if you venture too far to the left.

View from back tee



According to Richard, there was a lot of debate on where to place this green.  The initial plans called for the green to be placed well right of where it is currently but the problem was that the second shot would have been completely blind due to the fact that the area was much lower than fairway grade.  Richard was strongly opposed to a blind approach shot on the last hole so a compromise was made and the greensite was moved to its present location.

View from landing area



View from approach area



View from back of green



Richard praised the work of Jeff Mingay here, saying that he was responsible for all of the work on the 18th green.  There’s a chipping area behind the green and I can tell you that it is no bargain getting up and down from back there!  Right is also pretty dead on this hole.  A good, solid finisher, although most players will want to head right back to the first tee and play the course again!

I just can’t speak highly enough about my experience at Sagebrush.  I think the golf course is exceptional and is completely worthy of the praise it is receiving from players and critics alike.  Right out of the gates, I think it is among the top 10-15 courses in Canada – the course plays unbelievably firm and fast and offers so many options on almost every hole.  I’ve never had as much fun playing the game of golf then the day I spent at Sagebrush and I commend everyone involved with the project.

This is a special place and I truly hope Richard, Terry and the whole team at Sagebrush get the success they deserve.  I can’t wait to get back and play again!

[Derek Dirksen]

Thanks for the great photos.  Looks like a very special place.  For what its worth I don't care if its hard to walk.  Congrats to all envolved.

[Philippe Binette]

Not so fast with the top 10, top 15 in Canada...

As I've said in a Tobiano thread before, you have to let time do his work before a course reaches its full potential. The new kid in town always to appear the coolest thing, great golf architecture is the one that last and continues to improve.

I prefer to see a slow rise toward the top of rankings, à la Sand Hills, than the explosion / implosion effect that often happens in golf rankings

[George Freeman]

awesome pics, thank you again.  The course looks amazing and fun, and i'm not too worried about the walk being tough....

Is google maps correct in it only being 3 hrs from Vancouver?

[Will MacEwen]

George three hours is about right.

[Duane Sharpe]

Thanks Matt for the awesome review and pictures! Congratulations to Jeff,Rod, Dick and Armen for their accomplishments.
After reading the posts and seeing the pictures, I can't wait to play the course in 3 weeks. I toured the site last July with Jeff and knew it was going to be incredible. I am glad to hear the reviews on here confirmed my beliefs.
Honestly.... can't wait to play. Well done gang
Sharpee

[Andrew Cunningham]

So captivating is the experience at Sagebrush that I bought a membership on site.  The only problem now is planning my work schedule around the 5 hour flight and 3 hour drive it takes me to get to Sagebrush.  As I right this, I am two hours short of being awake for 24 hours straight - save a quick nap on the plane.  Perhaps it is insane to drive a combined six hours to play a round of golf - let alone the five hour flight - but such is the draw to what is arguably one of the greatest experiences in all of golf.  And certainly one of the best values.

[Rob Rigg]

Andrew,

Can you compare Sagebrush to some of your experiences at other grand venues?

What made it special enough for you to scoop a membership after a couple of rounds?

What were your favorite holes?

etc.

After you get some rest of course.