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Jim Colton

Ballyneal, An Informal Poll/July GCA Weekend Pics
« on: July 20, 2009, 02:07:17 AM »
I'm currently at Ballyneal with a mix of GCA and non-GCA guys, and I ran an informal poll during dinner.  I think the resultS might generate some interesting discussion here, so here it goes:

Favorite Hole: 7th Hole (7 votes); 8th & 4th (2 each); 2nd,3rd,5th (1 each)
Favorite Hole, Back Nine (since no back nine holes made favorite overall): 18th Hole (4 votes), 12th & 13th (2 each); every other back nine hole (1 each)
Favorite, Front or Back Nine: Front 12; Back Nine 2
Hardest Hole: 6th Hole (8 votes); 17th Hole (3); 16th (2); 13th (1)
Easiest Hole: 7th Hole (8 votes); 3rd Hole (2); 1st, 8th, 11th (1)
Best Green: 7th & 12th (5 votes each); 8th (4)
One word to describe Jim Colton: obsessive (2); generous (2), 54, scary, ego (my father-in-law), enthusiast, gritty, wonderful, maniac, long, pretty

ps. Team Jefenator won 12 1/2 - 11 1/2.  The match came down to the last hole of the last match, with one captain beating the other.

« Last Edit: July 25, 2009, 12:57:25 PM by Jim Colton »

Adam Clayman

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Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #1 on: July 20, 2009, 07:58:50 AM »
Jim. Without justifications the numbers are just numbers. Here's one to ask which will throw them for a loop. Which is their least favorite hole ? Ran asked me that and I felt like one of those kids in the new Ally commercials. Another fair question is favorite by par.
"It's unbelievable how much you don't know about the game you've been playing your whole life." - Mickey Mantle

Tim Bert

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Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #2 on: July 20, 2009, 08:14:36 AM »
I think I've decided that #7 is my favorite Ballyneal hole from 50 yards in but I am not certain it is my favorite hole.

A few more questions for the group...

Favorite 3 hole stretch

Favorite driving hole

Number of times they've seen John Mayhugh on a golf course this year

How many strokes will JT take at Pebble next year in the celebrity event?

And, of course, location of the most vibrant rainbow they've ever seen on a golf course!

Hope everyone is enjoying themselves!

Jim Colton

Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #3 on: July 20, 2009, 08:56:29 AM »
Jim. Without justifications the numbers are just numbers. Here's one to ask which will throw them for a loop. Which is their least favorite hole ? Ran asked me that and I felt like one of those kids in the new Ally commercials. Another fair question is favorite by par.

Adam,

  I agree with you to some extent, but I was really just going for initial gut reaction and trusted that the guys could make well-informed opinions without the need for full justification.  There's a diverse bunch of guys and enough sample size to at least start to see some significant trends.  I'm sure some here will disagree with the results, but I hope they also respond with their opinions on all the questions.

Adam Clayman

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Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #4 on: July 20, 2009, 10:13:43 AM »
To put things in perspective, here's a pic from the review section taken in May of '06.



Jim's pic above was taken July 18th 2009.

In '06 the region was just about to come out of a long term drought.(end of el'nino) In the month of June in '06 everyday was 105 degrees with convection oven winds. This June there was 9-10 inches of rain.(early la'nina) with less than a handful of days in the 90's.

The daily changes in wind and firmness is a great aspect of this golf course and can alter one's appreciation for all the holes.

I find myself thinking about the wind on the closers, the way they say the pros think about the 17th hole at Sawgrass.  Early and throughout the round. Either hoping it stays or shifts.

IMO,
#'s 1 and 2 introduce, then you fall in love because the prettiest hole is #3. #4 stuns with the scale of he region. While 5 and 6 tests our brains and greed. #8 is the sexiest but it's the 7, 8 sequence that makes it so.

 I'll stick to my initial impression of #9 as a sensory breather.

#10 can be the most satisfying to score well on.

#11 is the best par 3 and #'s 12 & 13 are what the entire place is all about. I have seen more great shots on 13 that any other hole.

14 has subtle mojo dependent on how the golfer approaches it, and the wind.

16 and 17 have serious symbiosis like the hip bone attached to the thigh bone.

The closer on it's topography eases one back to their respective realities from their adventure through the rolly polly Chop Dunes.

It's the entirety of the course that grabs souls. Dissecting the parts seems like asking which child you like better. But feel free to carry on, I make no judgement.









"It's unbelievable how much you don't know about the game you've been playing your whole life." - Mickey Mantle

Tom Huckaby

Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #5 on: July 20, 2009, 10:27:59 AM »
Mayhugh was at MPCC less a week ago, and now this.  Friends, the term America's Guest simply cannot do him justice.

Been about a year since I was at Ballyneal myself, but I'll take a stab at the questions....

Favorite Hole: 16
Favorite Hole, Back Nine (since no back nine holes made favorite overall): 16
Favorite, Front or Back Nine: Back
Hardest Hole: 17
Easiest Hole: 7
Best Green: 7
One word to describe Jim Colton: unknown (unfortunately)  ;D

Kalen Braley

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Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #6 on: July 20, 2009, 11:09:48 AM »
I'll take a stab at this.

Favorite Hole, Front 9: 7th hole although 8 was awesome too.
Favorite Hole, Back Nine: 13th...loved it!
Favorite, Front or Back Nine: Tough decision....but overall liked the front better.
Hardest Hole: 17 is a beast.
Easiest Hole:  Gotta go with #3.  A short par 3 to a mostly gathering green
Best Green:  Hole 7 hands down...just an awesome green complex with countless ways to play it.

Jim Franklin

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Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #7 on: July 20, 2009, 11:11:31 AM »
I'll take a stab at this.

Favorite Hole, Front 9: 7th hole although 8 was awesome too.
Favorite Hole, Back Nine: 13th...loved it!
Favorite, Front or Back Nine: Tough decision....but overall liked the front better.
Hardest Hole: 17 is a beast.
Easiest Hole:  Gotta go with #3.  A short par 3 to a mostly gathering green
Best Green:  Hole 7 hands down...just an awesome green complex with countless ways to play it.

+1, good choices Kalen.
Mr Hurricane

Scott Szabo

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Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2009, 11:47:22 AM »
Jim - easiest hole at Ballyneal #11?  Did somebody make a hole in one or something?

My two cents:

Favorite Hole, Front 9: #2  I love the downhill par-4, especially this one as it screams out for a shot bounced in from the right and funneling down to the hole. 
Favorite Hole, Back 9: #12
Favorite, Front or Back Nine:  I'll echo Kalen's statement - front nine by a hair.
Hardest Hole:  Initially I wanted to say #17, but I'll have to change and go with #6.  That green is simply a beast, and is what sets it apart from #17. 
Easiest Hole:  I'll say #3 as well, although I believe Hole #8 has played easiest for me in respect to par.
Best Green:  I'll be different and say #12.  #7 is cool, but it has received enough accolades already ;D
"So your man hit it into a fairway bunker, hit the wrong side of the green, and couldn't hit a hybrid off a sidehill lie to take advantage of his length? We apologize for testing him so thoroughly." - Tom Doak, 6/29/10

Bob Jenkins

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Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2009, 11:52:16 AM »

I have not seen Mr. Mayhugh since the KP in April but from the pic above, it looks as though he has gone on a regime of Fatburgers since KP.

CJ Carder

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Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2009, 12:09:48 PM »
This June there was 9-10 inches of rain.(early la'nina) with less than a handful of days in the 90's.

About half of that arrived about 20 minutes following our 42nd and final hole of the day, which never peaked above 83 degrees.   :)

Will Smith

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Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #11 on: July 20, 2009, 01:50:03 PM »
One of my favorite places.

Favorite Hole, front: 7, truly unique and a blast to play
Favorite Hole, Back Nine: 17, I love the tee shot and there a ton of fun shots around the green
Favorite, Front or Back Nine: Back
Hardest Hole: 6, far and away the toughest tee shot. Green is no pushover either
Easiest Hole: 3, wedge to a receptive bowl
Best Green: 4, (I floated it). No in reality,  I like the tenth green best. Not too over the top, but neat contours and pockets.

RJ_Daley

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Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #12 on: July 20, 2009, 02:11:51 PM »
From my personal perspective, this survey is not useful or possible in any definitive manner.  I can't even answer most of the questions for my home course that I would play many times a year, or for a course like Wild Horse that I may have played about 40-50 times now.  My answers would change at least season to season, or daily condition to condition, or just my mood for the day. 

I haven't played BallyNeal nearly enough (3X now) that I could answer most of these.

I'd just say, it is among the very best if not top 2-3 courses I've ever played in most all categories and regards.  And, I think it can only get better with time and smart management.

No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Mike Wagner

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Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #13 on: July 20, 2009, 02:55:57 PM »
Jim,

Do you even number the holes out there?  They're all awesome!  Hardest course to pick favorites...


Tim Pitner

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Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #14 on: July 20, 2009, 03:06:46 PM »
Jim. Without justifications the numbers are just numbers. Here's one to ask which will throw them for a loop. Which is their least favorite hole ? Ran asked me that and I felt like one of those kids in the new Ally commercials. Another fair question is favorite by par.

Least favorite hole:  

#9.  To me, it is the equivalent of Pacific Dunes #1, the least good hole on the course, but a fine hole.  

Favorite by par:  

3--#5
                      
4--really difficult to say, #1, #7, #10,#12, #14 and #18 are all contenders (and I'm leaving out some crackers)--I'll say #1

5--#16

That exercise really does show how many great holes are out there.  
« Last Edit: July 20, 2009, 03:08:18 PM by Tim Pitner »

Ben Sims

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Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #15 on: July 20, 2009, 03:52:28 PM »
I'm currently at Ballyneal with a mix of GCA and non-GCA guys, and I ran an informal poll during dinner.  I think the resultS might generate some interesting discussion here, so here it goes:

Favorite Hole: 7th Hole (7 votes); 8th & 4th (2 each); 2nd,3rd,5th (1 each)
Favorite Hole, Back Nine (since no back nine holes made favorite overall): 18th Hole (4 votes), 12th & 13th (2 each); every other back nine hole (1 each)
Favorite, Front or Back Nine: Front 12; Back Nine 2
Hardest Hole: 6th Hole (8 votes); 17th Hole (3); 16th (2); 13th (1)
Easiest Hole: 7th Hole (8 votes); 3rd Hole (2); 1st, 8th, 11th (1)
Best Green: 7th & 12th (5 votes each); 8th (4)
One word to describe Jim Colton: obsessive (2); generous (2), 54, scary, ego (my father-in-law), enthusiast, gritty, wonderful, maniac, long, pretty

You can bet your ass I'll chime in on this one!!

Favorite Hole : #14.  Best bunkered par 4 I've ever played, even without green side bunkering.  Fairway is an angry ocean.
Favorite back nine hole:  See above
Favorite front nine:  #7.  The green complex allows for a shot as fun as any in golf.  A putt up the front left to over your head high on the hill down to the back right pin.  I pissed myself when I pulled it off.
Favorite nine:  Front.  The routing and variety make me giggle.  Ballyneal is the Disneyland of golf courses in that respect.
Easiest Hole:  For me it was #5.  But that changes daily I'm sure. 
Best Green:  Tough not to vote for the triple punchbowl #12.  #8 is very good.  #7 is as well.  I love #15 too.
Jim Colton:  Generous.  Hook.

This kind of thread reaffirms for me the grandeur of the place.  It will age well.  It has good members.  It takes a great piece of land and expounds upon it in a way that compliments those receding glaciers all the while making many of us feel 8 years old.  It's not the best golf course I've ever played, but it is the most fun.  I really lean heavy on quirk, hole variety, and extremism of contour after seeing that course. 

And for those of you out there ready to jump me.  I would love it just as much if Rees Jones had built it.


Jim Colton

Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #16 on: July 20, 2009, 03:58:32 PM »
From my personal perspective, this survey is not useful or possible in any definitive manner.  I can't even answer most of the questions for my home course that I would play many times a year, or for a course like Wild Horse that I may have played about 40-50 times now.  My answers would change at least season to season, or daily condition to condition, or just my mood for the day. 

I haven't played BallyNeal nearly enough (3X now) that I could answer most of these.

I'd just say, it is among the very best if not top 2-3 courses I've ever played in most all categories and regards.  And, I think it can only get better with time and smart management.



Dick,

  From my personal perspective, the results were useful and informative for gauging a large group of guys and their gut reaction after 5-6 rounds, which is exactly how I prefaced it.  That doesn't mean that it wouldn't change after each and every visit. Today they played the 7th green all the way back, and it may have changed their opinion of it being the easiest hole out there.

Adam,

  I think I voted for the back nine.  Honestly, I don't remember because it's so close in my opinion.  I've found the back nine gets stronger and strong with each visit, while the front nine is memorable from the get go.  It's really just splitting hairs.

Tom Huckaby

Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #17 on: July 20, 2009, 04:12:47 PM »
Jim - I said 7 for easiest hole too.. luckily my two days there we got a front and a way back pin.  I just figured the pin isn't all the way back all that often.. to a front pin the hole is pretty simple.  To a back pin, whoo boy... easy is not the word I'd use!

So good call.  It's very tough to say.  Pin changes everything, as would wind.

I am wracking my brain for least favorite hole... jeez there are no bad ones, not even close.

I guess I found no great thrills on #1 from the up tee.  But from the back tee it is thrillus maximus.  But that's all I can think of.


Tim Bert

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Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #18 on: July 21, 2009, 09:08:54 AM »
America is dying to know...

Did Mayhugh win his singles match?

Brad Swanson

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Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #19 on: July 21, 2009, 11:27:07 AM »
America is dying to know...

Did Mayhugh win his singles match?

Yes!


Tim Bert

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Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #20 on: July 21, 2009, 01:27:21 PM »
That-a-boy John!

Jim Colton

Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll
« Reply #21 on: July 22, 2009, 09:18:18 PM »
I was too dejected from losing to ask any more questions, but I did sneak one last one in:

one word to describe Ballyneal: fun 2, fast, unique, amazing, special, serene, masterpiece

Jim Colton

Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll/July GCA Weekend Pics New
« Reply #22 on: July 25, 2009, 01:21:34 PM »
Here are some pics from the 'Nizzle, a good mix of GCA and non-GCA guys.  By all accounts, a smashing success except for the outcome.  The staff at BN really helped make it a memorable event.  Hopefully other GCA'ers that were there will add their pics to this thread.

Kyle Henderson and I were dumb enough to get caught in a hail storm on the 8th hole.


12th Green


I love the 13th Hole more and more everytime I play it


7th Hole


Not bad for a lefty...


Back hole location on the wild 7th


The par 5 8th


Kyle Henderson was nice enough to let Mayhugh win a point


Brad Swanson shaking hands with Wyatt Halliday, aka the Buzzsaw


Don't worry, I practice the 15-foot breaker at home all the time


Team Jefe is victorious


The dynamic duo Tang Brothers and me at the Ballyneal sign


From L-R, GCA'ers include: 1. Jim Tang, 2. Sean Heenan, 4. Kyle H., 5. Wyatt Halliday, 8. Jeff Tang, 9. Jim Colton, 12. Brad Swanson, 15. Kyle Krahenbuhl, 16. John Mayhugh

« Last Edit: July 26, 2009, 08:56:34 PM by Jim Colton »

George Pazin

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Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll/July GCA Weekend Pics
« Reply #23 on: July 25, 2009, 01:41:45 PM »
Thanks for the pix.
Big drivers and hot balls are the product of golf course design that rewards the hit one far then hit one high strategy.  Shinny showed everyone how to take care of this whole technology dilemma. - Pat Brockwell, 6/24/04

Adam Clayman

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Re: Ballyneal, An Informal Poll/July GCA Weekend Pics
« Reply #24 on: July 26, 2009, 12:20:10 AM »
Surely George, These pix have created the need for you to get out of your life for a few days?
 If I'm not mistaken there is a tee shirt emergency goin on. Ballyneal needs you. Not as badly as you need to golf here.

Gib Pap, That goes for you too. Just replace tee shirts for produce. Blues guitar is waiting for you in the Turtle bar. Bring the redhead. She'll bless the place.
"It's unbelievable how much you don't know about the game you've been playing your whole life." - Mickey Mantle