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Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: It's All Mackenzie's Fault
« Reply #50 on: May 18, 2009, 02:01:51 AM »
Sean, how many courses of MacKenzie's have you played in California?
David

I haven't played any courses in California.  However, I don't subscribe to the Muccian theory that one can know nothing about a course until he sees it. 

Dr Mac's period in California marks a significant departure in bunkering style from his other works around the world.  It would be interesting to know just what drove him to this style and I believe often times placement changes. Mark raises the idea of mimicing nature, but the question I would pose is why did he mess with nature so often to only then try and mimic it - especially around the the rear of greens?  We can see the eventual result of the bunkering becoming divorced from its natural surrounds and it probably wasn't avoidable without massive amounts of maintenance.  I have seen other evidence of Dr Mac's frilly style in the UK which were eventually filled in or altered.  Admitedly, his California take on this style has survived much better than in the UK, but the question of maintenance, which speaks directly to the function (despite Mark's high fallutin notion that Dr Mac was above these sorts of mundane considerations) of the bunkers, is still valid and most interesting. 

Ciao

Ciao

So what specifically is your issue with his bunkers, Sean? The look?

David

I don't mind the look of Dr Mac bunkers at all.  I rarely get uptight about bunker styles so long as they make sense from maintenance and weather perspectives.  What I don't like is loads of bunkers, especially those which act as road maps or framers and especially on land with good movement and elevation changes. 

 

So it's your opinion that MacK built too many bunkers? Or are you implying that his bunkers were laregly for framing purposes?
David

No, I don't think Dr Mac built largely framing bunkers at all.  I think he built some framing bunkers during his time California and that is one reason his bunkering there is very different from his courses in other parts of the world.  I am speculating that because Dr Mac had some time to actually hang around while the California courses were being built that type of bunker scheme is what he really had evolved into and by choice.  Furthermore, the style, which I think he always liked, fit wonderfully. 

To answer your first question, yes, I think Dr Mac got carried away in California and built too many bunkers. He seems to be unique among those early classic British archies with his love of sand.  Fowler and Park Jr never really got on that band wagon.  Colt loved his bunkers, but never came close to the flamboyant style, visual prominence, or quantity of Dr Mac.  I spose Muirfiled may be an exception at least with quantity, but I am not sure how much Simpson had to do with the bunkering there.  In any case, I find it very interesting that Dr Mac seemed to dramatically depart from his UK courses when he designed bunkering schemes in Oz and California.  I would like to know more about his time in the UK because I think the answers about differences in bunkering lie there.  It may be just a case of he wasn't "allowed" to do what he wanted.  I recall seeing old pix W-s-M and that trademark Dr Mac style was present, but in a more crude way than in California. 

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024:Winterfield, Alnmouth, Camden, Palmetto Bluff Crossroads Course, Colleton River Dye Course  & Old Barnwell

Mike Hendren

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: It's All Mackenzie's Fault
« Reply #51 on: May 19, 2009, 09:27:26 AM »
Mark,

Please forgive my "intellectual laziness." 

Instead of "bingo" I should have indeed posted "I agree."

Adam,

Thank you for your honesty - I was totally oblivious to the fact that I represent all that is wrong with GCA.com.

To you both, with apologies to Voltaire,  I have your printed your posts and have them in front of me.  Momentarily I will be seated in the smallest room of my house with them behind me.

Regards,

Bogey


Two Corinthians walk into a bar ....

Mike Hendren

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: It's All Mackenzie's Fault New
« Reply #52 on: May 19, 2009, 09:28:11 AM »
Inadvertant double-clutch.
« Last Edit: May 19, 2009, 10:02:22 AM by Michael_Hendren »
Two Corinthians walk into a bar ....

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