here's Tom's second post.....
"3) A December 1, 1910 NY Times article that states Barker is leaving to lay out some new courses. Of course, this ignores the fact that Barker left for the south every winter {where he would be assigned to a club, play winter tournaments, and was beginning to layout some courses}., and was playing in a tournament in Atlanta a few days later, and also is credited with laying out some courses in the south during that time. Mr. MacWood argues that because the train line to Atlanta ran through Philadelphia, Barker must have stopped at Ardmore for a day to route the course and move on."
Mike
This in the kind of disinformation you have been engaged in since this debate began - anything goes to preserve the Wilson legend. Barker came to the US in 1907 as the pro at GCGC. From 1907 to 1911 he never had a winter job in the south. In fact he never had a winter job period. The only time he had job in the south was when he was the pro at Roebuck in Birmingham, after resigning from Rumson (NJ), which was his position after GCGC. He was the pro at Roebuck between 1912 to 1914. His first documented trip to the south (beyond Richmond) was that trip to Atlanta December 1910, when he won the Southern Open. Where do you come up with this stuff?
While its very kind of you to share my theory I'd prefer to do it myself, briefly.
The newspapers report the new Merion project on November 14, 1910, it is said no expense would be spared and that the work would commence immediately. On November 24, 1910 it was reported in the Phila Press that Barker had been secured to layout the new course. On December 1, 1910 it was reported in the NY Times and NY Tribune Barker was leaving on a three week tour and that several new courses would be staked out (destinations unknown). He competed in the Southern Open in Atlanta between Dec. 8-10 (he won the championship). Based in Garden City he would have traveled through Philadelphia coming and going to Atlanta. On December 21, 1910 Cuyler writes his letter regarding the need to adjust the boundaries; he also mentions a golf course as if it existed (according to TEP). Wilson also mentioned a golf course in his letters to P&O beginning on 2/1/1911, his first known action for that committee. Obviously something prompted Cuyler to write his letter. I believe a golf course was staked in December, and Barker is the likely candidate. Wilson said the construction committee was formed early in 1911.
"Tom Macwood,
If your contention is that Wilson would never have been chosen by the Merion leaders because they were choosing the best in the business in each endeavor results in a conclusion that Barker must have done the routing and hole concepts, I have to ask...why was he around so little, if at all.
Is it honestly your contention that he got off a train from New York City to Atlanta for a day, two at the most, and this lack of attention was going to pass muster with the people that were only settling for the best?"
Jim
It is my contention that all signs point to Barker as the person who routed the course, which likely included his hole concepts. I believe his routing survived, but the hole concepts most likely did not, at least a good number did not.
Please disregard Mike's unending mantra about Barker being a one day wonder. He was a three day wonder. From what I've been able to piece together Barker normally spent about three days, give or take a day, routing and staking out a course. Mayfield was three days, CC of Atlantic City was three days, Myers Park was two days, CC of Virginia four days and Winnetka, in collaboration with HS Colt, three days. In 1910 this was not unusual. Who knows how long it took to produce and submit detailed plans. No doubt topo maps were useful before, during and after the site visit.
Pros like Barker and Ross were club pros, they could not spend unlimited time away. They often relied on others to carry out the construction. Experienced contractor like Johnson Contractors were a great assistance to many of them. Barker was quite fortunate with his construction supervisors, Mayfield was built by Bert Way, Winnetka by Donald Ross, Waverly by George Trumbull, Columbia by Walter Harban, East Lake and Druid Hills by George Adaire, Westhampton by Seth Raynor, Youngstown by John Morley, Merion by..... That is an all-star group.
We may look down on this method today, especially if judged against contemporary examples, but you can not argue with the results, at least in Barker's case. And history is full of similar examples: Mackenzie in Australia, Alison in Japan and Colt in N. America, some of the greatest courses in the world were the results of the wam-bam-thank-you-mam method.
TE
"Just because" is not a good answer IMO.
The 4/19/11 report IS nonsensical. At least the disjointed portion you've given to the general public, with its the bizarre shifting between first person, second person and third person, in the same sentence. The report was authored by Robert Lesley a trained journalist and former editor. There is something odd about your version, and I hope you're not up to your old shenanigans. Speaking of Lesley why do you constantly refer to it as the Wilson report? He is not mentioned it and did not write it.
P&O were very interested in golf architecture, and wrote numerous articles on the subject. A good portion of their Green Section Bulletin was devoted to GCA. In addition to Wilson P&O asked CBM and Walter Harban to contribute to their 1916 book, and both spoke of architecture. CBM's letter to Wilson mentions nothing about architecture either, only greenkeeping issues, surely he was interested in the subject.
Mike has suggested this thread be suspended, and I agree, this thread should be suspended until someone can come up with a reasonable explanation why Lloyd & Co would ask Wilson to design their course.