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Bryan Izatt

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Venetian Golf and River Club - a little known gem
« on: March 03, 2009, 11:50:48 AM »
Southern Florida is not blessed with a lot of really interesting courses, unless you're into water hazards and impenetrable palmetto bushes.  Venetian, designed by Chip Powell, and located near Venice, FL, certainly stands out for me.  Despite the fact that it's a WCI housing development course, it looks like Powell was given a pretty free hand to create an atypical FL course.

It looks like a lot of dirt was moved to create a lot of movement in the holes and internal movement in the greens, yet it all ties together and looks to fit into the surrounds naturally.  When first opened the focus was on the naming of the holes and their supposed homage to the ODG's of the golden age - Ross, Mackenzie, and Tillinghast.  I don't think the homage features are necessarily very close to the original namesakes, but they are nicely integrated into the design and are for the most part more dramatic than the originals.  So, you can find a valley of sin, Mackensian bunkers, Rossian greens, a dell green, a Biarritz, spectacle bunkers, a centreline bunker, a cape hole, driveable par 4's, and a so-called Elysian Field.  All are tied nicely into the overall design which features relatively wide corridors on most holes that provide options for playing the hole.  There are bunkerless greens and a lot of closely mown runoff areas around the green complexes to provide recovery options on missed greens.  And, the greens show variety in movement, some quite dramatic without being goofy.

On the second hole, a par 5, there is a huge crossing Mackenzian bunker that dictates the strategy on the second shot.



On the 4th, a good Rossian push up green.



On the 5th, a centreline bunker with heavy eyelashes that really provides multiple options for playing the hole.



On the 9th, a so-called valley of sin, which is unlike the original, but will really get your attention.  Distance control is everything.



And, on the 11th a man-sized Biarritz - the best I've seen personally.












 

Phil McDade

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Re: Venetian Golf and River Club - a little known gem
« Reply #1 on: March 03, 2009, 11:57:07 AM »
Bryan:

Chip Powell is one of those architects I'd never heard of until GCA; everytime I see something from him, I find something I like. Yet you don't hear much about him here. Have you played any of his other stuff? He seems to like big, contoured greens in particular.

Re. that centerline bunker...it looks really quite penal -- a sideways pitch-out? How avoidable is it in terms of forcing options? It seems like something you'd want to avoid at all costs -- perhaps too penal for a centerline feature?


Billsteele

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Re: Venetian Golf and River Club - a little known gem
« Reply #2 on: March 03, 2009, 12:05:17 PM »
Bryan-I played Venetian a couple of years ago, just after it opened. I really enjoyed it and when I get back to Florida would like to see more of Chip Powell's work. From what I remember, he has also done Duran (no relation to Lou D.) near Melbourne and Royal St. Cloud near Orlando. Has anyone played these? Venetian had pretty interesting green complexes and a decent routing for a residential development.

Bryan Izatt

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Venetian Golf and River Club - a little known gem
« Reply #3 on: March 03, 2009, 02:20:06 PM »
Phil,

Powell has done a lot of courses in that part of FL.  However, his web site seems to be gone, so I can't find an exhaustive list.  The only other that he's done, that I've played is Pelican Preserve, another WCI course near Ft. Myers.  It's a lot more muted than Venetian.

The centreline bunker is penal, although it is on a shortish par 4, so the second from it would be no more than 110 to 120 yards, so you'd be playing a short iron out of it in most cases.  You certainly don't want to be in the "eyelashes".  Fairway wood or long iron off the tee, left or right or short of the bunker would be the play.  Right provides the best angle at the green, but is the narrowest.

Steve_ Shaffer

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Re: Venetian Golf and River Club - a little known gem
« Reply #4 on: March 03, 2009, 09:14:24 PM »
Bryan

Thanks for the pics. I played Venetian shortly after it opened and have mentioned it many times on this board as a great place to play in the Sarasota to Ft. Myers corridor.


"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Adrian_Stiff

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Re: Venetian Golf and River Club - a little known gem
« Reply #5 on: March 04, 2009, 09:39:44 AM »
I think that course looks pretty horrible.
A combination of whats good for golf and good for turf.
The Players Club, Cumberwell Park, The Kendleshire, Oake Manor, Dainton Park, Forest Hills, Erlestoke, St Cleres.
www.theplayersgolfclub.com

Craig Sweet

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Re: Venetian Golf and River Club - a little known gem
« Reply #6 on: March 04, 2009, 10:05:12 AM »
Why "golf" and "river"?  Do they fish there? Do they have some whitewater rafting?
We are no longer a country of laws.

Bryan Izatt

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Venetian Golf and River Club - a little known gem
« Reply #7 on: March 04, 2009, 12:09:05 PM »
Steve,

Yeah, I had seen your previous posts on it.  Thought you might weigh in here.  The course and architect still don't seem to get much respect or attention, despite our attempts to raise awareness.

Adrian,

Why?  Have you been there?

Craig,

The WCI community has the Golf Club for golf and the "River Club" for social events.  The River Club is on the Myakka River (sort of).  Have no idea if it's a fishing spot.  I'm a golfer, not a fisher.  Whitewater rafting in south FL - not likely.   :o  There's a picture of canoeing on their web site.

Steve_ Shaffer

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Re: Venetian Golf and River Club - a little known gem
« Reply #8 on: March 04, 2009, 05:47:55 PM »
Take a tour of the course:

http://www.wcitours.com/wci_golf/venetian/index.html

It's one of the best "tribute" courses around.

"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Steve_ Shaffer

  • Karma: +0/-0
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Andy Hughes

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Venetian Golf and River Club - a little known gem
« Reply #10 on: September 02, 2010, 03:54:44 PM »
Steve,  Venice,FL received a huge amount of rain (more than 14 inches)  the week before the article was written--that might have something to do with the 'shrooms.
"Perhaps I'm incorrect..."--P. Mucci 6/7/2007