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Kevin_Reilly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #75 on: May 31, 2002, 01:54:28 PM »
I'm right with you on that one, Dan.  Different kind of date.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
"GOLF COURSES SHOULD BE ENJOYED RATHER THAN RATED" - Tom Watson

A_Clay_Man

Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #76 on: May 31, 2002, 02:02:52 PM »
What if the member bought the case of Opus 1 at a garage sale for $20.00?


True story
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

A_Clay_Man

Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #77 on: May 31, 2002, 02:03:46 PM »
oh yeah.

It was a 1981

OUCH
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

Gib_Papazian

Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #78 on: May 31, 2002, 02:13:43 PM »
Dan,
Those "other transactions" used to happen all the time in bygone eras. I know of one famous club that once kept a stable of kittens for the members.

That brings up an interesting point though. There is a rather tony club in the South Bay with oppulent cabanas for the members and their guests. Evidently, they have become a revolving door for the extra-cirricular activities of some of the married Silicon Valley executives.

We will not make any moral judgements at Papazian Hills, but this is a golf club and enclave, not a place to stash a bunch of bimbos, tramps and ding-a-lings. Therefore, The Club Secretary will be instructed to have a word with any member unclear on the purpose of our rooms.

Adam,
That is like buying a George Low Wizard at a garage sale for $5. In that case, it makes such a good story that we will let it slide.  
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

Dan Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #79 on: May 31, 2002, 02:23:46 PM »
Gib --

"Not a place to stash a bunch of bimbos, tramps and ding-a-lings."

Fine. Not my style, anyway.

But "no moral judgments"?

Now you've gone WAY too far!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

Rick Shefchik

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #80 on: May 31, 2002, 02:54:28 PM »
Gib -- That's the way my son gets paid when he caddies at White Bear Yacht Club in the Twin Cities. Needless to say, he thinks it's a fine system.

One thing about the caddies at Papazian Hills -- someone mentioned earlier that once a year, the caddies would be  allowed to vote a member (or was it three?) out of the club. I thought that was a wonderful suggestion -- one of the best on this thread -- but on further reflection I think it should be tempered somewhat. There will be an annual vote among the caddies, but it will be tallied like baseball's Hall of Fame voting: a member needs a certain percentage of the vote -- say 50 percent -- to be expelled.

If this is the kind of club we envision it to be, none of the members will be the type who will mistreat caddies, so there would likely be no need to expell someone every year.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
"Golf is 20 percent mechanics and technique. The other 80 percent is philosophy, humor, tragedy, romance, melodrama, companionship, camaraderie, cussedness and conversation." - Grantland Rice

Gib_Papazian

Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #81 on: May 31, 2002, 02:57:54 PM »
Dan,

Okay okay . . . . we have already made plenty of moral judgements already.

I just had visions of some half-dressed floozy traipsing in from one of the bedrooms to refill her martini glass during the Masters telecast.

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:05 PM by -1 »

Gib_Papazian

Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #82 on: May 31, 2002, 03:18:58 PM »
Rick,

The genesis for that idea came from a piece Michael M. Thomas wrote a few years back in Golf Digest entitled "How to Save Your Club." It is the best article I have ever read in a golf magazine and it would be a perfect "In My Opinion Piece" for this website.

The gist of it was that the employees could band together and vote out a member every year. A wonderful thought for P-Hills - but our Club Secretary will deal harshly with members who consistently abuse the employees.

There is a woman I played with last year at one of the nations most prestigious clubs. The day before my friend (also a poster but I don't want to give anything away) and I play unaccompanied with a terrific caddy.

We mentioned that through a scheduling quirk, we were going to play the next day with a member and would he caddy for us? He said he would love to (we are good tippers besides) and asked who we were playing with.

I gave him the name (somebody I had never met) of the member and he told us he was sorry, but as much as he liked us, he was not going "put up with that f*cking bitch for eighteen holes."

We thought that was a bit strange, but chalked it up to a bad incident from the past or a misunderstanding.

Well, the next day, this looney woman shows up, rustles up some caddies and off we went.

No sooner were we in the fairway on the first hole and she is SCREAMING  and BERATING this one caddy because he could not find one of the balls in the weeds.

And she kept it up, nearly putting this poor boy (maybe 15 or 16 years old) in tears. Finally, after the 7th hole, I took her aside and sort of gently told her that because I was a young caddy once that "maybe we can switch and I'll teach him a few things."

It was just to get this poor kid away from this crazy woman and give her a way to save face. This kid tried soooooo hard and was literally shell-shocked.  

"Absolutely not," she snapped, "you are my guest and as a member it is my responsibility to teach this caddy the right way to do his job."

She never let up for 18 holes on this boy and I found out later that none of the more experienced caddies would even pack if she was in the group.

So, this kid gets thrown to the wolf  because nobody else will do it and from what I understand, this kind of behavior is nothing unusual for her. . . . nobody has ever had the guts to straighten her out.

She has been a member her entire life (trust fund baby) and evidently has been abusing caddies for years and years.

The funny thing is that she treated us so well and could not have been more gracious. . . . . but if I was that kid,  I would have shoved those clubs right in her bottom and walked off  the course after the first hole.

The point is, she would have been voted out years ago and the club would be far better off.

I am actually frightened of what may happen if she came to Olympic.              


P.S. At one point, I thought of the "How to Save Your Club" piece (expressing my admiration for his work) when we were playing and asked her if she knew the author - he is quite prominent in their neck of the woods.

It turns out she knows him well and absolutely hates his guts -something about him being "nasty to people." It makes me want to meet him all the more.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:05 PM by -1 »

JakaB

Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #83 on: May 31, 2002, 03:35:34 PM »
Gib or any other witted Armenian,

I have heard the miserable member story before...do you have any terrible caddie stories to share?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

Bill Wright

Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #84 on: May 31, 2002, 09:26:37 PM »
Any club I'm affiliated with wouldn't admit any person who names or allows someone else to name a golf club after himself or herself.  Humility's a good thing.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

Gib_Papazian

Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #85 on: May 31, 2002, 09:59:05 PM »
You know Bill, it is kind of funny but I had that exact thought yesterday . . . . . there is zero chance I would ever name a golf course after myself.

Plus, let's face it, Papazian is a clumsy and difficult to pronounce name for a golf club. I think it just sort of evolved as a "working moniker" for this entity.

I hereby change the name to Redan Hills GC - not Country Club, Golf Club.

That way, if Huntley thinks you are okay and the brim of your hat is facing the correct direction on the golf course, you can be a member too.

You might think about registering though. It is tough to amass many stars on GCA if you are only a "Guest."
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:06 PM by -1 »

TEPaul

Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #86 on: June 01, 2002, 01:29:33 AM »
GibP:

Every golf club needs a simple and effective way of checking out member candidates.

I would vote for the one who doesn't say a word nor changes expression one iota when that half dressed floozy traipses in fills her martini glass and traipses back out during Masters telecast.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

Brian_Gracely

Re:You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #87 on: January 07, 2005, 12:34:45 PM »
(bump)

One of my favorite GCA threads.  

I'd love to see a discussion like this include some folks that have a clue about what it would take to actually build this club, assuming some different parts of the coutnry (or world).  What are the list of issues (aside from where the Redan should be placed) that Gib would have needed to consider.

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #88 on: January 07, 2005, 06:57:24 PM »
Interesting thread.  At the risk of being a crusty old bastard...

Course must be playable 12 months a year, lovely and varied.  This excludes cold climates boys!  Course and clubhouse must have stunning view.

There is no pro or proshop.  Basic products can be bought in the secretary's office.  The secretary will determine what is basic. 

There is full catering (the caterer lives on the property), but it is rather basic during the week.  Friday and Saturday the menu is more varied.  There is a Sunday lunch every Sunday to coincide with a Sunday Throwup.  The time changes with the season.  Of course, if you would like something special on anyday (except for Sunday), then request it (perhaps 36 hours in advance) and it can happen.

The club does have a captain who is elected by the membership.  The club is basically run by the captain, secretary and green keeper. 

There are no tee times except for comps.  There is at least one comp. a month.  It is mandatory to play at least four comps for handicapping purposes.  For every comp. short of the minimum there is a required 2 shot cut in handicap.

Clubhouse is comfortable and classy, yet understated.  Plenty of wood and leather-cigars welcome in the smoking/card  room.  There is a bar.  There are no waitresses for drink, unless you are eating.  There are drinking (perhaps a fridge or BYO and card playing facilities in the locker room.  There are also 12 twin rooms for overnight stay.

Membership is not based on ability, but 18 handicap is the max.  Once a member, your handicap can go higher than 18 without fear of dismissal.  Once a player has played as a guest for at least 12 games spanning no more than two years, then their name can be put forward for membership to be voted on at the annual AGM (secret ballot of course) during the same time as the Captain Drive In (an important comp.). 

Membership is restricted to 500 full members, 75 country members and 25 overseas members.  Country members must live at least 100 miles from the club.  There are no annual dues.  The total bill for the year is simply divided and paid.  Country members pay 50% and overseas members pay 25% of the full members' bill.  Members' children are allowed to play (both sexes) for free until the age 16.  At this point they must be voted in at an AGM (though they can re-apply for membership at later AGMs).  For the girls, well it's time to find another club to join.  The price for this intermediate category (age 16-21) is the same as overseas fees. There is no restriction on the number of intermediate members.  At the age of 21, intermediate members become full members if they wish and there is space available.  A wait list will be kept and they have first priority of membership at each AGM.

There are probably a few more things, but it is difficult to think of them in one go.

Ciao
« Last Edit: May 02, 2017, 06:28:46 PM by Sean_A »
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Zack Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #89 on: January 07, 2005, 08:34:50 PM »
What a great idea I wish I could build my own course, here goes my plans,
Very simple private golf only, of course, small shop, with good size locker room and simple grill.  Without a question no women men only.  Getting in would be simple just display your love and desire for the game and be able to break 90.  Would be somewhere that could be open all year.  No carts, caddies only. Greens super would be the the key decision maker on the golf course decisions no committees.  Absolutely no outside play unless sponsored by member.  Membership is maxed out at 250.  I would have 3 levels of membership, local, national, and jr national.  Just a little of what I would have.
Fairways & Greens
Zack Quinn Kelly

BCowan

Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #90 on: May 02, 2014, 09:14:43 AM »
Singapore Golf Club

1. 500-700 individual members (all with voting rights) I make the final decision  

2. Caddies and trolley's welcomed.  $10 cart fees for 65 and older/truly handicapped people.

3. $1800 a year dues, no progressive brackets, everyone votes.  $500 for each kid, no pool, no racquets.  No food min.

4.  all employees have access at the discretion of the pro(s).  off the clock.

5.  Mondays is open to the public after 10AM, members have to pay on Monday if they want to play.  They get course other 6 days.

6.  If caddies/employees deem you to be slow you lose your playing privileges!
6b. If you play the front 9 in over 2 hours you will be caned on the 10th tee!

7.  Very small locker rooms.  Changing shoes in parking lot is okay, shirt is not!  Mixed grill, no dinning room, single story clubhouse.  

8.  Pro is allowed to teach outside the club at the club, he actually makes his income teaching (wow how old school is that)!

9.  there will be a mandatory member maint program where people will have to get their hands dirty, trimming trees, additional drainage, exc.

10.  No hats allowed in clubhouse and no jeans.  People that prescribe to the ME generation will not be welcomed.

some amendments
« Last Edit: May 28, 2014, 09:42:02 AM by BCowan »

Michael Felton

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #91 on: May 02, 2014, 01:52:36 PM »
Wonderful stuff. Some of my thoughts:

I would have an awesome short game practice facility near the clubhouse and the first tee. I would also have a vast long game facility including two wide open nice and easy holes that people could play to warm up. There would be no tee times, so people who elected to play those two holes would be treated as having a place on the first tee as if they had not.

It would be basically private, but visitor play would be permitted and there would be a minimal green fee for that. In order to be allowed to play they would have to write a letter explaining why they should be permitted to play the course. If I like what they say, then they get on. Weekdays only though.

I like a lot of what Gib had to say throughout, so some of this is inspired by what he had to say.

I would have free booze in the bar. No one pays for anything. The only requirement is that you have to drink whatever you get on the premises and anyone doing anything stupid would be held responsible for it whether drunk or not. Members would be expected to replenish stocks out of their own pocket if they brought guests.

In the bar I would have some holes cut into the carpet/ground and have a selection of putters out there. That way people who ended up with their matches halved could have a putt off in the bar while they have a drink. I would also have some ultra high end premium liquor (Louis XIII or similar) and have a game for members to play. In order to play, they would have to stick $20 in the staff Christmas fund and then they get a putt of let's say 3 feet. If they make it, they get a shot of the Louis XIII. If they miss, they have to provide a bottle to the club to keep the game afloat. I think if someone missed and provided the bottle, then they would be permitted to have a drink of it any time they came in until the current bottle has run out.

The chairs in the bar would be plush leather ones that you need help to get out of. Anyone who has sat in the chairs in the bar at Royal St Georges next to the model of the 6th hole will know what I mean. I will have to think about whether I require jackets in the bar. I'm actually quite tempted.

The membership would be fairly small. I'm thinking around 200 people. I would want them to be local. I would want them to be there regularly so that everyone would know everyone and we'd have roll ups on weekend mornings with groups selected at random.

I'd have 36 holes. 18 done by Tom Doak and the other 18 by Coore and Crenshaw. Obviously the land would be so spectacular that they'd have to say yes. Then they'd get really, really fed up with me telling them what I wanted...

Above all, I would want the courses to fit the landscape and look natural.

Matthew Lloyd

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #92 on: May 02, 2014, 04:54:24 PM »
This is the first I've seen of this thread - glad to see it's been resurfaced though as it's my favorite one thus far.  If I could create my own club I'd follow these guidelines:

(1) Semi-private
(2) 36 holes, with the option to keep one private access only per day
(3) Remote location to inherently prevent public crowds from taking over
(4) 300-400 members, about half local, half national
(5) no pool or other country club type amenities - golf only
(6) no initiation fee (to encourage younger, cash-poor golfers that will sustain the club 25+ years from now)
(7) annual dues of less than $3K (see previous comment about young cash-poor golfers)
(8) walking only - carts optional
(9) cabins on site for lodging
(10) small clubhouse (modeled after Belvedere in Charlevoix, MI)


Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #93 on: May 02, 2014, 06:00:55 PM »
Those that make my target score in one of the following GRE tests

    Biochemistry, Cell and Molecular Biology
    Biology
    Chemistry
    Mathematics
    Physics
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Jud_T

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #94 on: May 02, 2014, 06:32:26 PM »
Anybody who whines about not having all the fees posted online doesn't get in...

Anybody who inquires about our Golf Digest Ranking doesn't get in...

Anyone who asks where the bag boy is at the bag drop doesn't get in....

Anyone who insists on putting out after being given a putt in a match to see what their "real" medal score is doesn't get in...

Anyone who plays tees over 6500 yards and can't break 90 doesn't get in...

Anyone who sandbags doesn't get in...

Anyone who doesn't play ready golf doesn't get in...

Anyone who can't finish in at least 4 hours doesn't get in.

Anyone who doesn't let faster groups through doesn't get in...

Anyone who asks for a light beer doesn't get in...

Anyone who's a fan of ice dancing, rhythm gymnastics or figure skating doesn't get in...

Anyone who wears more than 2 different logos doesn't get in...

Anyone who's a fan of Dancing with the Stars doesn't get in...

Anyone who's never heard of Charlie Parker, Samuel Beckett or the Velvet Underground doesn't get in...

Anyone who complains about the music, food or drink in the clubhouse doesn't get in...

Anyone who can't put their cell phone away for more than 15 minutes doesn't get in...

Anyone who treats anyone, including the staff, like second class citizens doesn't get in...

Anyone I don't like doesn't get in...
Golf is a game. We play it. Somewhere along the way we took the fun out of it and charged a premium to be punished.- - Ron Sirak

Joe_Tucholski

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #95 on: May 02, 2014, 06:54:23 PM »
Honestly if I was starting my own club it wouldn't be much of a club.  Gib indicated that finances weren't an issue.  If that were the case I would have my own golf course.  Trying to maintain rules and manage people sounds like work and as much as I enjoy golf I don't want it to turn into work.  I wouldn't have a clubhouse, a bar or employees (maybe a single employee to maintain the course).  I imagine it would be scruffy.  Even though costs aren't an issue I would prefer it scruffy, one so I wouldn't feel wasteful and two to keep it from attaining status as a must play where it would become a hassle dealing with large number of people seeking access.  Something kind of like sheep ranch but bigger and next to my house.

Greg Tallman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #96 on: May 02, 2014, 06:57:37 PM »
Anybody who whines about not having all the fees posted online doesn't get in...

Anybody who inquires about our Golf Digest Ranking doesn't get in...

Anyone who asks where the bag boy is at the bag drop doesn't get in....

Anyone who insists on putting out after being given a putt in a match to see what their "real" medal score is doesn't get in...

Anyone who plays tees over 6500 yards and can't break 90 doesn't get in...

Anyone who sandbags doesn't get in...

Anyone who doesn't play ready golf doesn't get in...

Anyone who can't finish in at least 4 hours doesn't get in.

Anyone who doesn't let faster groups through doesn't get in...

Anyone who asks for a light beer doesn't get in...

Anyone who's a fan of ice dancing, rhythm gymnastics or figure skating doesn't get in...

Anyone who wears more than 2 different logos doesn't get in...

Anyone who's a fan of Dancing with the Stars doesn't get in...

Anyone who's never heard of Charlie Parker, Samuel Beckett or the Velvet Underground doesn't get in...

Anyone who complains about the music, food or drink in the clubhouse doesn't get in...

Anyone who can't put their cell phone away for more than 15 minutes doesn't get in...

Anyone who treats anyone, including the staff, like second class citizens doesn't get in...

Anyone I don't like doesn't get in...


Damn, so close

Nigel Islam

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #97 on: May 02, 2014, 07:12:33 PM »
Anybody who whines about not having all the fees posted online doesn't get in...

Anybody who inquires about our Golf Digest Ranking doesn't get in...

Anyone who asks where the bag boy is at the bag drop doesn't get in....

Anyone who insists on putting out after being given a putt in a match to see what their "real" medal score is doesn't get in...

Anyone who plays tees over 6500 yards and can't break 90 doesn't get in...

Anyone who sandbags doesn't get in...

Anyone who doesn't play ready golf doesn't get in...

Anyone who can't finish in at least 4 hours doesn't get in.

Anyone who doesn't let faster groups through doesn't get in...

Anyone who asks for a light beer doesn't get in...

Anyone who's a fan of ice dancing, rhythm gymnastics or figure skating doesn't get in...

Anyone who wears more than 2 different logos doesn't get in...

Anyone who's a fan of Dancing with the Stars doesn't get in...

Anyone who's never heard of Charlie Parker, Samuel Beckett or the Velvet Underground doesn't get in...

Anyone who complains about the music, food or drink in the clubhouse doesn't get in...

Anyone who can't put their cell phone away for more than 15 minutes doesn't get in...

Anyone who treats anyone, including the staff, like second class citizens doesn't get in...

Anyone I don't like doesn't get in...


Damn, so close

I was too until I got to Charlie Parker. Time to get on Wikipedia on my phone for at least 15 minutes

Paul Gray

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #98 on: May 02, 2014, 07:15:14 PM »
Jud,

At the risk of breaching the unwritten rule regarding invitations, please, please let me join your golf club.

And BCowan,

Welcome to a British golf club.
In the places where golf cuts through pretension and elitism, it thrives and will continue to thrive because the simple virtues of the game and its attendant culture are allowed to be most apparent. - Tim Gavrich

Mike Sweeney

Re: You have started your own club - who gets in?
« Reply #99 on: May 03, 2014, 07:19:06 AM »
Rob Curtiss

Took his lumps like a man on another thread and it turned into a Top 100 invitation. Genius!