New Year A to Z

[Alfonso Erhardt]

Mark,

Here you go:

Real Golf de Pedreña (www.realgolfpedrena.com). The holes on the left that TD mentions are Colt's 18 original ones, while the ones close to the water are Seve's 9.

I haven't been to Oporto either, but it does look as something worth the visit.

Regards,

Alfonso

[Tom_Doak]

Alfonso:

Thanks for identifying Pedrena and Oporto.

I have yet to see a golf course in Spain or Portugal, but now I have some worthy candidates.  Valderrama has never seemed interesting to me.

[Charlie Goerges]

I have no idea where or what any of the courses is. But the one that looks most interesting to me is number 3. It is the only photo that belies any ground contour, and so looks like fun to play. I am sure others have interesting contour, I just can't discern it.

Edit: 8 shows some contour as well, so it also gets a nod.

[Alfonso Erhardt]

Tom,

I don't like Valderrama that much from an architectural point. Conditioning is fantastic (although was better some years ago...)

A worthy trip includes playing Pedreña, Neguri - by Arana - and the courses in Southwest France: Chiberta (Simpson), Hossegor (Colt-Morrison), Biarritz (Dunn). All close by. An incredible combination of good food and golf.

Regards,

[Mark_Rowlinson]

Charlie, Course No 3 has had some enthusiastic reviews on GCA, but few of us have been there.

[Tom_Doak]

Alfonso:

Since it sounds like you have played Biarritz, you can help us put a question to rest.

The last time we were all together in Bandon, an old friend of mine insisted that he had been to Biarritz and that the "Biarritz" hole which was the inspiration for Macdonald's still existed.

This contradicts everything I've heard and read.  I even went to Google Earth and checked the courses in Biarritz and found where I thought the hole might have BEEN, but I didn't see a hole that could really be it.  But, I have never been there, and you have.

So -- is there a par-3 hole today in Biarritz with a huge green divided by a swale?

[Tom Naccarato]

Tom, the hole exists--under a lot of houses! (One of our European bretheren posted images of the area sometime back.)

From research, the green wasn't as it appears to most today. It was a rather large carry over the crevasse to a green and approach that was more of a larger false front that took a slight dip and then went into green. Trying to explain the strategy in more detail and in less words would be, is that the false front--getting the ball over the false front--to the green was the challenge in addition to the challenge of the carry.

I hope that makes sense....

[Alfonso Erhardt]

Tom,

The hole does not exist, neither the suspected original over the cliff neither a similar version to Macdonald's Biarritz.

Your friend must be thinking of the 17th which has a very large green with a double plateau, but definitely not a swale. This hole is also bunkered in the front and not on the sides.

Regards,

[Tom Dunne]

Tommy N., so are you saying the front section of the Biarritz green wasn't used for hole locations?

[Tom Naccarato]

Tom, I don't have definitive proof of that, but from only what I've come across, pertaining to the original. I'm hoping Tom will give his insight on this.

As far as the New year A to Z, I didn't really look at all of them, and #12 is so painfully obvious, I'm amazed some of you didn't get it, especially you Tom Doak!

Why that's Österåker, which is just right outside Stockholm!

(I'll come clean on that find later! )

[John Kirk]

Funny that this thread hasn't got more comment.  My guess is that most people on the DG are so completely stumped on most of the courses pictured, that they don't want to comment and reveal how little they know.

No, no.  Proud to say I haven't a clue, but willing to learn.

I now realize I have wasted the coveted 35th response.

[Neil_Crafter]

No 7 is Barwon Heads GC west of Melbourne, certainly linksy. My partner Paul Mogford and I are the consulting architects to the club which has been most enjoyable. We just finished remodelling their 9 hole par 3 course, a total new layout actually.

Nice find Mark!

[Tommy Williamsen]

Mark, you need some more singing dates.  I have never been good at recognizing things from the air.  You could show Four Streams and I wouldn't recognize it.

[Tom_Doak]

Crap!  I should have recognized Barwon Heads.  When I looked at the photo, the houses along the dune between the back nine and the sea reminded me of the dune that hides the sea from St. Andrews Beach ... but I didn't think about what other courses in Australia would have similar housing.

[Grant Saunders]

Bump.  Hard test.  On #10, the course is really spread out.  It looks to me the player walks at least a mile away from the water.

No 10 is Formosa Country Club in Auckland New Zealand.

I spent 3 1/2 years working at this Sir Bob Charles designed golf course. It is built on a piece of land approx 190 hectares (470 acres) which certainly generates some maintenance headaches.

This course will fair chew you up and spit you out if you dont have your A game. This along with Gulf Harbour was one of the first courses built in a very long time in NZ and they tried some things but never really pulled it off. It was however the start of a new era in NZ where a lot of courses have been forced to lift their game.

I have a complete set of pics I took when I was there and will post them if anyone is interested.

Grant

[Mark_Rowlinson]

The bubble had to burst and it took one Tom Naccarato to point it out. He is quite right to identify the Swedish golf course as Osterakers. I had meant to post Ullna. Maxima mea culpa! Many apologies.

[Ben Stephens]

No. 5 is Tuckers Point - you can see one of the holes at Mid Ocean next door on bottom right of the picture and the roof of the buildings were a giveaway as they are white roofed buildings all over Bermuda!

No. 16 is Queenswood in Surrey an ultra exclusive course designed by David McLay Kidd - Darren Clarke is a member here
 

[Tom_Doak]

Tommy:  I'm dying to know why I should have known Osteraker.  (You can explain how to do the accent marks, too, if you want.)  I actually would have known Ullna.  Should've known Queenwood, too, as I have been on the course.

[Bradley Anderson]

Aside from the fact that this is a great great collection of golf courses, I am particularly interested how they all have different colors. I wonder Mark, if you could comment on if the greener ones are on clay soils, and the browner ones are more on sandy soils?

[James Boon]

Following on from Tom Doak’s suggestion that we look at these to see which is most interesting before they are identified:

3. Looks an interesting links with a routing that brings different wind directions into play, so probably a tough course?
7. Dunes/bunkers in bottom right look interesting
8. Looks a fun 9 hole links
14. Doesn’t appeal at all…
15. Another links that could be interesting. Narrow fairways suggest holes routed through the dunes perhaps?
16. Before Ben identified it I was thinking that there was some architectural interest here but that I generally didn’t like the look of the place perhaps because it all looks a bit new?
19. Hints at being a heathland course but looks as if bottom left 9 holes where original with the other 9 and relief 9 added later?
20. Looks like its out in the open, perhaps on moorland or on a high plateau. Old fashioned golf?
22. Though by the sea with some links characteristics, didn’t look that exciting though?
From the aerials I would say if I had to choose one for a round it would be 8 or 15.

Looking through these for ID purposes I was getting a bit lost so here is a quick recap…

1.   Mark Rowlinson Clue (MRC), could be last letter of alphabet?
2.   
3.   MRC Enthuesistic reviews on GCA, but few have been there?
4.   
5.   Tuckers Point, Bermuda
6.   
7.   Barwon Head, Australia
8.   Domsburghe, Netherlands
9.   Real Golf de Pedrena, Spain
10.   Formosa, New Zealand
11.   La Dehesa, Chile
12.   Osteraker, Sweden (Should have been Ullna for alphabetical purposes)
13.   
14.   MRC “Greatest players paid a lot to play here” and “Not in Asia”?
15.   
16.   Queenswood, England
17.   
18.   
19.   
20.   
21.   
22.   Oporto, Portugal
23.   Askernish, Scotland
24.   
25.   
26.   MRC This one replaces ‘X’ as a wildcard doubled up letter?

A few additional personal observations I thought may help as I’d somehow managed to miss the text on no. 11 till Tom Dunne pointed it out!? 4 could be Italian, just has that look about it? 6 with the pines could be Swiss or Austrian? 14 has interesting field patterns to the right? 19 has a new course being built next to it? 26 has an airport to the top?

Cheers,

James

[Rob Rigg]

Grant,

I would be interested in seeing some pics of Formosa if you do not mind - maybe if you could put them on a new threa that would be great?

470 acres - wow - it does looks incredibly spread out from the overhead and immensely challenging.

[James Boon]

I had a a bit of an idea that 20 could be in Wales as England and Scotland had been taken... Turns out its West Monmouthshire GC, the highest golf club in Great Britain.

Cheers,

James

[Bill_McBride]

No. 5 is Tuckers Point - you can see one of the holes at Mid Ocean next door on bottom right of the picture and the roof of the buildings were a giveaway as they are white roofed buildings all over Bermuda!

No. 16 is Queenswood in Surrey an ultra exclusive course designed by David McLay Kidd - Darren Clarke is a member here
 

Is Tuckers Point a new course or the renamed hotel course?

Those white roofs are very cool, all have channels created by the tiles that funnel rain water into cisterns.

[Mark_Rowlinson]

You've put up a good fight so far, so here are a few hints:

1. Last letter of the alphabet - look up the last courses in a few handbooks/directories.
2. Decadence in a utilitarian society.
3. Tom Doak's right - it is a links. But where is it that so few of us have been there?
4. Same continent - get 3 and work north - rather a long way.
5. Tucker's Point (formerly Castle Harbour) (Bermuda).
6. Carries the name of a major North American city.
7. Barwon Heads (Australia).
8. Domurgsche (Netherlands).
9. Real Pedrena (Spain)
10. Formosa (New Zealand)
11. La Dehesa (Chile)
12. Should have been Ullna (Sweden)
13. Two courses - one apparently in the British links style, the other apparently in an American style. Has a greenkeeping deal with ANGC - apparently.
14. When I say best paid, I include (particularly) Tiger.
15. Right next door to a world-famous links with the same surname, as it were.
16. Queenwood (England).
17. The initial we need for the 'alphabet' is of no use. Try to identify the type of countryside - it is (from the air) remarkably similar to a number of other courses in and around a major city.
18. I don't think we've got this yet - did Tom Doak get it earlier and was too modest to say so. Another of those places/continents that few of us go to - good golf is too far apart.
19. European heathland close to the shore.
20. West Monmouthshire (Wales) - highest golf course in UK - mountain golf, but doesn't it look like links!
21. A hard one - there are more golf courses to choose from in this coun try than any other - and you have to know what letter you are looking for.
22. Oporto (Portugal)
23. Askernish (Scotland)
24. There won't be any litter in this country.
25. A nightmare for early editions of World Atlas of Golf - they changed the nines for club play and competition play, rather like K-Club.
26. The airport in the top of the picture is no longer the city's main airport. When I was there they were using this particular airport for police and military training for a forthcoming Olympic Games. There was a rather sad looking 747 being blown to pieces with explosives and troops running into it while i tried to concentrate on 5-irons and putts.

[Tom_Doak]

Mark:  I did get #18, but didn't disclose my answer ... I went to Google Earth to confirm my guess.  It's Gavea G&CC in Rio de Janeiro, Brazil.

I should have gotten #3 as well ... that's Humewood, in Port Elizabeth, South Africa.  But I don't know the north half of Africa very well, so I don't know #4.

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