Par

[Ian_L]

Is par good or bad for the game?  Sometimes I think too much is made of whether a hole is a short par-5 or a long par-4.  Does it really matter?  It doesn't change the strategy of the hole. 

Many courses are shortening their holes for tournaments by turning par 5's into par 4's.  Doesn't this seem like a terribly way to combat length?

[Sean Leary]

Psychologically, it matters.

[Ian_L]

But does that mean an architect should design a 480-yard par-4 differently from a 480-yard par-5?

[John Moore II]

But does that mean an architect should design a 480-yard par-4 differently from a 480-yard par-5?

While I know that Tom Doak will disagree with me here (he has before), I would say that you might, in some cases, design them differently. A 480 par 4 might be designed with a semi-flat green (not terribly severe) and a reasonably open front. This is due to the fact that everyone is going to be approaching with a longish iron or even a fairway wood. But a 480 par 5 could be designed with a tighter entrance into the green, requiring more thought and shot shape for something trying to reach in two, and a more interesting green complex.

But the par 5 green and surround would not need to be designed to be terribly more difficult than a par 4 of the same length, with an impossible to hold green with no chance of run-up or something. Otherwise, no one would bother going for the par 5 in two, making it a silly, driver-wedge-wedge hole with very little interest. But they would be designed a little bit differently with the par 5 green being likely a bit less accessible for the long iron shots.

[Charlie Goerges]

Ian and John, the 480 par 4/5 question really got me thinking (bad idea). Let's take it a step further, if you had a piece of land that would exactly accommodate a 480-yard hole, how would you decide whether to put a par 4 or 5 there (or assuming you wouldn't design them differently, how would you decide whether to label it a 4 or 5)?

The more I think about Par as a concept, the more confused I get. What if baseball had par? Just an arbitrary number that made people take unnecessary risks just to beat it, possibly at the expense of winning the game. On the other hand, par sometimes tells you more about how you should play the hole than the yardage does. Maybe we should forget about labeling a hole with yardage and just label it with par.

[John Moore II]

Ian and John, the 480 par 4/5 question really got me thinking (bad idea). Let's take it a step further, if you had a piece of land that would exactly accommodate a 480-yard hole how would you decide whether to put a par 4 or 5 there (or assuming you wouldn't design them differently, how would you decide whether to label it a 4 or 5)?

The more I think about Par as a concept, the more confused I get. What if baseball had par? Just an arbitrary number that made people take unnecessary risks just to beat it, possibly at the expense of winning the game. On the other hand, par sometimes tells you more about how you should play the hole than the yardage does. Maybe we should forget about labeling a hole with yardage and just label it with par.

That last sentence is interesting, someone on here one time posted an aerial of a 175 yard par 4. It was something of a 90 degree dogleg with thick, high trees or something involved.

I would likely design a 480 hole as a par 4 (I'm not a designer though). To me, thats a bit short for a half par, par 5, assuming its straight. If its a dogleg, I'd likely design it as a par 5 with some cool features around the green. On the par 4, I would make the green as interesting as possible with a large opening. On the par 5, I'd make the opening just slightly smaller.

I think par is a concept. It can mean what you want it to mean. For someone who is a 25 handicap, is a par 5 really a par 5? Or should this person play it as a par 6? Interesting way to look at it.

[Ian_L]

Charlie, your comparison to other sports is really interesting.

What if we didn't have par?  Would we compare ourselves to the course rating?

[paul cowley]

Par is a pox on the designers palette.....an unseen devil of poor measure.

[Matt OBrien]

I laugh sometimes when I hear that they have changed a course from a par 72 to a par 71 or par 71 to 70 for PGA events. WHO CARES what the par is because its the total score over the 4 days that determines the winner. They could make it any par they want and it wont make a difference at the end of the day. All that is an attempt to show how good these guys are and how long they are. If I could run one tournement I would have it at a 6100Yd course with no par and let the guys shoot 59 every round. Thats the fun golf to watch when they have to think about shots and not bomb driver 300 yds every time.

[Jon Wiggett]

In a professional tournament par is used to allow the players and spectators to know where each player is in relation to the others. You could effectively say that there would be no par but this would mean a return to the situation, due to 36 holes being played on the last day, when it wasn't always clear who was leading until the end

[Sam Morrow]

Par is like age, it's just a number. I want to make the lowest score possible no matter what the par might be.

[Charlie Goerges]

In a professional tournament par is used to allow the players and spectators to know where each player is in relation to the others. You could effectively say that there would be no par but this would mean a return to the situation, due to 36 holes being played on the last day, when it wasn't always clear who was leading until the end

Good point. If golf tournaments only posted the number of strokes that a player had made, it would be difficult to know where he stood. Still, it's a pretty limited use since most of us never play in that type of tournament (thought we watch them).

[JohnV]

Best reason for par and for not changing it from 5 to 4 arbitrarily:

Last year at the USGA Senior Amateur Qualifier on the Witch Hollow course at Pumpkin Ridge, the Oregon Golf Association saw fit to change the par on the 470 yard 14th hole from 5 to 4.

As we walked off the tee after our drives, one of players I was playing with complained about them changing the par.  I gave my usual response that par doesn't matter, only the score after 18 holes.  I got to my drive which was probably the longest one I'd hit in quite a few years on that hole.  From the rough, down-hill, with a good tail wind I proceeded to hit a 180-yard 8-iron which bounced a few times and rolled into the hole for a 2.  I promise that par mattered very greatly to me at that moment.

Best reason for changing par from 5 to 4:
It gets into the heads of the players.  Even many of the best ones in the world who whine that they won't make birdie on a hole when the USGA makes it a 4.  They change their entire playing strategy based on it.  They feel they have to go for the green in two, it is no longer an option since it is a par 4.  While the USGA and others will continue to do it, I think that there is some realization that you have to look at how the hole sets up before changing the par.

Favorite story about changing par:
John Huston set the tour record for most strokes under par at the Hawaiian Open a few years ago.  A year or two later, par was changed from 72 to 70 on the course.  This was done by simply renumbering two holes from 5 to 4.  The holes played the same length.  That year, one of the TV announcers went on for a while about how the 13th hole had gone from the easiest hole on the course to the hardest.     The average score was probably still about the same, but if you measured it against par, it had done so.

[Forrest Richardson]

I am working on a project where we may well list par for a few holes as "3.5", "4.5", etc.  I am not certain if that means I like par, or detest it.   

[JMEvensky]

Par is a pox on the designers palette.....an unseen devil of poor measure.

I really like this.I'm not certain if I agree with it or not,but it's really good.

[Sean_A]

Par doesn't get into the head of anybody.  People's perceptions of what par means and therefore their expectations based on that gets into their heads.  Take a way par designations and once a player gets to know a course he will set his own standards of par and try to live up to that.  The idea is completely controlled by the player as the concept of par doesn't exist independently of golfers expectations.  For instance, how often do you see folks laying up when in a tough situation compared to going for a shot?  Assuming the guy cares about his score, his choice is likely influenced by how he treats the concept of par in relation to trying to earn the best score he can given a realistic appraisal of his capabilities and situation.

Ciao

[J_ Crisham]

Par is generally an irrelevant number. Ask the average player who has played a course like Wannamoissett. Par is 69 and is about all anyone would want to handle. Should you break 80 on this course it is no simple feat. Break 70 and you will not be on this site for long!
                                                                 Jack