Updated Yale profile is posted

[Ran Morrissett]

There are a few people at Yale who hate GolfClubAtlas.com, which is great and the way it should be.

After our 2002 gathering there and armed by crucial information provided by George Bahto, such irascible men as Geoffrey Childs waged a public and sometimes tough campaign against the work that was going at Yale. The fact that so many people got up in arms about the watered-down version of what Raynor’s masterpiece was becoming was in fact quite a compliment to the course. In short, Yale stirs passion like few courses and people care for it dearly. I am definitely one - ever since I first saw it in October, 1985 with Herbert Warren Wind  on the porch in a rocker all rugged up, it has been my Aberdovey.

Hence, it is a real pleasure to provide this updated profile with current photographs and text. Much good work has transpired since Green Keeper Scott Ramsey arrived in 2003. Yes, plenty of work remains to be done but the important thing is that Yale is now moving in the right direction.

The opposite can be said for my old home course in Richmond. The Flynn course at CCV was good but never great and slowly its unique playing qualities (like the sloping landing area in the twelfth fairway) were stripped away . Nobody cared enough to stop the work and reverse the direction of moving away from Flynn’s handiwork.  Now the course is in oblivion, off any architecture fan’s radar screen.

Mercifully, Raynor’s audacious design at Yale wasn’t allowed to suffer the same sad fate as that would have been a monumental loss. Congratulations to everyone who had a hand in turning the ship around from the athletic department that is caretaker of the golf course and to long time benefactor John Beinecke who loves the golf course dearly and on down from there.  Like few other courses (NGLA, Pine Valley, Riviera, Royal Melbourne, Banff), the player is keenly aware that something brilliant is going on here and once again, we are free to appreciate that fact.

Cheers,

[Mike Sweeney]

I have only gotten up there 2-3 times this year, but it has been a real pleasure to play the course. Scott has done an amazing job, and on top of agronomy issues, he has dealt with university and union politics along with a bigger, but still smaller than private club budget. I hope Yale can keep him, as he clearly will have or has options in front of him.

With National as the Mother Ship, Yale is fighting Fishers for #2 in the Macdonald/Raynor family. Fishers will always be the more spectacular place, but give Scott 2-3 seasons of firming up the greens and removing trees and I think Yale will be #2. I say this as a huge an of Piping Rock.

I know he has a strategy for dealing with the issues around #13 green. There is a micro-climate back there and it is prone to winter freezes.

Great update by Ran, my only suggestion is to leave some of the old pictures at the end of the review so supers can see the progress that has been made. Yale has to be some sort of a model for a lower budget transformation.

[Adam Clayman]

Are there any reports from Sunday's 2nd annual Punchbowl?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdBSZ4qujl8

[Tom Bagley]

I played Yale for the first time in 30 years this past summer at a US Am qualifier.  With my 15-year old golf course architecture-buff son on the bag, we started on the magnificent 10th hole and for the next nine hours enjoyed our absolute best golf experience of the year (excepting my scores, of course).  There is no question in my mind that, with continued investment in the course, and responsible and appropriate improvements, Yale will once again be widely considered one of the great inland courses in the country.

Hole after hole provides playing interest on a scale few other courses can match.  The look on my son's face after we scaled the dramatic approach to the 10th to find the other-worldy green awaiting us was priceless.

Yale was the most fun I've had playing golf in a long time.  It won't be 30 years before I get back there again.

[jkinney]

Wonderful update, Ran. Yale is the course on which I really learned the game, and I'd been following the renovation through various sources. Now that the process is far enough along, as seen in your fine photos, I'll get back there next spring when the dogwoods are in bloom. Kudos to Scott Ramsey.

Yale is without question the most heroic of the parkland courses, IMO. Needless to say, all the players who come from it are skilled bunker artists and fine long lag putters !

[Michael Dugger]

Another totally killer write up!!!

So are there ongoing efforts being made to continue to restore Yale?

Just curious

[John Mayhugh]

Like few other courses (NGLA, Pine Valley, Riviera, Royal Melbourne, Banff), the player is keenly aware that something brilliant is going on here and once again, we are free to appreciate that fact.

Yale was the golf course that first inspired my interest in golf architecture.  It was so completely different from any other course that I had seen I was interested in learning more.  Several years ago I was looking for some Yale photos and stumbled on GCA.  Life hasn't been the same since. 

I was fortunate enough to play Yale a few weeks ago.  I hadn't seen the course in nearly ten years and the improvement was dramatic.  I love some of the views you can get now.  The profile photo from behind the second green is just one example.  It's fun to see so much more of this big brawny course than ever before.

Great updated profile of a course that is truly one of a kind.  I don't see how someone could play Yale and not consider Raynor a genius.

[Noel Freeman]

Im shocked this thread is on page 2.. Yale gets no billing?

I liked the fact that Ran talked about the ground game at Yale.  Some have posited that it is an aerial course with limited ground options but when you get to play it on a regular basis you see that holes 1,2,3,4,6,8,11,16,17 and 18 all have great ground options.. and what I mean is approaches and around the greens..

[Joel_Stewart]

Im shocked this thread is on page 2.. Yale gets no billing?

I am as well and can't figure out why Yale fails to attract panelists from magazines.  It's possible its not finished yet and has a long way to go.  I'm not being critical but Yale lacks some type of X factor.

[Michael Moore]

I'm not being critical but Yale lacks some type of X factor.

I definitely racked up an X on the eighteenth hole.

Yale is a great course and I look forward to a return visit.

The layout is jarring to the eye and in places does not even look like a golf course.

Challenging a twenty-five foot deep bunker is exciting, recovering from one is a proportionally unexciting crapshoot.

[Noel Freeman]

Joel-

Yale has plenty of X appeal, but being ensconced in its little corner of New Haven which truly is close to nowhere but far enough from New York City or Boston.  Plus, the next best courses are Shennecossett/Fishers Island and Country Club of Fairfield all which are far away or very private so Yale sits by itself.

The renovation is going on year 4 of a 5 year plan.. Drainage and tree work have mainly been accomplished.  The real sexy projects if they can get done remain.. That would be re-bunkering of parts of the course to old photos of Raynor's bunkers.  As Ran alludes in his review, there are several holes that need to have their bunkers restored.. There is no greater example then the cat trap bunker beside the 6th green.  There are others I could highlight on the front 9 but they are evident to the discerning eye.  To me and to others who know the history of the course the crowning glory of any renovation/restoration would be putting the double punchbowl green in on the 3rd hole.

There are other things I'd love to see, the 16th green either updated with new bunkering and contouring or put beside the swamp where it used to lie.  I doubt this would happen because the hole would become a par 4 and Yale a par 69 and gosh what would people think!  Putting the 16th back would give Yale the strong/long par 4 it needs.

There are several greens which could use some touchups, the knobs that used to be on #2 would be a nice feature to regain, the horseshoe on the short is all but absent and our redan has little tilt.

But give Scott time, he's been dealing with agronomy issues and has forged a great compact b/t the unions and management.  I truly believe the University is building the course back slowly but surely and is on the right track.  Given economic times I'm not sure how things will proceed.

It is a privilege to be a member there...

[Mark Bourgeois]

Maybe we could get David Swensen to pull a David Bronner and add it to his RE portfolio!

[Phil Benedict]

The layout is jarring to the eye and in places does not even look like a golf course.

Michael,

Interesting statement.  What do you mean doesn't look like a golf course?  Is there any other course where you could make the same observation?

[John Mayhugh]

Im shocked this thread is on page 2.. Yale gets no billing?

Tell me about it.  I played there a few weeks ago on a Saturday and couldn't get anyone from GCA to join me.  But then maybe I was the problem.   

I'll try to put together a "photo tribute" sometime in the next couple of weeks.  I took around 150 pics.  Would have taken more but the guys I got paired up had to already be wondering what I was up to.  Anyway, seeing more photos will help but there's nothing like being on the ground there.  Some parts of the course simply must be seen to be believed.

[Tim Bert]

Speaking of the 9th, Ran says in his profile "Thus, as with every full length Biarritz, it should be mandatory that the hole be placed on the back half of the green the vast majority of the time as the tee ball is more varied and interesting."

I've only played the course on two different days.  Both times the pin was in the front position, and based on my small sample size I agree with Ran's comments.  It was much more fun and interesting to hit additional shots from the tee and try to get the ball to race to the back than it was to hit the 7 or 8 iron to the sizeable front portion of the green.

I now a few others, who have also only visited a few times, but they too have commented that the pin has always been in the front.  Is this just luck of the draw?  My sample size is admittedly limited.  For those who have had an opportunity to play the course more regularly, is the pin in the front or the back the majority of the time, or would you consider it an equal split?

[Jim Nugent]

It was much more fun and interesting to hit additional shots from the tee and try to get the ball to race to the back than it was to hit the 7 or 8 iron to the sizeable front portion of the green.

Never played Yale, so I'm hoping someone can clear up a point for me.  #9 tee, as I understand it, is 60 feet above the green.  Seems like this would make it real hard to hit a low running shot, that chases to the back tier. 

As Ran says in the new update:

"The sheer audacity of this 12,000 square foot green sets the hole apart in world golf as, after all, no further dramatics were really required given the heroic nature of the tee ball. In theory, the player is to use the front slope of the gully to help sling the ball to the back hole locations. "

Does that mean your landing zone is the downslope of the gully?  Sounds like target golf to a tiny l.z. 

[Mike Sweeney]

In the pre-Scott days at Yale, you rarely saw the pin in the back on #9 because they had problems growing grass with all the shade on the back section. Now with the clearing of the trees  you do see the pin on the back. My guess without really knowing is he still puts it up front more often for regular play because when the course is busy, there is normally a back-up on that tee due to the half-way house and the toughness of the hole. This year they were often putting the members tee on #10 way up to keep more balls in play off that tee too.

To hit a CB Mac low runner onto that back section on 9, you would have to hit a Tigerish "stinger" which for me is a hybrid 3 iron. I would be shocked if I have pulled it off more than twice, but I did do it once. 

There was a legendary day at Yale when Neil "Put the pin in the Biarritz" Regan had a small group of friends to Yale and he asked Scott for a "crazy pin day" and they got it. I was not there that day but was told that a number of players who were not part of the group came into the clubhouse and asked if everything was okay with Scott's home life because he seemed a little angry when he set up pins that day!!

[Michael Moore]

Michael,

Interesting statement.  What do you mean doesn't look like a golf course?  Is there any other course where you could make the same observation?

Phil,

I mean, it ain't look like a golf course!



Above is an excellent photo of the sixth at Royal North Devon, courtesy of Tommy Williamsen, from a tee box that Ran Morrissett calls the most glorious spot in English golf.

Yet, even though I know that this hole would be a blast to play and that the atmosphere would knock my socks off, this picture gives me the willies. I feel like this hole would swallow me up before I got to the green.

Similarly, a shot from the depths of the tenth hole at Yale does not feel like a sporting approach to a blind green, but rather, as you gaze up at that ladder, an escape from some sort of Odyessean, non-golfing ordeal.

I'll never forget a conversation I had with my future wife in 1995, as we prepared for my first trip to Truro, Massachusetts. She said "there's a golf course there, but it doesn't look like a golf course". They have since grown grass on the fairways, but at the time she was right!

[herrstein]

It's been some time since the Raynor Society met at Yale- about a year- but at that time the course was in very good condition and I must say that Yale is among my favorite golf courses. The boldest from Raynor that I have seen.
Scott Ramsey is the man.
Any GCAers who have not seen it simply must go out of their way to do so.
Thanks to Ran for another excellent writeup. I cannot tell how he knows where to stand with his one-shot cameras to get the definitive picture, but he does it!

[Sean_A]

Michael,

Interesting statement.  What do you mean doesn't look like a golf course?  Is there any other course where you could make the same observation?

Phil,

I mean, it ain't look like a golf course!



Above is an excellent photo of the sixth at Royal North Devon, courtesy of Tommy Williamsen, from a tee box that Ran Morrissett calls the most glorious spot in English golf.

Yet, even though I know that this hole would be a blast to play and that the atmosphere would knock my socks off, this picture gives me the willies. I feel like this hole would swallow me up before I got to the green.

Mike

That photo is exactly what I think of as ideal golf and I would say many more courses should look like this.  Its a pity not much more of RND doesn't look like this or it would be world beater.

Ciao

[Mike Sweeney]

I am as well and can't figure out why Yale fails to attract panelists from magazines. 

Joel,

Golf Digest has a corporate membership at Yale and Yale is currently ranked by all three major publications, The GCA/Hunt World Top 100 and The Ward Metro 50  :

Golfweek Classic #45 (up from #60)
Golf Magazine US  #75
Golf Digest Toughest Courses #44
GCA/Hunt World Top 100 #37 http://www.golfclubatlas.com/opinionhunt.html
Ward Metro Third 10

Yale has not made the Golf Digest Top 100 list for years, but some here might say that is a good with some of the courses that are currently on that list. Part of it is probably due to familiarity from the Golf Digest corporate membership players.  Is there anyone here that would choose Hudson National #90 on GD over Yale for everyday play? Sure I would choose Hudson over Yale on an Alumni weekend when the Class of '58 is on the first tee, but few others.

In terms of the Ward Metro 50, I love Forsgate (Ward Second 10) but we all know Matt has been on the payroll for some time now at Forsgate and Essex County (NJ), because they can't touch Yale for originality and uniqueness.  Matt will respond with his standard turf conditions argument, but when was the last time that Matt did some heavy lifting in New Haven to see the new drainage and tree removal?

One piece that Ran missed was all the work that Scott and his crew has done in the woods at Yale. Pulling out years and years of leaves that were blown into the woods which had clogged natural drainage has also helped the man made drainage that was installed.

The only X factor missing at Yale is that it is viewed as easy access by the raters, and we all know that many of them like courses where others have a hard time getting on. Maybe Yale should ask for SAT scores before showing the rater card!

I would say that Yale is rated pretty fairly, and the good news is it still has room to grow and move up with Scott in charge. While Noel's suggestions may be a long shot, they would also make the course better. Not sure if I agree with the Par 69 concept, as I don't like National's move to a Par 72 on the scorecard, but the 16th green is a weak piece of the course.

[Mark Bourgeois]

Ten years had passed from when I had seen any of the course beyond the clubhouse, so New Year's Day seemed an appropriate anniversary to go walkabout.

The changes are amazing.  I can't wait to play the 12th and the 15th! The 15th especially looks like it will play as an entirely different hole than the one I cut my teeth on.  It might well go from my least favorite par 3 to my third favorite (13 first then 9).

I only got a few pics, and with the world's worst camera phone, but if you take the time to see past the quality (squint hard) of the photos, perhaps you too will be amazed at the quality of the course.

There's been discussion of a Western BUDA here; logistically, Yale falls down as a suitable venue (no great relief course, tough to do 36), but as a one-off would anyone Over There contemplate a modern Atlantic Crossing?

Maybe we could sweeten the deal with a promise of cups at Mory's, lobster at Lenny's, pizza at Pepe's (okay, Sally's too), drinks at Bar, maybe a talk from Scott R...

By the way, does anyone know what's being built in the woods to the right of the entrance road?

Random-order pics:

The 9th -- coulda bounced one across Greist Pond


5 green, shown from the left, with 6 fairway in the distance


New, deep bunker along the right side of 15 green -- used to be shallow, with wooden planks shoring up the face


The 15th -- sorry these next two pics are small, but the new green appears both far higher and steeper




13 green: sure, maybe it would be better steeper, but it's my favorite hole on the course!


12th: the restored Alps bunker is an absolute revelation.  Before, there were two bunkers sunk in a flat plateau.  This is a view from behind the right half (as you're looking from the fairway) of the green -- notice in the right foreground of the pic the two-foot vertical spine that segments the green.  Note the higher front lip of the restored bunker.



11th hole, green in foreground, tee way up on the very top of the hill in the distance


17 green, with fairway running back up the left -- that's 18 fairway off to the right


Back half of 10 green


Looking down 10 fairway to the tee


10th hole


Mark

[Joel_Stewart]

Looks like a good time to go out there with a chainsaw.  Still looks like a lot of trees to be trimmed and cleared.

I've asked before but when is the 3rd green going to be restored?

[Lester George]

Ran,

Don't know when you last played the River but in 2002 I re-contoured the 12th fairway with an effort to return it to pre-1992 work.  It now slopes to the right a little more than before for drainage sake (Flynn must have had it correct before).  I could not "restore" it to its original slope because too many members ranked it as their least favorite because of that reverse camber.  I still think Flynn had it right to begin with.

Lester

 

[Mark Bourgeois]

Joel

For cost reasons, it's pretty far down the list I think.  (If forced to choose I would vote for 16 green being restored first.  16 is the worst hole on the course.)  For a sense of expansiveness -- not to mention the awesome bunkering between 1 and 8 greens -- check out the 10:10 mark of this video of the 1931 Connecticut Open.  (Another cool bunker, between 1 and 2 and NLE, is at 3:35.) http://research.yale.edu/wwkelly/Yale-golf/videos/Yale%20Golf.rm

It should be noted that the property was heavily wooded from the very beginning -- in contrast to many Golden Age courses, which saw their previous roles as farms, much of what we see today at Yale is not dramatically different from 75 years ago. It could use more, certainly, but today it's far closer to what it was.

For example, the corridor of the 12th under construction isn't that much different from today:


The 10th, 1925 vs 2005, followed by Ran's recent pic, followed by mine:




The trees don't impinge on play the way they used to.  Here's a before and after looking up the 18th -- unfortunately they're not from the same angle.

Before, from the Tiger tee:


After, from the middle tee:


Not saying they couldn't do with more...

Mark