News:

Welcome to the Golf Club Atlas Discussion Group!

Each user is approved by the Golf Club Atlas editorial staff. For any new inquiries, please contact us.


Phil McDade

  • Karma: +0/-0
Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« on: September 17, 2008, 12:23:30 PM »
Milwaukee Country Club hosted this year’s U.S. Mid-Amateur, and the course earned universal praise from players, caddies, tournament officials and spectators. A classic, tree-lined parkland course, the design is attributed by the club to Colt and Alison, circa 1927, although others have attributed it solely to Alison. The club itself dates to 1894, and although viewed as the most prestigious club in the Milwaukee area, it maintains a very low profile. It has hosted only two previous tournaments of note, the 1969 Walker Cup and the 1988 U.S. Senior Amateur.

Because it keeps such a low profile, the course is perhaps one of the least-known of the highly rated, classic-era courses in the country (48th in the ‘07-‘08 Golf Digest rankings, ahead of such notable courses as Camargo, Garden City, Riviera and Colonial). GCA contributor and USGA rules official John Vander Borght said Milwaukee CC was the best Mid-Am course he’d seen since he began officiating at the tournament 12 years ago.

What follows is a pictorial review of Milwaukee CC, with some comments on individual holes:

No. 1 (427, par 4)

The inviting opening tee shot, from an elevated tee to a fairway below that gently doglegs right. Similar to  Merion East, the first tee at MCC is just a few steps from the clubhouse.
 

A view of the 1st green, and a trademark of the course – a green perched up slightly from the fairway, pinched by deep, flashed-up, high-lipped bunkers left and right. Although the greens at MCC don’t have many significant internal contours, they often have a pronounced tilt, either from back to front or away from a greenside bunker.


A view of the 1st fairway, looking back up to the clubhouse.


No. 2 (451 par 4)

The disconcerting tee shot of the 2nd; where exactly does the fairway go? It moves slightly right, with both the landing area (completely) and a large bunker at the corner of the dogleg (partially) blind from the tee.


The approach to the 2nd; the pinching right-side bunker is quite deep. This played as the toughest hole on the course during qualifying play, averaging 4.6 strokes.


The right greenside bunker, from behind the green. From the player’s perspective in the fairway, the green does not appear to be as elevated as it appears here.


No. 3 (529 par 5)

One of two par 5s for the Mid-Am, it ranked as the easiest hole for the players, and helps establish the rhythm of MCC – stern tests like the 2nd are followed by relatively easier holes like the 3rd. The pattern continues throughout the round, giving the golfer the sense that the course is not one relentless slog, but one that provides a variety of challenges. The 3rd hole was one of two on the course that was completely redone by the club several years ago, including a new green. The hole, although of modest length for a par 5, does offer both a tight driving area and a fairway that narrows at the ideal landing spot for a layup. Those going for the green in two risk a tough up-and-down from deep greenside bunkers if the approach shot is errant.


No. 4 (194 par 3)

Although not a classic Redan, the 4th has some Redan-like attributes:  a deep fronting bunker left, a green that runs away from the player, a back bunker right, and small knob right of the green that could be used to propel a ball toward the hole. But the green lacks the requisite tilt of a classic Redan. Still, the play here is a long, high draw – it plays uphill, perhaps a full club-length.


The green on the 4th sits near one of the busiest areas of the course – to the left of the green is the driving range and practice area, while behind the green sits the road that leads to the club.


The fronting bunker on the Redan-esque 4th.


No. 5 (431 par 4)

An elevated tee to a “saddle” fairway pinched on both sides by fairway bunkers. It’s downhill all the way to the green.


The bunker complex that lies between holes 5 and 6.


No. 6 (407 par 4)

A par 4 of modest length that played surprisingly tough during qualifying play, averaging 4.5 strokes. It’s uphill all the way (holes 5 and 6 parallel each other), with fairway bunkers left and right. The bunkers flanking the green are quite deep. Note the size of the far greenside bunker in the distance, 400+ yards away.


Although the course has undergone an aggressive tree-cutting program, there are still some places where overhanging branches can impact shots. This is from the intermediary rough (two yards wide for the Mid-Am), about 130 yards from the center of the green (275 yard tee shot).


No. 7 (492 par 4)

A par 5 for the members, but used as a par 4 for the Mid-Am. A long, tough hole – players have to be willing to take on the large fairway bunker right to shorten their approach shot.


Those opting for safety left off the tee will have a long approach shot to a green with two bunkers left and one right, shown here. Par at the 7th often won the hole during match play at the tournament.


No. 8 (166 par 3)

A nifty little par 3; it played as the easiest of the par 3s during the Mid-Am, and the site of three aces during qualifying play. But it still presents some challenges; the tee shot is to a slightly perched-up green surrounded in front and both sides by deep bunkering.


To get a sense of the bunker depth at 8, click on picture #10 from this USGA link from the Mid-Am:
http://www.usmidam.org/photos/tue/index.html

Here’s the fun portion of the 8th hole – an aggressive shot to a pin in the back of the green risks running off the closely mown backside, and into a deep ravine.


Random non-golf architecture tangent

On-course restrooms are often drab affairs, with little thought put into them. This charming little building sits between the 8th green and the 9th tee.


No. 9 (322 par 4)

A personal favorite, and a very good, short par 4. The hole plays straightway toward the beckoning clubhouse, with a tee shot over the deep ravine that sits at the back of the 8th hole. A series of fairway bunkers right catch errant tee shots; the safe play is an iron/fairway wood out to the left.


The green of the 9th, with a dramatic false front and bunkers left and right. The right-front bunker, dubbed Big Bertha by the members, is the deepest on the course.


Back nine to follow soon.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2008, 04:46:56 PM by Phil McDade »

Ian Larson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #1 on: September 17, 2008, 12:36:55 PM »
Wow that is in great shape!

Greg Krueger

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #2 on: September 17, 2008, 01:09:12 PM »
Phil, thanks for the great pictures and even better commentary! What is the yardage and did it play F&F?

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #3 on: September 17, 2008, 01:10:29 PM »
Phil, congratulations and thanks for one of the best photo journal essays and examination of the GCA of any course we've had here on GCA.com .
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Phil McDade

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #4 on: September 17, 2008, 01:20:58 PM »
Back nine of Milwaukee Country Club:

No. 10 (465 par 4)

Similar to the 1st hole, the opening hole of the back nine starts with an elevated tee (just a few steps from the back porch of the clubhouse) to a fairway down below in a valley, with the Milwaukee River shimmering in the distance. Several trees were cut down to bring in the view of the river from the tee. Although not entirely rebuilt, this hole has undergone significant changes in the past few years. It played as a par 4 for the Mid-Am, but it’s a short par 5 for the members.


Here is a photo of the 10th hole taken by GCA poster Brian Sleeman in 2004 of the 10th fairway.


Here is the current fairway. Note the differences. The trees on the right side of the fairway have all been cut down, replaced by a series of fairway bunkers cut into the hillside. The fairway bunker left has been grassed over, effectively moving the fairway left and closer to the tree line in the left rough. The large and deep greenside bunker has been grassed in, leaving this as the only green without bunkering on the course. A longtime MCC member told me the hole was changed because golfers thought the mature trees lining the right side of the fairway unfairly inhibited players on the right side of the fairway from going for the green in two on what is a sub-500 yard par 5 for the members.


In this photo, taken from the hill above the right side of the fairway, you can see a shaded half-circle of fairway, past the bunkers. This is the new fairway added in, when the club moved the fairway slightly left. The grass replaced a bunker on the left side of the fairway.


The green is benched into a hillside. Those willing to challenge the bunkers on the right have an easier approach, as the right side of the green is nearly level with the fairway, and the flanking area right feeds balls to the green. Those who opt for the safe route left off the tee are confronted with an approach to a steeply banked portion of the green complex. The less-than-bold approach from the left will trickle away from the green and down the embankment into the rough. The green is tilted somewhat from back to front, but a longtime member said that wasn’t the most important feature of the green. “Everything breaks toward the river,” he said.


No. 11 (375 par 4)

The 11th begins a series of five holes that run alongside or cross the Milwaukee River. The dogleg-left hole features two tees – an elevated one near the 10th green (shown here), and a second tee that shortens the hole by 10 yards but sits right next to the river. The option is either a long iron/fairway wood safely to the right, or taking on a series of bunkers by cutting off the dogleg.


Here are the fairway bunkers; for my tastes, this looks a bit busy.


The green on 11 features a severe false front; I watched quarterfinalist Chris Lange hit what looked like a perfect short-iron into the green, only to watch his ball slope back toward the false front and then down back into the fairway.


No. 12 (187 par 3)

A tough par 3 over the Milwaukee River to a heavily bunkered green. This played as the toughest of the course’s par 3s during qualifying rounds. (Colt and Alison’s use of the Milwaukee River throughout the course appears to be more aesthetic than strategic; note how the green here is set far back from the river’s edge, with large bunkering in between the river and green.)


No. 13 (380 par 4)

The only hole at MCC that plays entirely on the east side of the Milwaukee River, this dogleg right is also the flattest hole on the course. The play is similar to the 11th – take on the long bunker at the corner of the dogleg, and shorten the hole, or play safely out to the left.  A reasonable birdie chance, it played as the second-easiest of the course’s par 4s during qualifying rounds. Here’s the tee shot; that’s GCA poster Jason Mandel, who caddied for his brother Marc in the Mid-Am.


Here’s where a safe tee shot ends up; the two golfers past the bunker on the right are standing where a bolder tee shot may wind up. Note the depth of the left side bunker.


Here’s the left greenside bunker; the sharp edging of the bunkers is a trademark of the bunkering at MCC.


No. 14 (438 par 4)

The beginning of MCC’s long, tough finish; 14 played as the second-hardest hole in qualifying rounds. Along with the 3rd, this is the other completely rebuilt hole on the course. The tee shot is slightly uphill over the river, with a slight dogleg right. Most of the non-par 3s on the course turn slightly, meaning players are forced to either work the ball off the tee or take angles into consideration.


The 14th green, with Marc Mandel surveying a putt during a practice round.


No. 15 (579 par 5)

A true three-shot par 5, unless the wind is helping. This is a new back tee recently built by the club, with considerable tree removal  to open the view to the river.


A series of bunkers dot the left side of the fairway. Most in the tournament played short or right of these.


No. 16 (483 par 4)

An uphill tee shot to one of the few straightaway holes on the course leaves this approach. The bunkering here is unique – these bunkers sit a good 20-30 yards in front of the green.


A closer look at the bunkering on 16; note the gap between the bunker left and the front of the green. The two bunkers and their surrounds create something of a saddle opening into the green. A nice bit of visual deception.


No. 17 (224 par 3)

A terrific par 3, and quite demanding. The tee shot is all uphill; add at least a club.


The green on 17 tilts from back to front, and from left to right, toward this cavernous bunker guarding the entire right side of the green.


No. 18 (444 par 4)

A strong finishing hole, with an uphill tee shot toward a ridge line and a wide bunker cutting into the fairway left at about 240 yards staring at you. Another fairway bunker right lies 280 yards from the tee.


Clear the ridge line on your tee shot, and you’re left with a downhill tee shot to a two-tier green framed by the stately clubhouse.


Options on par 4s are often associated with shorter holes, but the 18th is notable for how the choice on the tee can dramatically impact the second shot.  In his round-of-16 match at the Mid-Am, Tim Mickelson (one down in the match on the final hole) played safely to the right of the large fairway bunker, and was left with this uphill lie and approach from 192 yards. His play was at the shorter of the trees in the middle of the picture, green and flag unseen.


Mickelson’s opponent, Michael Stamberger, took on the left fairway bunker, and was rewarded with a 170-yard approach shot from a level lie, as a broad, flat plateau lies beyond the bunker on the left side of the fairway. The flag was middle front on the upper tier of the green (just to the right of the tall gentleman with the white shirt in the middle of the picture.)



An interesting feature of the 18th hole is the shaved backside of the 18th green. The very edge of the green can be seen in the middle left of the picture; a ball hit long can roll into the 1st tee (middle-right of photo), the path behind the 1st tee, or – if the door is open – even the course pro shop (entrance, far right side of the picture).


The practice putting green, a few steps from the front door of the clubhouse.


Milwaukee Country Club takes a Brigadoon-like approach to hosting significant tournaments – every 20 years or so, it opens its doors to showcase its wonderful course. One hopes golf fans won’t have to wait until 2028 to see first-hand the course again.


John Mayhugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #5 on: September 17, 2008, 01:25:45 PM »
Thanks for the photos and commentary.  Thanks for including the one of the restroom building.  Looks like it belongs in Milwaukee.  

Have you played the course as well?

Phil McDade

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #6 on: September 17, 2008, 01:34:26 PM »
John:

I have not; it's not the easiest place to get on to. Volunteers who worked the tournament, and caddies at the Mid-Am, have the opportunity to play the course, sometime this month.

I walked nearly every inch of it, it seems, over the course of a few days watching the Mid-Am. I also spent considerable time talking to members about it. To a person, the membership of the club is quite knowledgeable about the course, providing some keen insights into how it plays.

Phil McDade

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #7 on: September 17, 2008, 01:45:09 PM »
Phil, thanks for the great pictures and even better commentary! What is the yardage and did it play F&F?

Greg:

For the Mid-Am, it played to a par of 70 (two par 5s, four par 3s) at 7094 yards. For some days of match play, some tees were moved up, notably the 9th to tempt players into driving the green on the short par 4. Interestingly, on the very last day of the Mid-Am for the 36-hole final, the prevailing wind completely switched around. It had been out of the north/north-west for nearly all of qualifying and early match play, then switched to out of the south/south-east on the last day. It notably changed how some holes were played, e.g., at the dogleg par 4 11th (375), both finalists -- with a good helping wind -- simply drove over all of the fairway bunkers, and both put their balls within 10 yards of the big false front there. It also made #9 play much shorter -- both players drove over the green on their tee shots.

I don't know if I'd call the playing conditions there truly fast and firm -- on the eve of the tournament, Milwaukee was hit with an all-day rain that dropped two inches on the course. But it drained nicely, and the greens on some days took on that sheen-like look in the afternoon. They were pretty quick, and many players and caddies said they were struck by how well the course drained after the all-day soaker (it occured on the first practice day, two days before the start of qualifying play). The fairways had decent roll-out on drives, but not the kind of dryness that saw tee shots bounding out of the fairway and into the rough. Well-struck shots stayed in the fairway and on greens.

Chuck Brown

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #8 on: September 17, 2008, 02:10:31 PM »
Do I get extra credit for knowing that that is Buddy Marucci striding on the 4th green?  (Center of photo, kahki pants and white shirt.) ;D

PCCraig

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #9 on: September 17, 2008, 02:27:15 PM »
That looks awesome. It looks alot like the other Colt clubs here in Chicago, esp. North Shore CC, but with better land.

Very interesting thank you for posting.
H.P.S.

PCCraig

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #10 on: September 17, 2008, 02:34:40 PM »
Back nine = wow wow wow

The 11th is really cool!
H.P.S.

Phil McDade

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #11 on: September 17, 2008, 04:09:40 PM »
Do I get extra credit for knowing that that is Buddy Marucci striding on the 4th green?  (Center of photo, kahki pants and white shirt.) ;D

Ding ding ding! We have a winner....

Chuck:

Yes you do; that's also Buddy waiting, hand on club, in the fairway of the photo of the 3rd hole. His was one of the threesomes I followed in qualifying play.

The cool thing about Marucci: he was paired with the guy next to him -- white shirt with orange trim -- who was the lone qualifier for the Mid-Am from Alaska. The guy could hit it a ways, but obviously seemed to have never played a course quite like Milwaukee, and struggled a bit. Buddy could not have been nicer or more gracious to the young guy. A real sportsman.


JohnV

Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #12 on: September 17, 2008, 04:16:32 PM »
Phil, great photos.  Thanks.

A few things to note that might not be obvious from the pictures.  

Most if not all of the greenside bunkers have banks that are very short so that they gather balls from the edges of the greens.  The front of the bunker on the left of #1 is less than one foot from the edge of the green.  I had a player in a match hit the green on #13 when the hole was on the left and the ball spun back into the little cutout of the bunker that wasn't even obvious from the fairway.

One of the groups I walked with in stroke play was partially responsible for #2's high scoring average.  Two players hit their second shots into the right hand bunker with the hole on the right.  One took three to get out and made 7.  The other sculled his out over by the 3rd tee, chipped on and three-putted for 7.  Nothing was easy with that hole during stroke play.

The back bunker on #9 is to be avoided at all costs.  Both players in the final hit it in there and had to struggle to save pars.  Also, both players drove their balls onto the false front on #11 and had them roll back off.

The 10th is a great hole now and the members love it.  Tom Doak's crew, led by Don Placek did the work.  The view down the river from the tee is wonderful in the late afternoon.

While the members do usually play the course with #7 and #10 as par 5s, there is a scorecard from the back tees with par as 70.  I was told that only a few of the members take the course on in this fashion, but it is available all the time and not just for the Mid-Am.

Once again, the USGA showed that they were willing to mix things up with a number of holes being played from different tees.  Another twist that was thrown in for the finals was that some hole locations were moved between the morning and afternoon rounds which was surprising to me as I don't believe it has been done before by them.


Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #13 on: September 17, 2008, 05:14:26 PM »
Those who have played some golf at Athens CC may see a strong resemblance between #10 at Milwauikee and #11 at Athens.  Both great long par 4s with the green benched into the slope at the upper right corner of the hole.   The river is a nice touch at Milwaukee!  ;D

Steve Kline

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #14 on: September 17, 2008, 10:13:29 PM »
Now I'm even more bummed i didn't qualify. That place looks awesome! Great pictures Phil.

Dan Moore

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #15 on: September 18, 2008, 12:30:37 AM »
Phil,

How would you compare the terrain and greens to those at Ozaukee which is located just a few miles up the River from Milwaukee CC. 
"Is there any other game which produces in the human mind such enviable insanity."  Bernard Darwin

Doug Spets

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #16 on: September 18, 2008, 07:21:20 AM »
Phil.....

Wonderful set of pictures.  MCC is golf as it used to be and should be.  Tough, long par 4s and a couple of short holes (9, 11) that require a decision, with risk and reward everywhere.

Interesting thing about that 1st hole.  It's a very slight dogleg right, downhill off the tee.  We missed that fairway right several times in both practice, qualifying and match play.  When the pin was on the right side of the green, it required a fade around a tree on the dogleg.  But the rough really wouldn't allow a cut...so the front right bunker was the end result many times for many players.

I thought the 3rd hole was kinda claustrophobic up around the green.  The woods on the right are pretty close...and the woods long appear closer than they actually are.  4th hole was much more uphill than it appeared from the tee.

On the 9th, I saw everything from 5-iron to driver off the tee.  My recommendation is to hit a tee shot to a 2nd-shot distance from which you are not likely to spin the ball.  If you put a lot of spin on it, you can hit it over the green and still have it suck back down the false front, leaving you with a wedge from 40 yards.   A great, great short hole.

Not a short hole on the back....with 14-18 being a brutal stretch.  Not sure whether the USGA kept any figures on how many people hit it over the 18th green and down into that weird, teebox/golfshop/OB/hazard situation...but your point about the back of the 18th green is very well-taken.  To be aggressive to a back pin really takes some nerve.  You aren't making anything less than a 6 if you go long here.

I was kinda disappointed there weren't any action shots of a certain caddy included in your pictorial.  In all seriousness, it was nice to meet you and thanks for some great pictures and your thoughts.

Phil McDade

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #17 on: September 18, 2008, 09:17:26 AM »
Doug:

I saw a lot of folks end up in the right rough on #1; for most of the tourney, the wind wasn't helping in that regard, and I sensed that some balls were helped into the rough via the wind coming out of the north/north-east. But I did see some nice recovery shots out of the rough, demonstrating (at least to me) that the rough wasn't so long that it was simply a wedge-out. (Todd Mitchell, the finalist, hit a marvelous recovery shot out of the left rough that barely cleared the rough, ran through the fairway, up into the opening and stopping nearly pin-high. One of the best shots I saw all week.)

On #3, the Mid-Am winner (Steve Wilson) hit a huge slice toward the woods on the right, and even hit a provisional in case it went OB. Interestingly, that right side of the course (there is a fence a few feet into the woods right of the green) wasn't staked as OB. Wilson found his ball, somehow (in a ruling that -- while I don't question it -- I was curious about...) got two clubs relief no closer to the hole, and made a remarkable up-and-down for par that played a big factor in the match, as Mitchell couldn't convert for a birdie from in front of the green. I like the hole, because the tee shot is a little uncomfortable (you really can't see the fairway that opens up beyond the first fairway bunker left), and the hole does tighten up as you get closer (that big pine tree 75 yards short of the green hugging the right side of the fairway would really seem to steer folks left toward that left fairway bunker that also sits about the same distance from the green). But, I also can't help but think the 3rd does feel a bit different than the others, and am not surprised it was one of the two holes redone by the club.

Agree on 4 -- as a set, the par 3s at MCC are terrific; one short iron on 8, two long irons on 4 and 12 (and they go in opposite directions, meaning many players might use a different club for each), and 17, just a great hole that most took hybrid/fairway wood on.

What did you think of the confluence of the short 11th and the tee of the 12th? When I walked some of the pratice round w/ Jason and Marc Mandel, one of his pratice buddies nearly got beaned as he was walking up to the 12th tee -- from a player on 11 tee who was trying to drive the green. You can't see the green from either tee on 11. I also saw this happen once during some of the qualifying play. There appears to be some room to move that 12 tee left to avoid that, although I didn't scope it out to see if/how it would change the shot.

I had an interesting conversation with a member while watching players come off 18 green -- he said the clubhouse behind the 18th green is OB, but everything else is in-bounds; not a white stake or line to be found behind there. The pro shop was open during play, and I had hoped to see a "Tin Cup" moment where a player flew the green and ended up amongst the shirts and hats in the pro shop.

The link on the front-nine set of pictures, to show the bunker depth on 8, is your guy! He really played well that week, only to run into the Mitchell buzz-saw.

Great to meet you; if I end up in SC, I'll look you up. Ever play Aiken? It's been described here as a real treat -- a real bargain and some original stuff that dates back years.

« Last Edit: September 18, 2008, 02:06:13 PM by Phil McDade »

Phil McDade

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #18 on: September 18, 2008, 10:25:07 AM »
Phil,

How would you compare the terrain and greens to those at Ozaukee which is located just a few miles up the River from Milwaukee CC. 

Dan:

I thought the two courses were quite similar in many respects, although not all. A few thoughts:

-- The terrain is quite similar, although MCC had the better piece of land w/ regards to utilizing the river in a dramatic way. Again, Alison (for sake of discussion, I'll credit him...) used the river more for aesthetic reasons, it seems, but it's really a nice feature of the course -- some of the views of the river, esp. at 10 and the tees on 11, as well as the new back tee at 15, are quite striking. At Ozaukee, you really only get a flavor of the river on 17 (although the tributary on 15 comes into play notably).

-- Langford takes you from the high ground of the course, near the clubhouse, toward the river valley in a more gradual way than Alison does at MCC. The two elevated tee shots at MCC -- 1 and 10 -- are really very good, both visually and how they play. The 1st seems to fit Ross's notion of an opening hole -- a gentle handshake. Not overly difficult, and the elevated tee would seem to encourage a healthy, bold swing, but one that needs some thought. 10 is a wonderful tee setting -- set amongst some of the course's largest trees, shaded, yet with great views of the hole ahead, and a dramatic drop down to the valley fairway, with the river in the distance. Langford seemed to move toward the valley parts of Ozaukee gradually -- 1 and 2 move slowly downhill, as I recall, without the kind of bold, dramatic tee shots that Alison employed.

-- Interestingly, both courses had #3 holes that run alongside their western borders, and both have been reworked. The 3rd at MCC fits in much more seamlessly than the 3rd at Ozaukee; I believe GCA poster Erich Terhorst has thoughts on what might be done to improve the 3rd at Ozaukee.

-- Both courses feature very good, perhaps even outstanding, 18th holes -- tough finishers, uphill most of the way. I really liked Ozaukee's when I played it, and the terrain is a bit more rambunctious there, and I admired Langford's willingness to route the final hole over such uneven terrain. But the 18th at MCC (similar length, 444 to Oz's 439) is really quite good, too -- I'd have a hard time choosing which one I'd prefer.

-- In all honesty, I liked the routing of MCC better than Ozaukee. The confluence of the 2nd green, 15th tee, 4th green, 3rd tee, and 5th tee at Ozaukee I found quite confusing -- the green-to-tee walks there felt forced, and unnatural. And although the 9th at Ozaukee is a very good par 3, I'm not a big fan of ending (or beginning) nines with par 3s (personal preference; I'm sure there are very good examples of routings with par 3 openers/closers). The routing at MCC is outstanding, in my view -- the holes follow a logical path, with the terrain sort of dictating where you go. You never seem to be at a loss at to where to go after finishing a hole at MCC (the only place this remotely happens is at the confluence of the 2nd and 17th tees -- after 16, you have to walk behind the tee at 2 to get to 17 -- but it's a short walk, and you notice it when walking off 1 to tee off on 2). Routing is often a product, it seems, of what's available to a designer; the land at Ozaukee is largely one big square, while the land at MCC has some odd angles and shapes, the product of it using more of the river and the nearby land. Alison was given a very good piece of property with which to work, and he did a wonderful job with it.

-- The bunkering at MCC is really just superb; they are perhaps the most noticeable element of the course, and I'd suggest maybe the clearest difference between the two courses. Ozaukee's bunkering to me was a bit odd, for a Langford/Moreau course -- not as consistent in form or style, (owing perhaps to its earlier incarnation, along with later re-working), and not as bold as you see at Lawsonia. I've always thought the bunkering at Lawsonia was the coolest bunkering I'd seen on a course in Wisconsin; MCC's are right up there, perhaps exceeding that of Lawsonia.

-- As for the greens, there are some noticeable differences. You don't see anything quite as bold at MCC as that wonderful, triple-plateau green on the 8th at Ozaukee, or something with the imagination of that big hump Langford and Moreau put into the 15th (?) green. MCC's greens lack large, internal contours, of the sort that Langford was well-known for. The greens are more like plates, tilted in one direction, often from back to front, sometimes back-to-front and toward (or away from) a bunker. The tie-ins between the greenside bunkers and greens at MCC are quite good, with a real sense that golfers had to make sure they got out of the bunkers, or risk going back in them, or, conversely, playing too bold a shot and risk balls running into greenside bunkers maintained in a way to accept them. The players at the Mid-Am really seemed to rave about the greens, particulary the notion that they were "true" and putts stayed on the lines where they were struck. The difficulty I saw in players with putting was a) speed (they were stimping above 12 for the Mid-Am); and b) accounting for the broad, general tilt of the green in selecting a line. There is very little of what one might call "goofy" putting at MCC, of the sort you would find on greens with bolder contours.

-- Langford was known for very good par 3s, and the set at Ozaukee is very good. But I'd rate the par 3s at MCC as excellent -- good variety, very demanding, and great use of the terrain to add difficulty and uncertainty to the shots. Having said that, I think the par 5s at Ozaukee compare favorably with those at MCC (the two par 5s at MCC that played as par 4s for the Mid-Am strike me as very good-to-outstanding par 4s, and hold more interest than played as par 5s).
« Last Edit: September 18, 2008, 10:30:47 AM by Phil McDade »

JohnV

Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #19 on: September 18, 2008, 10:33:53 AM »
Doug:

On #3, the Mid-Am winner (Steve Wilson) hit a huge slice toward the woods on the right, and even hit a provisional in case it went OB. Interestingly, that right side of the course (there is a fence a few feet into the woods right of the green) wasn't staked as OB. Wilson found his ball, somehow (in a ruling that -- while I don't question it -- I was curious about...) got two clubs relief no closer to the hole, and made a remarkable up-and-down for par that played a big factor in the match, as Mitchell couldn't convert for a birdie from in front of the green. I like the hole, because the tee shot is a little uncomfortable (you really can't see the fairway that opens up beyond the first fairway bunker left), and the hole does tighten up as you get closer (that big pine tree 75 yards short of the green hugging the right side of the fairway would really seem to steer folks left toward that left fairway bunker that also sits about the same distance from the green). But, I also can't help but think the 3rd does feel a bit different than the others, and am not surprised it was one of the two holes redone by the club.

I was the official in the bushes who found his ball.  With the help of the referee, he declared the ball unplayable and dropped within two club-lengths no nearer the hole with a stroke penalty.  It was a great up-and-down for 5 and when his opponent, who was in the tongue between the two greenside bunkers in 2, couldn't get up-and-down, got a half on the hole, which I think was a great momentum saver for Wilson.

Phil McDade

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #20 on: September 18, 2008, 10:40:04 AM »
Doug:

On #3, the Mid-Am winner (Steve Wilson) hit a huge slice toward the woods on the right, and even hit a provisional in case it went OB. Interestingly, that right side of the course (there is a fence a few feet into the woods right of the green) wasn't staked as OB. Wilson found his ball, somehow (in a ruling that -- while I don't question it -- I was curious about...) got two clubs relief no closer to the hole, and made a remarkable up-and-down for par that played a big factor in the match, as Mitchell couldn't convert for a birdie from in front of the green. I like the hole, because the tee shot is a little uncomfortable (you really can't see the fairway that opens up beyond the first fairway bunker left), and the hole does tighten up as you get closer (that big pine tree 75 yards short of the green hugging the right side of the fairway would really seem to steer folks left toward that left fairway bunker that also sits about the same distance from the green). But, I also can't help but think the 3rd does feel a bit different than the others, and am not surprised it was one of the two holes redone by the club.

I was the official in the bushes who found his ball.  With the help of the referee, he declared the ball unplayable and dropped within two club-lengths no nearer the hole with a stroke penalty.  It was a great up-and-down for 5 and when his opponent, who was in the tongue between the two greenside bunkers in 2, couldn't get up-and-down, got a half on the hole, which I think was a great momentum saver for Wilson.

John:

I kind of figured you were involved in this ruling, as you were the right-side "fore" official for the final match. If I may ask -- how did Wilson get two clubs relief no nearer the hole? I admittedly did not see his ball in the jungle there, but stood about 20 feet to his right (facing the green) when he made the drop. It seemed, from my angle, that Wilson would've had to come out of the jungle, and thus closer to the hole, to make his drop. Given the ruling, I assume that wasn't the case. Am I missing something? Or not taking into account where his ball was found, and its relation to the hole? Just curious, not trying to revisit a ruling or stir anything up. It was a terrific save by Wilson, and maybe the turning point of the match (I sort of got the sense that Mitchell had one of those "not my day" moments after Wilson sunk the par putt there.)

Lester George

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #21 on: September 18, 2008, 11:21:29 AM »
Nice looking course but an obvious victim of the tree planting committee.

Lester

Chuck Brown

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #22 on: September 18, 2008, 12:53:47 PM »
Do I get extra credit for knowing that that is Buddy Marucci striding on the 4th green?  (Center of photo, kahki pants and white shirt.) ;D

Ding ding ding! We have a winner....

Chuck:

Yes you do; that's also Buddy waiting, hand on club, in the fairway of the photo of the 3rd hole. His was one of the threesomes I followed in qualifying play.

The cool thing about Marucci: he was paired with the guy next to him -- white shirt with orange trim -- who was the lone qualifier for the Mid-Am from Alaska. The guy could hit it a ways, but obviously seemed to have never played a course quite like Milwaukee, and struggled a bit. Buddy could not have been nicer or more gracious to the young guy. A real sportsman.


Phil -

I talked to the guy from Alaska right after the round.  He was happy and thrilled to be there, and was having lots of fun.  (In answer to my question, "Is it fun, or is it more work, to do this, that is, play in a USGA national championship?" to which he answered, "Oh, no question, it is fun.  As much fun as I have ever had in golf.  And Buddy couldn't have been nicer.")  He said that he had a lot of trouble getting started on the back nine, as did Buddy.  I picked them up on the front nine (their second nine) and Buddy played exceptionally well, and the Alaska guy hit some really good shots that left him feeling good at the end of the day.

Interesting thing about that group was that their match referee was a MCC member.  A super-nice guy, who told me he played his winter golf at Calusa Pines.  Now that is nice duty.  MCC in the summer and Calusa in the winter.  Buddy Marucci told him to come over to Seminole this winter to play with him.

I also talked to Casey Baker here in Michigan (former state am champ) about his experience, making it to match play.  He said, in a conversation that included Pine Valley and Seminole, that MCC had just gone into his top five courses that he had played in competition.  He also said that he had been on the range next to Buddy Marucci, but did not know who he was.  As they were leaving, Casey's caddy said to him, "Do you know who that was next to you?" Casey said he didn't, and then his caddy told him, "Buddy Marucci."
« Last Edit: September 18, 2008, 12:56:04 PM by Chuck Brown »

D_Malley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #23 on: September 18, 2008, 08:40:35 PM »
http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr120/philmcdade/milwaukee%20cc/9-11-08MCC007-1.jpg
I love the way the fairway is cut leading onto the greens at MCC.  why isn't this feature used more???? 

Phil McDade

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Milwaukee Country Club -- pictorial essay
« Reply #24 on: September 19, 2008, 10:01:26 AM »
http://i475.photobucket.com/albums/rr120/philmcdade/milwaukee%20cc/9-11-08MCC007-1.jpg
I love the way the fairway is cut leading onto the greens at MCC.  why isn't this feature used more???? 


An interesting feature of the course is that, while most of the holes have openings into the green, the terrain directly in front of the greens is sometimes receptive to a running, low shot -- but sometimes not. Holes 1 and 2 offer a good contrast, with 1 being quite receptive to a low, recovery shot, while 2's green sits up quite a bit from the fairway and is therefore less receptive to that kind of shot.

I was struck in watching the Mid-Am how some greens with open approaches just shrugged off some attempts at low-running shots. Notably at holes like 2 and 18, the approach shot can be somewhat downhill -- from fairway to green -- but the area fronting the green is slightly uphill, as the greens are built up as plateaus. I saw one player in practice -- wind helping on his approach shot at 18, with the pin on the front, lower tier of the green -- try to hit a shot that bounced in front of the green and up toward the pin. He tried it three times, and each time the green approach "rejected" the shot, and sent it to a collection area just in front of the left greenside bunker. It's a nice, somewhat deceptive use of the land.