[Anthony Fowler]

As most of you already know, Perry Maxwell initially only built 9 holes at Prairie Dunes.  On today's course the initial 9 was 1-2, 6-10, and  17-18.  Years later Press came in and added on 3-5 and 11-16.  Moreover, the original 9 returns to the clubhouse 3 separate times.  This unique history and set of features creates a lot of short loops for the members if they only want to play a few holes.  By my calculations, there are 17 different possible loops that start at the clubhouse, end at the clubhouse, involve no long walks between holes, and do not repeat holes.  Do any other courses rival the number of loops at Prairie Dunes?  Is this a valuable feature in GCA, especially for regular member play?


Below I have explained my calculation of the 17 loops; only read if you are curious or would like to apply the same method to another course.

I broke the course up into 3 sections.  Holes 1-7, 8-9, and 10-18.  For holes 1-7 there are 3 possible states or sets of holes that you can play in your loop.  You can play none of the holes, all of the holes, or 1,2,6, and 7.  For holes 8-9, there are 2 states, play them or don't.  For 10-18, 3 states.  You can play all, none, or 10,17,and 18.  Since the state that you play for each section is independent, we can just multiply the number of states together: 3 * 2 * 3 = 18.  Since one of these combinations involves playing no holes, we must subtract one, and we get 17 possible loops at Prairie Dunes.

[Anthony Fowler]

picture of routing can be found here:

http://www.hutchchamber.com/community/g/prairie-dunes-course-map2.jpg

[Sean Leary]

I have not played 17 from 11 tee box (which is close to where Perry's tee box was on 17 originally). The walk from 10 green to present 17 tee isn't very close.

[D_Malley]

phila cricket old course has alot of interesting 3-6 hole loops that start and end at the clubhouse.

[David Stamm]

I think it's a great feature. When one only has time to play a few holes, it sure is nice to not have to worry about walking back a long distance. However, I wouldn't want the quality of the course or the sequencing to be compromised to make it work. It seems this obviously was not the case at PD.

[Ken Moum]

My home course, Shawnee CC in Topeka has loops of

1-9
1, 2, 3
1-5 + 9 (six and nine tees are side-by-side)
4,5, 9 (four tee is ~100 yards from the pro shop)
4-9

Since the seven green is about 25 yards from 13 tee, you can play:
1-7, 13-15
1-7 + 13-18

Because the the seventeen tee is ~50 yards from 14 green, you can skip 15 and 16
10-14, 17,18
1-7, 14, 17, 18

Since 7 tee is only ~80 yards from twelve green you can play:
10, 11, 12, 7, 8, 9
(Note that this loop played three times is 7,000 yards)

Since 15 green and 16 tee are near the clubhouse:
10-15
16-18

Finally, 10-18

And except for the 12 green, 7 tee walk, none of the loops involve more than about a 50-yard walk from green to tee.

Using your method, I can't come up with the possible combinations of these, but it's a bunch.

FWIW, the member play 1-3, 16-18, 4+5+9, 1-5+9 and 10-15 lot.

The skip from 14 to 17 is handy when there's a slow group on 15 and sunlight is fading.

But as far as I know, the only person to play the 7,000-yard course is a fellow who won the Kansas Am six times in eight years, and had one runnerup. He was 41 and 1 at match play in those seven events. He apparently used the 10-12, 7-9 loop as a tune-up.

K

[Anthony Fowler]

K,
Your course is a little more complicated than PD, but I used a similar method and from what you described I came up with 27 loops!

How does the routing work out in your opinion?  Do you feel crammed with so many intersections of holes or bored with 15 & 16 just going to the clubhouse and back?

I think it's amazing that PD achieves these loops without any sacrifice to the normal routing.  Sounds like Shawnee may do this as well.

David,
I couldn't agree more.

[Tim Bert]

At Vanderbilt Legends Club in Franklin, TN there are two courses.  While the only holes that return to the clubhouse on each course are 9 and 18, there are plenty of points where the two nines collide and allow for numerous alternate routes.

On the North course, #4 and #13 share the back tee and also have a joint fairway.  #8 and #14 tees are right next to each other.  These two crossing points allow for numerous options if you want them.  You could also go play #7 on the South course after #2 on the North course without much trouble if you were interested.

The South course is a bit less convenient to walk (though not difficult and I walk it regularly) just because 7 of the holes are on one side of a RR track and 11 are on the other side.  1,6,7,8,9,10, and 18 are on the same side of the tracks.  It would actually be easier to play 1 then 6 than it is to play 1 then 2.  1,6,7,8,9 is a fun 5-hole stretch which gives you 2 tough par 4s, and easier par 4, a par 5, and a par 3.  Because of the RR track crossing, you could easily choose to go from 1 to 11 or from 10 to 2 without adding any additional distance to the normal routing.  5 and 17 also return to the place where you cross the tracks, so upon completing either of those holes, you could choose to play 11 or 2 (on the same side of the tracks) or 6 or 18 (back on the other side of the tracks.)

In my quest to eliminate #10 South from existence, I've come up with my own consolidated 9 holes at the South course.  #1, 11, 12, 17, 2, 3, 4, 5, 18. That would probably have to be done late on a weekday afternoon, but I might try it some time.  You could pair that up with a consolidated North of some type, but I have trouble coming up with a routing that includes North #7, #11, and #17 - all of which I'd want included in my consolidated course.  The problem is #17, which is doesn't have a good connecting point, but is a must play short par 4.

Confusing enough?

[ANTHONYPIOPPI]

Anthony:

I mean this: get help.

I played the original 9 in order when writing my chapter on those holes for To the Nines. The original 17th tee is gone but I played from a sand mound that afforded the original angle calling for a left-to-right ball flight; much better than the straight tee shot Perry created.

Anthony

[Sean Leary]

Anthony P,

Is the angle from the back tee box on 16 similar to the original 17 tee shot?

[Ken Moum]

How does the routing work out in your opinion?  Do you feel crammed with so many intersections of holes or bored with 15 & 16 just going to the clubhouse and back?

I think it's amazing that PD achieves these loops without any sacrifice to the normal routing.  Sounds like Shawnee may do this as well.

Re. the cramped routing, it's actually not bad. it's on about 120 acres, and there's only one place on the course that routinely has balls coming in from another hole. (It's 12 tee, with balls coming off 14 tee, and they rarely, if ever actually land on the tee. They are usually out in fron the tee.)

You misunderstood the 15, 16 deal. Our 15 green is fairly near the clubbhouse as George Thomas recommended, and 16 plays out and away with 16,17, and 18 forming a triangle.

The routing isn't at all contrived feeling, except, perhaps for the fact that 6 and 9 tees are on one pad with a frew pine trees between them.

There's a flyover available on http://www.golfflyover.com/default.aspx (Shawnee Cc, Topeka, KS) so you can see how the routing works.  IMHO, it's efficiency, safety and enjoyment is one reason I have never doubted that it was routed by Ross. I have played dozens of Midwest courses on similarly small tracts and not one of them works as well as our does.

Ken

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