Sultan's Run or French Lick (Ross)

[Brian Joines]

Three Friends and I are going to stay at the French Lick Resort during the first weekend of September. We have enough time for three rounds in the immediate area. How would you split up those 3 rounds? Is there another course in the area that is worth playing besides Sultan's Run and the Ross course?

I've never played either and have heard great things about both. I'm interested in hearing which course you all prefer.

[Doug Ralston]

One each at Sultan's Run and French Lick Ross, and one across the river at Lafayette perhaps. All good, fun courses worth your time, though Lafayette is not by a well known GCA.

Doug

[John Mayhugh]

One each at Sultan's Run and French Lick Ross, and one across the river at Lafayette perhaps. All good, fun courses worth your time, though Lafayette is not by a well known GCA.

Doug

Doug,
Do you mean Lafayette in KY?  That's probably 80 or 90 miles from French Lick.  Beautiful setting, but I don't think the golf course would be worth the trip.  I would absolutely choose another round at the Ross course over Lafayette, even if the two courses were side by side.

Brian,
I'm set to play Sultan's Run for the first time this weekend.  Will let you know how it is.

[Bart Bradley]

Brian:

It will take at least two trips to really get the Ross course at French Lick...Play it twice and Sultan's once.  Just my opinion.

Bart

[Doug Ralston]

One each at Sultan's Run and French Lick Ross, and one across the river at Lafayette perhaps. All good, fun courses worth your time, though Lafayette is not by a well known GCA.

Doug

Doug,
Do you mean Lafayette in KY?  That's probably 80 or 90 miles from French Lick.  Beautiful setting, but I don't think the golf course would be worth the trip.  I would absolutely choose another round at the Ross course over Lafayette, even if the two courses were side by side.

Brian,
I'm set to play Sultan's Run for the first time this weekend.  Will let you know how it is.

John;

Lafayette is, IMHO, a course with very great potential. They have improved it a bit over the last couple years. The layout is good, the land, as you say, it high quality. They just need some subtle touches. Unfortunately, with travel as it is now, they are unlikely to get the money to upgrade much.

Still, I think it is a fun play. Better than any of the other S Indiana options I can think of. That said, I have not yet played Champion's Pointe and have heard good things.

I was trying to offer a third course. But if forced to choose, I prefer Sultan's Run to French Lick Ross.

Doug

[Chris_Clouser]

I personally think Sultans Run is a better course and at half the price is a better bargain.  I would do two at SR and one at French Lick.  Your other options in the area  are inferior.  John Kavanaugh might have something to say though about it as he is far more knowledgable about the area.  Other courses to see in the area would probably be the following.  If you don't want to drive more than 30 minutes, then I would say stick with those two.  If you want to go about an hour, you can get to Doak's Quail Crossing or Liddy's Cambridge.  But neither one is as good as Sultans or French Lick. 

[Andy Troeger]

Those are the only two courses in the area that I've seen. I've only played French Lick prior to the recent work done, but at that point in my mind it wasn't close, which was more a testament to the quality of SR than any lack at FL. Sultan's Run 2, French Lick 1.

[Eric_Terhorst]

Chris Clouser, when Sultan's Run has lasted >50 years, perhaps it can be compared with French Lick

I am generally a fan of Liddy's work, and Sultan's Run is good, but French Lick is pure unadulterated Donald Ross.  It has history, great challenge, architectural interest, beauty....

#13, a 240yd par 3, from #12


#11


#6


#14 looking back


#5

[PThomas]

just played the Ross yesterday....quite good .....and watch those slopes on the greens!

[Chris_Clouser]

Eric,

Since when does the length of time a course has existed matter whether it is a quality course or not.  If that mattered then Forrest Park would be among the best courses in Hamilton County.     Comments like that are exactly why some people get turned off by this site.   The credo of some people here literally should be that if the architect didn't die before 1955 then the course must be crap.

I love the Ross course.  So don't mistake that fact.  It is just my opinion  the course at Sultans Run is better and I am not the only one that sees it that way.  That does not mean I think the history of the course at French Lick is unimportant.  That course is the most historically significant in Indiana in my mind.  There is no denying that the course is a fine example of Ross' architecture, but let's not even pretend that it is in his top tier of efforts.  As for challenge and beauty, I would dare say that Sultans is the equal to the Ross course in both regards. 

As for what shapes my opinion, here is the short version.  Three of the par threes are extremely long and very penal to the lesser golfer and are essentially the same hole, although the 13th provides some visual variety, it is still 245 yards from tee to green and must clear a a hazard to get there.  The two par fives are just ok.  The par fours are the heart of the course, but some of those are very similar like 1, 3, 10, 18.  To be fair I love holes 2, 5, 11 and 12.  Plus when you factor in the price it is not as good a value as Sultans Run. 

I think the restored course is among the top 10 public access courses in the state and should be seen by anyone coming to the area, but stating anything beyond that is embellishing the facts.  I will give you this, I think the greens at French Lick are much more imaginative, but they border on the edge of reason as all of the slope and contour almost eliminates any real strategic elements at play.

[Paul Saathoff]

How did the 9 Hole Valley course at FL and accompanying practice facility turn out?  I worked for the group doing the construction there but left before any grass was put down.  I spent many a mornings wading through mud and water while there.  I'm sure it still sees its fair share of flooding.

[Andy Troeger]

A few photos of Sultan's Run taken at the end of October 2006.











In any case you really can't go wrong with those two gems. Eric's pictures make me want to see French Lick again, which I hope to do once the Dye course opens. Remember that Sultan's Run is probably half the price of French Lick give or take.

[Eric_Terhorst]

Eric,

Since when does the length of time a course has existed matter whether it is a quality course or not.  If that mattered then Forrest Park would be among the best courses in Hamilton County.     Comments like that are exactly why some people get turned off by this site.   The credo of some people here literally should be that if the architect didn't die before 1955 then the course must be crap.

Well, Chris you're ascribing beliefs to me that I certainly don't hold.  The point is the Ross design is timeless.  The routing and holes were restored for a reason (not just marketing hype), and will still be enjoyed 50 years from now.  At Sultan's Run, when I see seven tees on #2, and the unfortunate artificial mounding to the right of the fairway on #8 (as I recall), it places the course squarely in an era.  We'll see if it lasts--I hope it does, and I hope Brian uses one of his three rounds to see it. 

The par 5s at French Lick stand out in my memory--both sprawl across the property, and have well-placed fairway bunkers and highly sloped greens.  At Sultan's Run there is one shorter one I think on the front nine with some blindness that stands out in memory.

Your criticism of the similarity of a couple of the par 4s at FL is apt, but obviously doesn't diminish the experience for me.  The occasional target golf at Sultan's Run is certainly less to my taste.

As for the par 3s at French Lick, there are four tees.  Move up if you don't like the look from the Ross tees.

[John Kavanaugh]

The only reason I would drive the royal bitch of a drive from French Lick to Sutan's Run would be if there is a slow play issue at French Lick.  The great thing about Sultan's Run is that you should be able to play with very little notice and it is inexpensive.  Always check aeriation schedules this time of year as that may influence your decision.  If you have a late night at the casino ask yourself in you are interested in a 45 minute drive each way.  The bar at the Ross coures at French Lick is the best place at the resort to both eat and drink...a huge plus unless you have a fetish for overflowing cold cut sandwiches and strapping young German girls which are both staples at Sultan's Run.

If I was going with three friends I would not venture far from the resort.  The nine hole Bendelow course is very worthy of play much like Medinah #2.  Be sure and introduce yourself to the head pro at French Lick as a member and poster on GCA.  A tour of the new Dye course is far more interesting than any legal Southern Indiana road trip.

[Nick Pozaric]

I would say get in another round at French Lick if you can.  Its such a fun course and I guarantee after playing it the first time you will want another go around at some of those greens.  Also they have a wonderful clubhouse and if you are into it the casino is less than 5 minutes away

[Andy Troeger]

John,
What holes remain as part of the Bendelow 9? Do they keep it up better than they used to when it was the Valley 18? Its actually a neat setting for a course and very charming, even if most of the holes are 350 yard par fours.

Is that little par three up the hill still there? I loved/hated that hole depending on the day, with its little three tiered semi-blind green. It shouldn't have been a tough shot, but it ate people's lunch in the junior tournament they used to hold there.

[John Kavanaugh]

John,
What holes remain as part of the Bendelow 9? Do they keep it up better than they used to when it was the Valley 18? Its actually a neat setting for a course and very charming, even if most of the holes are 350 yard par fours.

Is that little par three up the hill still there? I loved/hated that hole depending on the day, with its little three tiered semi-blind green. It shouldn't have been a tough shot, but it ate people's lunch in the junior tournament they used to hold there.

Andy,

I have only toured the nine hole course with the pro on the way to look at the new Dye course.  It is wonderfully clean and reminds me much of Medinah #2 which may be the consumate Bendelow.  It is no longer the dog track of our days of youth.